Being Overtaken

[gordonb]

7db said:

TheKeyboardDemon said:

What 'signal' do you give?

Indicating left -- "I am turning or keeping left or pulling in to the left"

Waving the person past -- "I think I'm in a Yorkie advert, please ignore me"

In my experience, i have found the majority of people give this signal in wholly inappropriate places, approach to bends, crests etc, in a a position when you are in a following position and not a contact position.

While in contact position, it can be common up here for people to indicate left, to acknowlege their cooperation.

[TripleS]

TheKeyboardDemon said:

TripleS said:

I don't actually signal somebody to overtake, but I do often give a signal that means I am aware that they wish to overtake and am ready to co-operate.

In the event that the overtaker gets it wrong and there's a problem of some kind, I might feel some moral discomfort if I've issued some kind of invitation, but I don't see it amounting to a legal responsibility on my part.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

What 'signal' do you give?

I'm only asking as, if I were ever in a position to overtake you (like that's ever going to happen while I'm driving my Fiat Punto 1.2) and you gave me the 'signal' I'd need to know what to look for and of course be sure that it means what you intend it to mean.

One or two flashes of left indicator. You have to be careful about when and where you give the signal, to minimise the risk of it being misunderstood. It doesn't yet seem to be a widely recognised signal, but I think it will become better understood and I shall welcome that.

To those who disapprove of it (as they may also disapprove of the headlamp flash invitation) I would suggest that it engenders a better spirit of awareness and courtesy towards other road users, and this should be weighed against any dangers arising from misunderstandings.

It's like a lot of things; take care how you do it and it should do more good than harm.

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[gordonb]

TripleS said:

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Having had a 406 HDI (90bhp) i can agree completely. The most dangerous car ever to try and overtake in!

[TripleS]

gordonb said:

TripleS said:

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Having had a 406 HDI (90bhp) i can agree completely. The most dangerous car ever to try and overtake in!

Oh that's done my confidence a power of good!

But seriously, the 406 HDi 90 is not the most helpful vehicle when it comes to overtaking.

....and with all due respect to those who dislike the momentum overtaking technique, I don't feel happy about unnecessarily discarding any speed advantage I might have, and then spending ages looking to see if the overtake is 'on' - as by the time you've done that, even if it was OK to start with, it might not be if you just sit there long enough!

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[TheKeyboardDemon]

I was once taught that when driving if I see a car come up behind me and I want the driver to know that he can pass if he wants to, I should give 1 flash left, followed by 1 right then 1 left again. I was told this would let the approaching driver know you are aware and prepared for him to pass. I think most people would find that quite ambiguous and maybe even confusing. Indicating left or giving a couple of flashes left on a stretch where there is no junction coming up seems like something my father in law would do when he is lost and looking for somewhere to read his map or stop and call for directions. Also you said:

TripleS said:

It doesn't yet seem to be a widely recognised signal, but I think it will become better understood and I shall welcome that.

Suggesting that it might also be something that is ambiguous and/or confusing to most un-enlightened road users.

Lastly:

TripleS said:

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Do you really think so. It's not just the car it's also the driver, I still have a lot to learn yet I think I'm only a little better than the average test standard driver. I've never driven on a track, and know very little about real high speed driving, I bet the Stig could do a lap in your 406 faster than I could in my Punto, most likely even faster than I could in a Porsche GT3 (I'd like to put that to the test if you're reading this Stig!! Can someone let me borrow their GT3. )

Edited by TheKeyboardDemon on Wednesday 20th June 04:34

[gordonb]

TripleS said:

gordonb said:

TripleS said:

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

Having had a 406 HDI (90bhp) i can agree completely. The most dangerous car ever to try and overtake in!

Oh that's done my confidence a power of good!

But seriously, the 406 HDi 90 is not the most helpful vehicle when it comes to overtaking.

....and with all due respect to those who dislike the momentum overtaking technique, I don't feel happy about unnecessarily discarding any speed advantage I might have, and then spending ages looking to see if the overtake is 'on' - as by the time you've done that, even if it was OK to start with, it might not be if you just sit there long enough!

Best wishes all,
Dave.

When I had my 406, i was not enlightened as to my overtaking (i.e. contact/2sec gap, offside ->commit/accelerate) I could not contemplate such a manouver in my 406 unless you had a very very long straight, or a a car doing 40mph on its own or with a big gap. I therefore had to do overtakes with momentum. Pulled ok in 3rd to 55 ish, change to 4th and it died!!

Changed it last year for a Passat TDI. Huge differnce for only an extra 15bhp. Massive amounts of torque just where you need it! 3rd to 4th the pull is just continual.

Passat is returning nearly 50mpg on hilly twisty 40 mile commute.

