Responsibility not to scare oncoming traffic
Discussion
standardman said:
All I am saying is any over taking involves additional risk, a driver swerving, being a t
t etc.
I recall a thread where the guys M3 had gone into Limp mode mid overtake.
I have a 2.8 Capri , serviced it with a new Rotor arm etc. Mid overtake it hit the Rev Limiter 400 rpm early, cough , splutter ,splutter. A "A safe overtake suddenly became more marginal.
What if someone comes along doing a 100 in the opposite direction as soon as you start ? Its amazing how much distance such a car can take.
Additional risk.
No driving is entirely without risk, all you can do is try and reduce the risk to a minimum whilst still making progress and enjoying the drive. Overtaking, when conducted properly, is no different to any other sort of driving. Not overtaking when it is safe and reasonable to do so can result in a queue of traffic, unnecessary obstruction and lead to a more dangerous situation. t etc.I recall a thread where the guys M3 had gone into Limp mode mid overtake.
I have a 2.8 Capri , serviced it with a new Rotor arm etc. Mid overtake it hit the Rev Limiter 400 rpm early, cough , splutter ,splutter. A "A safe overtake suddenly became more marginal.
What if someone comes along doing a 100 in the opposite direction as soon as you start ? Its amazing how much distance such a car can take.
Additional risk.
standardman said:
"making progress"
Can someone tell me what that actually means ? I see it mentioned time and time again and the conclusion I have come is it means one of the following.
1. Exceeding the speed limit
2. Driving like a tt
3. Tail gating anyone not exceeding the speed limit.
It is about achieving a decent average speed and reducing overall journey time, competently and without causing inconvenience, danger or alarm to others. It certainly should not include 2, or 3 above. Whether it necessarily involves (1) could be debated. Can someone tell me what that actually means ? I see it mentioned time and time again and the conclusion I have come is it means one of the following.
1. Exceeding the speed limit
2. Driving like a t
t3. Tail gating anyone not exceeding the speed limit.
standardman said:
"making progress"
Can someone tell me what that actually means ? I see it mentioned time and time again and the conclusion I have come is it means one of the following.
1. Exceeding the speed limit
2. Driving like a tt
3. Tail gating anyone not exceeding the speed limit.
Thats pretty much it a nutshell. It probably has some slightly less tCan someone tell me what that actually means ? I see it mentioned time and time again and the conclusion I have come is it means one of the following.
1. Exceeding the speed limit
2. Driving like a t
t3. Tail gating anyone not exceeding the speed limit.
ty original meaning but has become an excuse for people to seperate themselves from "dithery old folk" and excuse their driving.If you saw a pedestrian "making progress" walking through town, you'd assume he was a dick or very late for a bus
As already covered, the original meaning is "making best possible safe and legal progress" in a journey.
For example, not being content to sit behind the 40mph club, but actively looking for a safe and legal overtake without causing anyone to alter their speed and direction, or cause any alarm as to your driving.
For some time now, certain people have been using it as a pseudonym for speeds above permitted limit. These days I have as little respect for people using this phrase, with a few notable exceptions, as for people who are stupid enough to use the word leptons.
For example, not being content to sit behind the 40mph club, but actively looking for a safe and legal overtake without causing anyone to alter their speed and direction, or cause any alarm as to your driving.
For some time now, certain people have been using it as a pseudonym for speeds above permitted limit. These days I have as little respect for people using this phrase, with a few notable exceptions, as for people who are stupid enough to use the word leptons.
On the subject of a reluctance to overtake, here's a quick story from my commute this morning.
Leaving my home town, there's a bypass and one stretch of it is dead straight for well over half a mile, perfectly sighted with no junctions and a 50mph limit - a perfect overtake spot.
On my way out, nearing the end of the straight, I was at the tail end of a line of cars doing about 40mph. Coming towards me was a heavily-laden tractor and trailer, with a queue of cars behind it, doing less than 30. I checked my mirrors - nothing behind me, so I moved left in my lane to allow the first car behind the tractor to pull out a fraction earlier.
As I passed the tractor, I glanced in the mirrors again - still nothing behind me, but the first car behind the tractor didn't bother to overtake, so the second one didn't bother and in the end, the entire queue of traffic stayed behind the tractor for the entire length of the straight.
Although the first car in the queue was a Pug107, I reckon it still has enough power to get past a tractor, especially when there is nothing coming for at least half a mile. The fact that the driver chose to stay behind the tractor is simply poor driving, or a desperate lack of confidence.
Back on topic, because I have a quick car, I would easily have overtaken the entire queue from the back, but I imagine out of the dozen or so cars in the queue, many would have branded me as a nutter, simply for not having the patience to sit in a sub-30mph line of traffic.
Sad state of affairs that driving is now of such a low standard...
Leaving my home town, there's a bypass and one stretch of it is dead straight for well over half a mile, perfectly sighted with no junctions and a 50mph limit - a perfect overtake spot.
On my way out, nearing the end of the straight, I was at the tail end of a line of cars doing about 40mph. Coming towards me was a heavily-laden tractor and trailer, with a queue of cars behind it, doing less than 30. I checked my mirrors - nothing behind me, so I moved left in my lane to allow the first car behind the tractor to pull out a fraction earlier.
As I passed the tractor, I glanced in the mirrors again - still nothing behind me, but the first car behind the tractor didn't bother to overtake, so the second one didn't bother and in the end, the entire queue of traffic stayed behind the tractor for the entire length of the straight.
