Indicate left after overtaking, or lane change on a motorway

[Turn7]

nonsequitur said:

I think Turn7 was saying moving forward without the necessity for an indication. I knew what he meant anyway.

As in all threads concerning indication, many PHers saying why they don't indicate, when it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

Agreed on both counts.....

[Dixy]

nonsequitur said:

I think Turn7 was saying moving forward without the necessity for an indication.

There are 2 cars on a motorway you and 1 other. You have safely just passed the other and are well clear, where else are you going to go? you are moving forward without the necessity for any indication.
Is it informative could it be misleading?

[Lily the Pink]

nonsequitur said:

... it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

So you put some thought into it, but always get the same result ... so it's not really calculated, is it - it might as well be automatic without any thought behind it ?
If you're on a slip road, joining an empty motorway/dc, do you indicate regardless ?

[nonsequitur]

Lily the Pink said:

nonsequitur said:

... it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

So you put some thought into it, but always get the same result ... so it's not really calculated, is it - it might as well be automatic without any thought behind it ?
If you're on a slip road, joining an empty motorway/dc, do you indicate regardless ?

1) The same result, an indication, but the approach, road layout, signage and traffic flow are always different.

2) Yes. I would think and calculate that I am joining a high speed carriageway, and would need to show what I am doing next. Regardless of the traffic flow.

Still not sure that you get it.

[nonsequitur]

Dixy said:

nonsequitur said:

I think Turn7 was saying moving forward without the necessity for an indication.

There are 2 cars on a motorway you and 1 other. You have safely just passed the other and are well clear, where else are you going to go? you are moving forward without the necessity for any indication.
Is it informative could it be misleading?

As you probably know from experience Dixo, an overtaking car on a DC / MW often stays in the same lane for no apparent reason, and stays there even if lane one is traffic free. Crazy, but that's modern motoring. My left signal is a positive indication that I am moving back following an O/T.
Let us let everone know what we are doing next.

Edited by nonsequitur on Saturday 20th July 16:55

[Dr Jekyll]

nonsequitur said:

Lily the Pink said:

nonsequitur said:

... it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

So you put some thought into it, but always get the same result ... so it's not really calculated, is it - it might as well be automatic without any thought behind it ?
If you're on a slip road, joining an empty motorway/dc, do you indicate regardless ?

1) The same result, an indication, but the approach, road layout, signage and traffic flow are always different.

2) Yes. I would think and calculate that I am joining a high speed carriageway, and would need to show what I am doing next. Regardless of the traffic flow.

Still not sure that you get it.

I certainly don't get it. If it's empty there may not be anyone to show anything to. Secondly even if there is traffic, it's very often perfectly obvious what you're going to do next.

[waremark]

nonsequitur said:

As in all threads concerning indication, many PHers saying why they don't indicate, when it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

I understand that your signalling is carefully calculated. For most people who signal it isn't. Do you understand that for those of us who believe in only signalling if it will be useful that is also carefully calculated?

[Turn7]

nonsequitur said:

My signal is a positive indication that I am moving lanes
Let us let everone know what we are doing next.

Exactly....

[InitialDave]

waremark said:

I understand that your signalling is carefully calculated. For most people who signal it isn't. Do you understand that for those of us who believe in only signalling if it will be useful that is also carefully calculated?

But a lot of people who don't always signal, don't signal because they're dozy bds, yet people aren't saying "well, if you sometimes don't indicate, it's clearly just because you're a dozy bd too". What irritates people who believe it's often better to signal anyway when not "needed" is the false correlation, made by people who choose not to signal in that scenario, that this decision to signal is somehow evidence of poorer observation. It's nonsense, it's only the fact that you have to manually hit the switch that even makes it a debate, you don't see people bhing about how their brakelights not having an off switch means they're "unnecessarily" signalling their braking when no-one's around to see it.

Signalling vs not signalling when it's not strictly necessary is really just a matter of opinion thing, there's value in both philosophies. As long as you're paying attention to your driving and your choice of indication stems from an assessment of "what best signals my intentions to those around me?", I don't regard there being a definite right or wrong to it.