Gordon

Edited by gordonb on Tuesday 19th June 23:46

Edited by gordonb on Tuesday 19th June 23:47

[GoldTrader]

The element of surprise when overtaking is a good way to keep the car being passed from helping you. So I usually do not give any signal to the obstruction.

Dave> What 'signal' do you give?

When I am out in the passing lane, say on a two lane blacktop road. When there is a car approaching, I have found they don't get so excited when I put the turn signal on to show them I intend to return to my original lane after getting around.

So I am signaling the car coming at me head on. Otherwise I don't even think about it. The important thing is car control. Keep both hands on the wheel, keep your eyes moving, get the big picture, leave yourself and out, adequate safety cushion etc.

[TripleS]

TheKeyboardDemon said:

I was once taught that when driving if I see a car come up behind me and I want the driver to know that he can pass if he wants to, I should give 1 flash left, followed by 1 right then 1 left again. I was told this would let the approaching driver know you are aware and prepared for him to pass. I think most people would find that quite ambiguous and maybe even confusing. Indicating left or giving a couple of flashes left on a stretch where there is no junction coming up seems like something my father in law would do when he is lost and looking for somewhere to read his map or stop and call for directions. Also you said:

TripleS said:

It doesn't yet seem to be a widely recognised signal, but I think it will become better understood and I shall welcome that.

Suggesting that it might also be something that is ambiguous and/or confusing to most un-enlightened road users.

Lastly:

TripleS said:

Oh BTW, your 1.2 Punto might be quite good enough to see off my 406 HD1.

Do you really think so. It's not just the car it's also the driver, I still have a lot to learn yet I think I'm only a little better than the average test standard driver. I've never driven on a track, and know very little about real high speed driving, I bet the Stig could do a lap in your 406 faster than I could in my Punto, most likely even faster than I could in a Porsche GT3 (I'd like to put that to the test if you're reading this Stig!! Can someone let me borrow their GT3. )

Edited by TheKeyboardDemon on Wednesday 20th June 04:34

I certainly wouldn't give L R L flashes to a following driver as an invitation for him to overtake. That would be confusing. One or two L flashes and no R flashes seems best to me. The L R L indicator flashes (sometimes known as an indicator wobble) are often used by a driver to say 'thank you' to the guy that's helped him with his overtake.

With regard to differences in car performance, I think we have to assume drivers of equal ability, otherwise the results will be misleading. I was simply recognising that the 406 HDi 90 doesn't have much in the way of acceleration, and I wouldn't be surprised to find that a 1.2 Punto would be quicker.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[TripleS]

gordonb said:

When I had my 406, i was not enlightened as to my overtaking (i.e. contact/2sec gap, offside ->commit/accelerate) I could not contemplate such a manouver in my 406 unless you had a very very long straight, or a a car doing 40mph on its own or with a big gap. I therefore had to do overtakes with momentum. Pulled ok in 3rd to 55 ish, change to 4th and it died!!

Changed it last year for a Passat TDI. Huge differnce for only an extra 15bhp. Massive amounts of torque just where you need it! 3rd to 4th the pull is just continual.

Passat is returning nearly 50mpg on hilly twisty 40 mile commute.

Gordon

Edited by gordonb on Tuesday 19th June 23:46

Edited by gordonb on Tuesday 19th June 23:47

I know what you mean about the Passat TDI. When I was doing my job of delivering new cars a couple of years ago, I sometimes drove the Passat TDI model as a return vehicle, and I found it to be appreciably stronger on acceleration than the 406 HDi.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[TripleS]

GoldTrader said:

The element of surprise when overtaking is a good way to keep the car being passed from helping you. So I usually do not give any signal to the obstruction.

Dave> What 'signal' do you give?

When I am out in the passing lane, say on a two lane blacktop road. When there is a car approaching, I have found they don't get so excited when I put the turn signal on to show them I intend to return to my original lane after getting around.

So I am signaling the car coming at me head on. Otherwise I don't even think about it. The important thing is car control. Keep both hands on the wheel, keep your eyes moving, get the big picture, leave yourself and out, adequate safety cushion etc.

Hiya GT,

I was only talking about this from the viewpoint of a driver about to be overtaken, not the one who is about to do the overtaking.

If you are the one doing the overtaking, I agree that a signal to an oncoming driver that you're going to promptly return to your own side of the road can be reassuring to him.

Best wishes all,
Dave.

[Ricky_M]

I've no problems with being overtaken, I get a little bit judgemental(call the a prick) if someone uses excessive speed, which is most of the time, as I drive on or near to the posted limit. But aslong as it does not affect me or anybody else, I'm not bothered.

I never directly someone to overtake, they should use there own judgement to do this. I'll move left to give someone a better view ahead, theres actually a single carriageway near me that you can overtake on without going on the other side of the road, I always stay left on this, I actually got an indicator wobble from a Volvo Driver from this!