Sitting at junctions/lights with the foot brake on

[mickyh7]

donkmeister said:

It even predates electric parking brakes. 2001 is the first system I'm familiar with, Mercedes/Bosche Sensotronic which includes "Hold" and "Stop" features.

My E-Class was built with Sensotronic and an old fashioned foot-operated parking brake pedal, way back in 2004. No green P though, that might be a VAG thing.

Again I'll mention my Audi has an auto hold/brake.
It puts a green light on in the dash, but DOES NOT leave the brake lights on.
It's different to hill assist and electric handbrake, using residual pressure in the braking system.
If anyone does come up from behind at speed, I just touch my brake pedal to light things up.
Seems a lot better system than blinding everyone!

[Cyder]

mickyh7 said:

donkmeister said:

It even predates electric parking brakes. 2001 is the first system I'm familiar with, Mercedes/Bosche Sensotronic which includes "Hold" and "Stop" features.

My E-Class was built with Sensotronic and an old fashioned foot-operated parking brake pedal, way back in 2004. No green P though, that might be a VAG thing.

Again I'll mention my Audi has an auto hold/brake.
It puts a green light on in the dash, but DOES NOT leave the brake lights on.
It's different to hill assist and electric handbrake, using residual pressure in the braking system.
If anyone does come up from behind at speed, I just touch my brake pedal to light things up.
Seems a lot better system than blinding everyone!

Interesting, I was sure that wasn’t legal because the wording of the regs in my understanding was that the brake lights must stay on unless a manual additional process is applied (physically pressing pkb/pulling handbrake).

But it’s been a while since I last looked at those regs.

[Blakewater]

Cyder said:

mickyh7 said:

donkmeister said:

It even predates electric parking brakes. 2001 is the first system I'm familiar with, Mercedes/Bosche Sensotronic which includes "Hold" and "Stop" features.

My E-Class was built with Sensotronic and an old fashioned foot-operated parking brake pedal, way back in 2004. No green P though, that might be a VAG thing.

Again I'll mention my Audi has an auto hold/brake.
It puts a green light on in the dash, but DOES NOT leave the brake lights on.
It's different to hill assist and electric handbrake, using residual pressure in the braking system.
If anyone does come up from behind at speed, I just touch my brake pedal to light things up.
Seems a lot better system than blinding everyone!

Interesting, I was sure that wasn’t legal because the wording of the regs in my understanding was that the brake lights must stay on unless a manual additional process is applied (physically pressing pkb/pulling handbrake).

But it’s been a while since I last looked at those regs.

I've never driven a VAG car with auto hold, but BMWs keep their brake lights on when you take your foot off the brake pedal.

[Pica-Pica]

Blakewater said:

I've never driven a VAG car with auto hold, but BMWs keep their brake lights on when you take your foot off the brake pedal.

Be more specific.

[Ron240]

Blakewater said:

I've never driven a VAG car with auto hold, but BMWs keep their brake lights on when you take your foot off the brake pedal.

If the brake lights are illuminated without foot being on the brake pedal, then a (selectable) Hold function is in operation.

[Peter3442]

Some kind of auto hold on automatics goes back to the 1950s. In those days, they called it anti-creep. It maintained some pressure in some of the brake lines after the foot brake was released. I don't know if it turned the brake lights on.

[mickyh7]

Peter3442 said:

Some kind of auto hold on automatics goes back to the 1950s. In those days, they called it anti-creep. It maintained some pressure in some of the brake lines after the foot brake was released. I don't know if it turned the brake lights on.

That's what I have.
It does not turn on my brake lights though.

[RB Will]

Apologies to anyone stuck behind me doing this. I do my best to put things in neutral and stay off the brakes but can’t help it on any slopes.
The Cerb had a handbrake that even if it were applied by Hercules himself would struggle to keep it from rolling away in a light breeze never mind on a hill.
My Ram has a foot operated one, which while fine used with an auto is nigh on impossible with a manual, which mine is.
The Nomad doesn’t even have a handbrake of any description!

So don’t pull up close behind me on a hill!

[Volvolover]

tonycordon said:

I don't think I'm alone in this, I find the brake lights of cars in front at junctions/queues annoying/dazzling, especially at night. I realise that many are employing their car's stop/start 'economy device' but still feel that it's just mindless, what's wrong with the handbrake? I think it's largely the fault of the engineers who created the start/stop.

My handbook in my last two cars recommends holding in the foot brake in D in queues at traffic lights. Both auto’s (torque converters)

If you don’t like the brake light don’t look directly at it… like the sun

[The Mad Monk]

tonycordon said:

I don't think I'm alone in this, I find the brake lights of cars in front at junctions/queues annoying/dazzling, especially at night. I realise that many are employing their car's stop/start 'economy device' but still feel that it's just mindless, what's wrong with the handbrake? I think it's largely the fault of the engineers who created the start/stop.

1. You are too close.

2. Possibly not close enough, so that the lights are below the level of your bonnet.

3. Don't look at the lights.

4. There is something wrong with your eyes.

[Ron240]

Volvolover said:

If you don’t like the brake light don’t look directly at it… like the sun

That is a rather silly comparison because brake lights are simply annoying, they are not capable of damaging your vision.

The fact remains that at night in the rain sitting immediately behind a vehicle with all 3 brake lights blazing is very irritating and cannot easily be ignored.

[Volvolover]

Ron240 said:

Volvolover said:

If you don’t like the brake light don’t look directly at it… like the sun

That is a rather silly comparison because brake lights are simply annoying, they are not capable of damaging your vision.

The fact remains that at night in the rain sitting immediately behind a vehicle with all 3 brake lights blazing is very irritating and cannot easily be ignored.

Tell the manufacturers then

And if it’s THAT annoying, just leave a gap. If you can’t leave enough room for it not to be annoying then get a driver

[Volvolover]

Ron240 said:

Volvolover said:

If you don’t like the brake light don’t look directly at it… like the sun

That is a rather silly comparison because brake lights are simply annoying, they are not capable of damaging your vision.

The fact remains that at night in the rain sitting immediately behind a vehicle with all 3 brake lights blazing is very irritating and cannot easily be ignored.

It’s not silly at all, the sun is permanent so you HAVE to learn to look away….it can’t be that hard to then ignore something that can’t damage your eyes can it

[Ron240]

Volvolover,
You seem to have it all figured out...I wish I was a perfect driver like you.

[Volvolover]

Ron240 said:

Volvolover,
You seem to have it all figured out...I wish I was a perfect driver like you.

You’re making things up. Where did I say anything like that?

[Ron240]

Volvolover said:

You’re making things up. Where did I say anything like that?

Well you were quick enough to point out the flaws in my driving so I figured you must be perfect.

[Volvolover]

Ron240 said:

Volvolover said:

You’re making things up. Where did I say anything like that?

Well you were quick enough to point out the flaws in my driving so I figured you must be perfect.

I never mentioned your driving.


We were taking about when you were stopped ;-)

[Ron240]

Volvolover said:

I never mentioned your driving.

Oh really...?

Volvolover said:

And if it’s THAT annoying, just leave a gap. If you can’t leave enough room for it not to be annoying then get a driver

Seems very much like you are telling me how to go about my driving there.
Would you like me to hand you a spade so that you can dig yourself a deeper hole?

I see no point in prolonging this line of discussion any further, so let's just agree to disagree.

[Volvolover]

Ron240 said:

Volvolover said:

I never mentioned your driving.

Oh really...?

Volvolover said:

And if it’s THAT annoying, just leave a gap. If you can’t leave enough room for it not to be annoying then get a driver

Seems very much like you are telling me how to go about my driving there.
Would you like me to hand you a spade so that you can dig yourself a deeper hole?

I see no point in prolonging this line of discussion any further, so let's just agree to disagree.

Happily Ron

If you’re stopped you’re not driving ;-)

[waremark]

There are other things I find so much more dazzling than brake lights (which don't bother me). Those of you who find brake lights a problem, how do you cope with oncoming headlights or emergency vehicle blue lights at night? I use what the manufacturers offer - in this connection a brake hold facility which keeps the brake lights illuminated and the engine off.