Tamiya 1:12 McLaren MP4/6 Rebuild/Upgrade

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tr7v8 said:

NOt sure on the dizzy heights of F1 but all the race cars I've been involved in the weights are standard stick on ones with some duct tape across to stop them coming adrift. Also don't forget they'll be on the inside & outside of the rims & in different locations as it'll be for dynamic balance.

Yes, that's what I've seen on F1 cars too. I found a few pictures of the McLaren, and it's pretty much what I've ended up with. On the XJR9-LM I built (and on many F1 cars from the past), they seemed to use silver duct tape for some reason., even though teh wheels were black.

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Red Firecracker said:

I believe the silver is foil tape rather than gaffer, which has/could have a tendency to fray and then remove itself into the brake setup. I think your decals will look fine once they have had some dulling down.

Yes, I used BMF for the XJR9 to get that effect.

From what I remember the other tapes, such as on the McLaren were fibre reinforced, but a much finer weave than normal duct tape, and as you say a dull finish rather than gloss. Maybe a coat of matt will do the trick.

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MonkeySpanker said:

As an ex tyre fitter the weights look spot on although they're 'silver' lead in real life. Also the wheel balancing machine's can be set so all the weight goes inside the rim but I have to admit to not balancing many (any) F1 wheels. The silver tape's adhesive is a bit more heat resistant than that used on the gaffer/duct tape. Generally tape's used to temporarily hold the weight on so the position could be fine tuned before being stuck down. Keep up the excellent work

Thanks, yes I remember they were lead. I thought the colour wasn't worth worrying about becasue they'd be covered up with the tape. I wanted the block effect to show through the tape though, whcih is why I scribed the lines.

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Stripped and repainted the radiators. I was never happy with the Calsonic decals. This time I've left them off altogether. I tried to find a spray stencil, but to no avail. I think the hose connectores should be anodised purple, but since they won't be seen, and they lack any real detail I decided to repaint them as original. I also re-applied the decals to what I assume are oil heat exchangers, just so it'll at least be complete under the body. Even these simple assemblies will become models in themselves when I build the bare chassis. Loads of detail and refinement to be added.



Also managed to remove the harness fittings without damaging the fabric straps:



I'll Alclad them and spray some Tamiya Clear Blue on them - make a better job this time hopefully:

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Here are a few scanned pictures I took of Senna and Berger and the MP4/6 at the GoodYear test in June '91. I wish I'd have taken a few more!

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ferrisbueller said:

Apologies for the thread hijack but I'm struggling to find sponsor decals for the Senna JPS Lotus, Toleman, Ralt and McLaren. There are the odd set on eBay but I'm not keen on bringing things in from China or Hong Kong having had bad experiences in the past.

Can anyone point me in the right direction please?

If you're not already a member of the F1M forum , then I'd join and ask there. There are some knowledgable folks on there, both modellers and suppliers. I got a set of MP4/6 original Tamiya decals for 10 (to replace the one's I've stripped), plus the offer of some free Marlboro decals from a supplier. All within about an hour of putting a request on there.

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Fitted the TVF1 axles and wheel nuts. I coated the axles with Alclad Jet Exhaust, and the nuts with Polished Brass. It's worn of the sharp edges with handling, and looks more realistic. I've also hand written some notes on the tyres loosely based on my original, but changing "SM" to "AS". The "SM" was presumably Stefano Modena from my Jordan tyre.

They do look a bit glossy around the edges, I'll have to find a way of dulling the sidewalls a bit. I've used Humbrol gloss at 1:24 before, but not sure it is really OK for a larger scale. Even so, they are a huge improvement on my original effort:



Also repainted the harness buckles in Alclad Burnt Blue over Aluminium, or Aluminium for the tongues. The buckle, according to the Joe Honda book, was partially painted in gloss blue. I've used an old decal to represent the writing in the middle. I added some small rivets to the outside of the adjusters to represent the ends of the harness pins. The whole lot just needs a coat of satin clear. Unfortunately I seem to have lost one of the tonges in transit somewhere:

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IroningMan said:

How are you going to tackle the seam around the tyre tread now that you've fitted and painted them?