Although the first car in the queue was a Pug107, I reckon it still has enough power to get past a tractor, especially when there is nothing coming for at least half a mile. The fact that the driver chose to stay behind the tractor is simply poor driving, or a desperate lack of confidence.
Back on topic, because I have a quick car, I would easily have overtaken the entire queue from the back, but I imagine out of the dozen or so cars in the queue, many would have branded me as a nutter, simply for not having the patience to sit in a sub-30mph line of traffic.
Sad state of affairs that driving is now of such a low standard...
True - I guess 30 year ago (when I was first driving and mostly biking) the roads were sufficiently clear (and under-policed) that it was fairly easy to make decent progress.
Nowadays, all it takes is one myopic octegenarian mono-speeder to leave A-road havoc in their wake for many miles.
Whatever happened to the Highway Code instruction of "if you don't want to overtake, leave room so that others can"?
Nowadays, all it takes is one myopic octegenarian mono-speeder to leave A-road havoc in their wake for many miles.
Whatever happened to the Highway Code instruction of "if you don't want to overtake, leave room so that others can"?
"Although the first car in the queue was a Pug107, I reckon it still has enough power to get past a tractor, especially when there is nothing coming for at least half a mile. The fact that the driver chose to stay behind the tractor is simply poor driving, or a desperate lack of confidence."
Problem is with overtaking Tractors they have a nasty habit of turning into entrances IE Fields that you cannot sometimes see, combined with the fact that rarely do they go far.
There are certain roads I know if I don't pass a car its the last decent opportunity for 10 miles. How many times though have we overtaken a car with possibly less margin than we would like only for it to turn off.
Problem is with overtaking Tractors they have a nasty habit of turning into entrances IE Fields that you cannot sometimes see, combined with the fact that rarely do they go far.
There are certain roads I know if I don't pass a car its the last decent opportunity for 10 miles. How many times though have we overtaken a car with possibly less margin than we would like only for it to turn off.
I see your point, but in this case, the road is SO straight and SO clear that even a milkfloat could have performed a safe overtake
Google street view for the section of road in question
Imagine how it would look without the blue 3-series Touring coming the other way - the end of the straight is JUST visible at the vanishing point of the Google image. How anyone wouldn't overtake a tractor down there is beyond me - there are no turnings of any kind, even for fields.
Google street view for the section of road in question
Imagine how it would look without the blue 3-series Touring coming the other way - the end of the straight is JUST visible at the vanishing point of the Google image. How anyone wouldn't overtake a tractor down there is beyond me - there are no turnings of any kind, even for fields.
standardman said:
" How many times though have we overtaken a car with possibly less margin than we would like only for it to turn off.
How many times has one failed to anticipate and conduct an overtake when it would have been safe to do so, only to be stuck without a safe opportunity to overtake for 10 miles? I suspect this happens to a lot of motorists who later on, out of frustration, perform a risky manoeuvre. Looking out for side turnings and gaining co-operation from the overtakee(s), be they tractors or otherwise, is part of the skill. I am not professing to be perfect at this - far from it, but it is something worth practicing and receiving expert driver training on to improve safety, progression in traffic and reduce unnecessary obstruction. Overtaking should not be viewed as this "highly dangerous" activity only performed by boy racers and maniacs, rather an important skill. In my opinion!
Interesting thread.
Just to make sure I understand the majority opinion here:
I happen to drive a Porsche 996 Turbo S. When overtaking with oncoming traffic, I should only take opportunities that I could perfectly safely have taken in a Fiesta 1.1? That way the oncomer is confortable and doesn't feel compelled to dab his brakes. Right?
Just to make sure I understand the majority opinion here:
I happen to drive a Porsche 996 Turbo S. When overtaking with oncoming traffic, I should only take opportunities that I could perfectly safely have taken in a Fiesta 1.1? That way the oncomer is confortable and doesn't feel compelled to dab his brakes. Right?
If more people overtook then everybody would be happy with it as the norm and may even assist the overtaker by driving closer to the kerb et cetera. The driving standard over here is chronic. Go to northern Europe and things improve.
If I am not in a hurry and someone is tailing me too close I pull over and let them pass. I go through a process of slowing down to 30 - 20 and even then people are reluctant to overtake. Some morons think puting their fog lights on or dabbing the brake pedal is the answer. Look at the imbeciles on the motorway that drive in the middle lane and will not use the inside lane. In heavy traffic or average speed areas I usually pop into the inside lane - usu the least busy.
If there is space for an overtake and I fancy overtaking I do so.Overtaking is NOT wrong - just do it!!!!
Pip
If I am not in a hurry and someone is tailing me too close I pull over and let them pass. I go through a process of slowing down to 30 - 20 and even then people are reluctant to overtake. Some morons think puting their fog lights on or dabbing the brake pedal is the answer. Look at the imbeciles on the motorway that drive in the middle lane and will not use the inside lane. In heavy traffic or average speed areas I usually pop into the inside lane - usu the least busy.
If there is space for an overtake and I fancy overtaking I do so.Overtaking is NOT wrong - just do it!!!!
Pip
Pip1968 said:
The driving standard over here is chronic. Go to northern Europe and things improve.
Pip
Your evidence?Pip
Ten years old but would suggest otherwise.
http://www.eurorap.org/library/pdfs/roaddesignfact...
7mike said:
Unless you are in Sweden, which if my geography is correct, is in Northern Europe.
Gassing Station | Advanced Driving | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff