Is overtaking a lost art?

[TheWidget]

I was out on a drive in the Yorkshire Dales / North Pennines in September and had at least three cars pull aside or slow down for me, which was unexpected, but nice. They must be used to faster cars in that area.

Not always the most clued up though. One of them slowed right down as we were approaching the brow of a hill and were then probably bemused while we both crawled at 20mph on a NSL road until the downhill section started.

[RedAndy]

johnao said:

No, not if you are observing, anticipating and planning effectively. Knowledge that the layout of the unseen road ahead may facilitate an overtake is of no consequence and can be a distraction. When you arrive at the “known overtake opportunity” there may be an oncoming vehicle, pedestrians in the road, cyclists in front of the overtakee, the overtakee may increase speed, or there may be a parked vehicle which impedes a potential overtake, amongst a myriad of other possible reasons not to execute an overtake.

But me being ready to overtake does not mean I overtake.

[Solocle]

TheWidget said:

I was out on a drive in the Yorkshire Dales / North Pennines in September and had at least three cars pull aside or slow down for me, which was unexpected, but nice. They must be used to faster cars in that area.

Not always the most clued up though. One of them slowed right down as we were approaching the brow of a hill and were then probably bemused while we both crawled at 20mph on a NSL road until the downhill section started.

It's quite like that in the Highlands too.

Ahh, the world of singletrack A roads...

[hothatch1.6]

I had someone pull over for me on the road to my house, fairly twisty NSL, single carriageway, people either do 60 like me or 30. Said chap was in the 30 brigade, instead of pulling over to the near side he pulled onto the wrong side of the road (just before a bend!). I naturally stopped thinking what was going on then a odd 5 seconds of gesturing before I carried on, odd.

[MKnight702]

hothatch1.6 said:

I had someone pull over for me on the road to my house, fairly twisty NSL, single carriageway, people either do 60 like me or 30. Said chap was in the 30 brigade, instead of pulling over to the near side he pulled onto the wrong side of the road (just before a bend!). I naturally stopped thinking what was going on then a odd 5 seconds of gesturing before I carried on, odd.

Yep, I am not sure it's just overtaking that's a lost art, I think driving is also heading that way. For some "drivers" on the road, self driving cars can't come soon enough. There are too many 'vehicle operators' (no-one could accuse them of driving) that have no idea what is going on further away than the shiny badge in the centre of the steering wheel. The other day I was driving through town, there were two cars behind me and behind them was an ambulance with the lights and siren going. I spot a safe place for the ambulance to pass all of us, indicate and pull over. Moron behind me then decided to swerve out round me at the last minute, directly into the path of the overtaking ambulance.

[LukeBrown66]

I would happily hand over driving in rush hour or in traffic to a bot, I loath it with a passion, it makes me laugh seeing people in expensive performance cars that are only likely to use them very infrequently on Britain's roads, it cannot come soon enough for me.

[nismo48]

otolith said:

It does happen. More likely to happen, I suspect, if the person being overtaken thinks your car is too humble to dare overtake them, and more likely to be noticed if you don't have enough of an accelerative advantage to negate it.

Agree..happens quite often here in Spain on the Andalucian roads !!

[MKnight702]

LukeBrown66 said:

I would happily hand over driving in rush hour or in traffic to a bot, I loath it with a passion, it makes me laugh seeing people in expensive performance cars that are only likely to use them very infrequently on Britain's roads, it cannot come soon enough for me.

I used to regularly see an R8 driving down the A14/M11 to Cambridge. They used to speed past me on the Huntingdon ring road (30mph limit) then once they reached the A14 they would pull immediately to the outside lane and their speed would max out at about 60mph (obviously, this being the A14 we rarely reached such dizzy heights), but on the M11 they would sit there in the right hand lane holding everyone up.

[Golfgtimk28v]

I was driving home, a road I have driven thousands of times. A bit wet not too cold, was dark so could use in coming lights as indicator of on coming cars.

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

The guy then put full beams on, 4 lights so I think added another set. It was very bright. Kept them on. I honestly don't know why. Had a slight road rage as the lights were blinding me and I slowed down, he overtook me , I beeped, then overtook later on and carried on.

But it felt like I had upset them very much by displaying such a reaction, just by overtaking them.

[whimsical ninja]

Golfgtimk28v said:

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

You came to two cars doing 50mph 20m apart (that's about a 1 second gap) and inserted yourself between them? Not surprised you got a reaction.

[MissChief]

whimsical ninja said:

Golfgtimk28v said:

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

You came to two cars doing 50mph 20m apart (that's about a 1 second gap) and inserted yourself between them? Not surprised you got a reaction.

I got a flash of the high beams from the front car of a two car train doing about 42 in a 50. Dead straight road, easily sighted for a mile or more. Any time I know I’m going for an overtake I put the 428i into Sport mode as this drops a gear or two whereas in Comfort it then has to kick down so it saves a little bit of time. The overtake was drama free, plenty of space and no danger whatsoever to them or me but I still got the full beams for a second or two. Strange people.

[Golfgtimk28v]

whimsical ninja said:

You came to two cars doing 50mph 20m apart (that's about a 1 second gap) and inserted yourself between them? Not surprised you got a reaction.

I didn't have my ruler sorry, they were spaced out I guessed 20 metres but a lot more than that.

There was zero justification for the reaction I did nothing illegal or "invading" space as you insinuated.

It is quite interesting and I sight I to your thinking as well, how you think it would justify not just a flash but leaving, high beams on.

Edited by Golfgtimk28v on Sunday 4th December 16:02

[Smollet]

I live near the Surrey Hills so there are plenty of cyclists about. I don’t have an issue with the vast majority tbh. I do have a problem with motorists who can’t, won’t overtake cyclists when they have a clear opportunity to do so. It’s even worse when there’s a solid white line. I dread to think what they do when coming across a stationary vehicle where a solid central white line is present.

[Caddyshack]

Golfgtimk28v said:

whimsical ninja said:

You came to two cars doing 50mph 20m apart (that's about a 1 second gap) and inserted yourself between them? Not surprised you got a reaction.

I didn't have my ruler sorry, they were spaced out I guessed 20 metres but a lot more than that.

There was zero justification for the reaction I did nothing illegal or "invading" space as you insinuated.

13th rule of road craft is ‘never forget your ruler’

[waremark]

Golfgtimk28v said:

I was driving home, a road I have driven thousands of times. A bit wet not too cold, was dark so could use in coming lights as indicator of on coming cars.

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

The guy then put full beams on, 4 lights so I think added another set. It was very bright. Kept them on. I honestly don't know why. Had a slight road rage as the lights were blinding me and I slowed down, he overtook me , I beeped, then overtook later on and carried on.

But it felt like I had upset them very much by displaying such a reaction, just by overtaking them.

I'm glad you thought about what you might have done to upset him. It sounds like either your lights dazzled him or he didn't think your overtake was safe.

Road rage even when quite mild obviously just makes everyone slightly less safe.

[911hope]

Golfgtimk28v said:

I was driving home, a road I have driven thousands of times. A bit wet not too cold, was dark so could use in coming lights as indicator of on coming cars.

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

The guy then put full beams on, 4 lights so I think added another set. It was very bright. Kept them on. I honestly don't know why. Had a slight road rage as the lights were blinding me and I slowed down, he overtook me , I beeped, then overtook later on and carried on.

But it felt like I had upset them very much by displaying such a reaction, just by overtaking them.

Was the second overtake as dangerous as the first?

20m gap. Your car is a 1/4 of that gap, so 1.5 car length gap in front and behind you. And needing to slow from the overtake to slot back in. Amazing you didn't cause a major accident. The first car you overtook probably saved the day by braking.

Edited by 911hope on Sunday 4th December 20:14

[Caddyshack]

911hope said:

Golfgtimk28v said:

I was driving home, a road I have driven thousands of times. A bit wet not too cold, was dark so could use in coming lights as indicator of on coming cars.

Came across two cars about 20 metres separated doing 50 mph. Overtook the first one, then came to a second one, a Kia Sportage, found safe place overtook.

The guy then put full beams on, 4 lights so I think added another set. It was very bright. Kept them on. I honestly don't know why. Had a slight road rage as the lights were blinding me and I slowed down, he overtook me , I beeped, then overtook later on and carried on.

But it felt like I had upset them very much by displaying such a reaction, just by overtaking them.

Was the second overtake as dangerous as the first?

20m gap. Your car is a 1/4 of that gap, so 1.5 car length gap in front and behind you. And needing to slow from the overtake to slot back in. Amazing you didn't cause a major accident. The first car you overtook probably saved the day by braking.

Edited by 911hope on Sunday 4th December 20:14

It probably wasn’t a 20m gap the poster just gave an incorrect measurement.

[Brassblaster]

Caddyshack said:

It probably wasn’t a 20m gap the poster just gave an incorrect measurement.

That's how I read it too... In fairness a lot of people are terrible at judging distances, so my natural assumption is that that's what the poster had done.

Frankly, too many drivers get irate over perfectly reasonable overtakes that the idea that the reaction was a result of the poster using an actual 20m gap (and so deserving to be prompted to reappraise their driving) seemed less likely than that yet another person on the road had lost their mind at the idea that anyone might want to drive faster than them... Especially when Socially Unacceptable Vehicles are involved - different standards seem to apply to drivers of such uninvolving vehicles as Qashqai's and Sportages.

[theplayingmantis]

Don't feed the troll

[Brassblaster]

I do think that "being overtaken" is a lost art as much as actually cracking on with reasonable overtakes...

It's become extremely rare, in my experience, for drivers treating it as their responsibility to be overtaken smoothly - if an accident occurs it'll probably be as much your problem as the overtaking car's problem, even if they're the one held responsible for it...
You have the ability to shrug off any perceived insult and assist that car in getting on with it by lifting off (or even braking gently, if you feel like they're not getting on with it quickly enough) so they're back on your side of the road promptly - it's very rare that they'll then hold you up, and you'll be able to go about your day as if it'd never happened.

Unfortunately too many (which is not to say "all", but as I said "too many") take an overtake to be inappropriate because they don't accept that anyone could want to drive faster than them (the clear evidence of said car having caught up to them on the open road seemingly lost on them) - worse, too many seem to be blissfully unaware that an overtake is even in progress until the overtaking car is alongside (but then we all know how poor general awareness on the road is)... Then you have the really bad ones that'll try their hardest to speed up and make an overtake unnecessarily uncomfortable (and on rare occasions stop it altogether).

People need to think about the differing needs of road users, especially in the current climate where some have a need to maximise the fuel efficiency of their driving whilst others are in a hurry - such a situation makes overtakes increasingly likely/necessary.

I can't stand the idea of giving over control of my vehicle to AI, but I can see where other posters are coming from when it comes to the idea of a lot of uninvolved drivers handing the controls over to more predictable AI.