I generally spin them in a drill and use coarse emery paper - but that might wreck your work so far.

The real unused tyres had an identical mould line around them. Im going to get some labels to put on the carcass, and they will represent an unused "sticker set". For my previous xjr9 I ran the tyres on my belt sander on a majeshift axle. That worked well for used tyres.

ETA The tyres arent fixed, they are a perfect fit and dont need glue, they can easily be removed if necessary.

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Drove past the McLaren showroom in Milan yesterday after a bit of a night out. Unfortunately it was all a bit of a blur, but I'm pretty sure there was an MP4/6 (or maybe a 4/7) in the showroom. I didn't want to look all uncool by asking to stop for me to take some reference pictures for a model though...

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Enricogto said:

dr_gn said:

Drove past the McLaren showroom in Milan yesterday after a bit of a night out. Unfortunately it was all a bit of a blur, but I'm pretty sure there was an MP4/6 (or maybe a 4/7) in the showroom. I didn't want to look all uncool by asking to stop for me to take some reference pictures for a model though...

Yes, the have it.
Get in and ask for it, they will be more than happy to let you have a nosey.

Were you clubbing at Gattopardo?

No it was just a bar somewhere around Piazza Sempione (probably spelt wrong). I'm back home now so that's that. Nice to see the car though, I'd like to think it was one I saw back at Silverstone in '92!

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Someone from the F1M forum made me these excellent stencils for the radiator logos. It wasn't seen on all MP4/6 radiators, but I'll try it anyway since it does replicate the original kit decal (which looked rubbish):



I've not detailled these radiators at all, since it's a kerbside version. On the chassis version, all the hose connectors and fittings will be replicated. The Calsonic lettering is visible through the sidepod air exit when fitted.

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Stencils worked great. The matrices are now a bit dark becasue I had to re-apply the dark wash and some silver dry brush to make everything consistent. The next version will be perfect:

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A few more bits of CNC porn arrived from Thunder valley F1 this morning; electrical connectors for all three 1:12 cars, suspension bellcranks and pivots for the Ferrari 641:









Now the Tornado GR4 is done, and the paper trawler almost there, I can't wait to finish the MP4/6 rebuild and then get stuck into some serious model engineering on the FW14B and 641.

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This evening I picked up the another MP4/6. Again, as with the FW14B, only £90. This will be built as the "bare chassis" version to go alongside the one I'm currently rebuilding to be "kerbside":



It's a re-issue with no Good-Year logos, which is no problem since I've got a complete set of aftermarket decals. On good point is that I've now got a second set of "McLaren" logos, which I quite like.

I mentioned previously that the major issue I had with re-furbing my original engine cover was that when I originally built the model back in '99, I had to flat the paint back becasue of a mistake, and I'd accidentally flatted off one of the teardrops for the rear suspension. To my amazement, whe I looked at the new one, it also only had one teardrop. This casued considerable disbelief. The seller thought it might be a coincidence, and that the re-issues we made using a damaged mould. It turns out that the car should only have one teradrop, and it's for the throttle linkage, not the suspension:



All these years I've been kicking myself for being careless enough to damage the body so badly (and - luckily - putting off correcting it!), when it was right all along.

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couzens said:

Hurry up and get this finished!

I think we're talking years not months...

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Got to work on the engine cover and a few more body parts. I've removed all the old paint and filled and sanded the seams I didn't bother with last time. I also drilled out the body fastener positions so I can use more realsitic p/e parts. Then gave it an overall light abrasive rub over to give a key for the first guide coat of Tamiya Fine Surface Pirmer:



Strange how sometimes a coat of primer can be either a bit demoralising, or show unexpectedly good results. This one was much better than I expected; I think a lot of the errors I thought would get highlighted must have been just smoothed over bits of contrasting plastic/old paint. Now they are one colour, many of the apparent flaws disappeared:



Next job will be to flat and prime the rear wing parts, front endplates and the body panels around the rear suspension. I'll also drill out all the tiny holes in the endplates for the wing incidence adjustment bolts.