[Dixy]

Turn7 said:

nonsequitur said:

My signal is a positive indication that I am moving lanes
Let us let everone know what we are doing next.

Exactly....

So same scenario as before but to your left is the second countdown marker for an exit, how does the car behind know whether you are returning to lane 1 or a muppet leaving the motorway.

[7mike]

And in other news; my dad/grandad/mum/driving instructor/ IAM observer/ police mate (delete as appropriate) told me that indicators tell me nothing more than the bulb is working

[Turn7]

Dixy said:

Turn7 said:

nonsequitur said:

My signal is a positive indication that I am moving lanes
Let us let everone know what we are doing next.

Exactly....

So same scenario as before but to your left is the second countdown marker for an exit, how does the car behind know whether you are returning to lane 1 or a muppet leaving the motorway.

Returning to lane - short sequence, leaving the MW - keep flashing until your into the slip.....

[Dixy]

7mike said:

And in other news; my dad/grandad/mum/driving instructor/ IAM observer/ police mate (delete as appropriate) told me that indicators tell me nothing more than the bulb is working

Lamp, bulbs grow in to daffodils.

[meatballs]

The obvious answer is to buy a BMW and elevate yourself above this indicator madness

[silverfoxcc]

nonsequitur said:

1) The same result, an indication, but the approach, road layout, signage and traffic flow are always different.

2) Yes. I would think and calculate that I am joining a high speed carriageway, and would need to show what I am doing next. Regardless of the traffic flow.

Still not sure that you get it.

Non

The ue of an indicator is to advise people on what you intend to do.

You are coming up a slip road. If it isn't your intention to join the main carriageway then WTF are you doing there?

[meatballs]

silverfoxcc said:

Non

The ue of an indicator is to advise people on what you intend to do.

You are coming up a slip road. If it isn't your intention to join the main carriageway then WTF are you doing there?

They know you will be trying to merge on, but not when or where. You indicate too early and the car you are intending to go behind my slow down. You don't indicate at all and the car you are intending to go inront of closes the gap because you haven't been clear about your intentions.

Also some slip roads becom a live lane. Many drivers won't have paid attention to any merge signs and may not be aware, especially with some of the longer slip roads where the end is not visible.

[nonsequitur]

Dr Jekyll said:

I certainly don't get it. If it's empty there may not be anyone to show anything to. Secondly even if there is traffic, it's very often perfectly obvious what you're going to do next.

Absolutely nothing is obvious where driving is concerned. PHers know from the various 'bad driving' threads that this is so.

[nonsequitur]

waremark said:

nonsequitur said:

As in all threads concerning indication, many PHers saying why they don't indicate, when it is so simple to actually indicate. Not by rote but a calculated move with thought behind any decisions.

I understand that your signalling is carefully calculated. For most people who signal it isn't. Do you understand that for those of us who believe in only signalling if it will be useful that is also carefully calculated?

Of course. But on PH, constant indicators are often dismissed as mindlessly signalling at every opportunity, like you are in trance. We know that this is not the case.

Edited by nonsequitur on Saturday 20th July 18:58

[nonsequitur]

Dixy said:

So same scenario as before but to your left is the second countdown marker for an exit, how does the car behind know whether you are returning to lane 1 or a muppet leaving the motorway.

Let's not be silly. In that situation, close to an exit, I would stay in lane two following an O/T, then move over, indicating, to lane one when the exit slip has passed. (This will only be a matter of seconds).

[Dr Jekyll]

nonsequitur said:

Dr Jekyll said:

I certainly don't get it. If it's empty there may not be anyone to show anything to. Secondly even if there is traffic, it's very often perfectly obvious what you're going to do next.

Absolutely nothing is obvious where driving is concerned. PHers know from the various 'bad driving' threads that this is so.

If it's not obvious from the fact that you are on an entry slip, I don't think an indicator is going to make it more so.