[dr_gn]

Grey guide coat corrections corrected, and final coat rubbed down with #1500 wet & dry:



Next is the first of the white primer coats.

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caterhamnut said:

Great thread to follow, as I am about to start the same kit.
As a great Senna fan, I'm keen to get it as good as I can.
Also lucky enough to have looked around McLaren a few times, so a few links there - so I have actually ended up buying quite a few McLaren kits (95% Tamiya 1/20) to work on - but of course this 1/12 kit is the highlight.

I've splashed out on the Thunder Valley detail parts as well (no issues with communication or purchase!)

So some great tips from 'Doc' here

I am sure I'll have some questions going forward...

I was modelling a bit in the UK years ago (Caterhams - obviously, but I'll do a new thread for that)
Amazing how much more 'stuff' is available now (decals, detail kits, die cut parts etc) a few years later!

I've got plenty of questions too...

The Thunder Valley stuff is very good, but having assembled the wheel spindles, there is quite a bit of "figure out for yourself how to build it" - as with any aftermarket stuff. The detail in the TV kits only amounts to a fraction af what's needed to build a true replica; dozens of small custom parts will need to be made. RB Motion used to do a fairly comprehensive kit, but unfortunately none currently.

[dr_gn]

So I primed the body with Tamiay white primer, and rubbed it down. I also drilled counterbores for p/e rivets that will replace the plastic bumbs that represented body fasteners:



The decanted some TS White into a container and degassed it. Into the airbrush and applied a few coats. This is where the inevitable trial and error kicks in:





Parts of the body (e.g. the nosecone) turned out great, but here you can see where the paint has dried before it hit the surface. It's basically a coat of dust. The larger particles are not stuck to the paint, they landed there after it had flashed off.

So I'll leave it a few days and flat it back before trying again, but holding the airbrush closer to the part, and applying more paint. I'm scared stiff of getting runs, but this is the result of being over cautious. In fact I'm wondering whether to just paint straight form the can at this scale. I got great results airbrushing decanted paint at 1:24 on the Jaguar XJR9, but this is a much bigger area to keep wetted with paint.

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caterhamnut said:

The painting/airbrushing scares me the most - mainly because of the amount of work getting it back to what it needs to be to start again!

I've only browsed through the TV parts - but I agree they could do with a few more instructions (with pics ideally!) - I don't have the equipment to drill the very precise holes (in terms of depth) needed on the wheels. I'm actually wondering whether I send my wheels (confession - I splashed out on the annodised ali ones from http://www.bestbalsakits.com, so I don't want to arse it up.

I'm also wondering about these cast parts you find in a lot of the detail kits.
They seem to require a lot of finishing - in SOME cases, what is the advantage of using these over some of the 'original' plastic parts - some of the metal parts have obviously been cast from the plastic parts anyway....?

Painting can be a pain in the arse. I won't bother re-priming this lot, just flat the errors back and re-spray it. Any orange peel can be T-Cut out once it's hardened.

The cast parts in the TV sets are, I'm almost sure, from moulds taken directly from the original plastic parts. The only advantage is that they can be polished, but with decent metal paint on plastic (e.g. Alclad II lacquers) the effect is hardly worth the bother.

Bestbalsa kits prices seem crazy. I remember them listing TV detail parts for massively more than you could buy them direct from Paul, even considering postage.

I think for the aluminium wheels you'd need a lathe to modify the wheels. You'll need to drill them for valve stems too. TBH, as with the cast parts, once the plastic wheels are painted, you can't tell whether they are metal or not, so it seems a bit of unecessary hassle.