Modeling tools.

[perdu]

Eric I saw the "baremetal foil" coming in (as I were a'going out sort of...) but it was always just a little thicker than I wanted, the old silver paper was thinner than that and allowed more surface detail through

I've seen how paint (oops, finishing technology!) has come along recently, looking at Lewis Hamilton's car for example

I'll be interested to see how you get on with it

good luck

[CobolMan]

Interesting comments on here chaps, I do have a question about using airbrushes though. Quite a few articles I've read about them recommend using respirators & having extraction equipment - do you all do this?

I'm thinking about buying an airbrush but can't see Mrs C being impressed if I need all of the above.

[Eric Mc]

I don't bother. Of course it is recommended that you do. But I tend to spray acrylics rather than enamels. Acrylics are far less odorous and contain less harmful chemicals than enamels or laquers.

I spray in a corner of my garage which keeps all the spraying problems away from the main living area.

[Anthony Micallef]

I would recomend at the very least a paper mask if like me you dont spray very often. If you're going to be spraying regularly then something a bit more heavy duty would be advisable. You dont necessarily need any extraction but it obviously depends on where you are going to be spraying. I use a spare room which we use as an office and modelling area so I normally just open a window.

[dr_gn]

CobolMan said:

Interesting comments on here chaps, I do have a question about using airbrushes though. Quite a few articles I've read about them recommend using respirators & having extraction equipment - do you all do this?

I'm thinking about buying an airbrush but can't see Mrs C being impressed if I need all of the above.

If you value your health you will use a proper respirator *with the correct filters*. A paper mask is virtually useless for volatile solvents - some acrylics use Isopropyl Alcohol as a solvent. Any foreign material (apart from prescribed drugs) in aerosol form is very bad news when inhaled.

What's the point not using one? After suffering chest pains a few years ago after paint spraying I would not even consider not using a respirator for even the smallest job.

I use the garage with the doors open for spraying.

[Eric Mc]

My spraying activities rarely last longer than 5 minutes and , at the most, once or twice a week.

I did buy some paper dust masks but, as drgn says, they are pretty useless.

Maybe I should invest in a proper one after all.

[Red Firecracker]

Definitely get a mask.

Also, I'd say definitely use some sort of extraction, even a cheapy like this one;

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=86&am...

can help greatly, not only in your health but also in quality of spray.

I went a bit heavy duty and use an Ikea Malm TV cabinet with a custom insert and chunky extraction fan on the outside of the shed. Also works as air conditioning on a hot day!

[perdu]

another "wear a decent (not dust) facemask" vote after a lifetime in industry and the motor trade

I have been stupid and not bothered before and paid penalties with sick headaces, congested lungs and even more extreme results as a "callow youth"

DON'T ASK!

I just isnt worth it

[Eric Mc]

Surely the amount of time spent spraying must be a factor. I can understand that a mask is a must if you are spending hours on end spraying things. But the odd couple of minutes every couple of days can be too bad - surely?

[dr_gn]

Eric Mc said:

Surely the amount of time spent spraying must be a factor. I can understand that a mask is a must if you are spending hours on end spraying things. But the odd couple of minutes every couple of days can be too bad - surely?

Eric,

As I said, I got chest pain after spraying my Saturn V (and it didn't take a long time to paint). Got worse when I went swimming later that day, but went after a couple more hours. Never happened before or since and that was about 5 years ago. I am reasonably fit (I go mountain biking a lot) and have no health problems that I know of.

The cost of a respirator is nothing compared with the cost of an airbrush and materials over a lifetime, and even less compared with the cost of a heart attack.

If you are spraying outdoors in a breeze, fair enough, but these are not ideal conditions for airbrushing! When you leave your garage after a five minute spraying session, look back as you leave the area and see the haze you've been working in!

Get yourself to B&Q or Wickes and get one bought - you know it makes sense. I cannot think of a single disadvantage to using one.

[Eric Mc]

You've convinced me.

Next item on the "to buy" list.

[dr_gn]

Red Firecracker said:

Definitely get a mask.

Also, I'd say definitely use some sort of extraction, even a cheapy like this one;

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=86&am...

can help greatly, not only in your health but also in quality of spray.

I went a bit heavy duty and use an Ikea Malm TV cabinet with a custom insert and chunky extraction fan on the outside of the shed. Also works as air conditioning on a hot day!

I always wondered about the risk of explosion when there is a cetain amount of aerosol in the atmosphere in a room? A cabinet (depending on how it works) might go some way to eliminating this? Even something as trivial as switching a light off might be enough of an ignition source to ruin your day I guess?

[Red Firecracker]

dr_gn said:

I always wondered about the risk of explosion when there is a cetain amount of aerosol in the atmosphere in a room? A cabinet (depending on how it works) might go some way to eliminating this? Even something as trivial as switching a light off might be enough of an ignition source to ruin your day I guess?

Greatly depends on the type of paint you're using. I've, err, quite a bit of experience with explosions and I'm not concerned that my setup is going to cause any problems, either through the electric extraction fan or the light switches. If you are concerned, it's simple enough to fit spark proof fittings, use a brushless fan or remote fan setup and also keep the area well ventilated (you'll be wanting a good source of air in anyway).

You're more likely to have issues health wise with breathing all the rubbish in (no matter what you're spraying) than with explosions to be honest, as long as you approach it sensibly.

[Zad]

As an aside to the metal foil discussion, has anyone tried Alclad II paints? I have seen some excellent results in photos, and was lucky enough to get a few bottles fairly cheap off Ebay. The undercoat prep needs to be absolutely perfect, but the chrome in particular gives an amazingly reflectively surface.

[Eric Mc]

Seem my earlier comments. I'm waiting to drum up the courage to have a go with Alclad.
The models I've seen finished with this stuff look fantastic.

[dr_gn]

Red Firecracker said:

dr_gn said:

I always wondered about the risk of explosion when there is a cetain amount of aerosol in the atmosphere in a room? A cabinet (depending on how it works) might go some way to eliminating this? Even something as trivial as switching a light off might be enough of an ignition source to ruin your day I guess?

Greatly depends on the type of paint you're using. I've, err, quite a bit of experience with explosions and I'm not concerned that my setup is going to cause any problems, either through the electric extraction fan or the light switches. If you are concerned, it's simple enough to fit spark proof fittings, use a brushless fan or remote fan setup and also keep the area well ventilated (you'll be wanting a good source of air in anyway).

You're more likely to have issues health wise with breathing all the rubbish in (no matter what you're spraying) than with explosions to be honest, as long as you approach it sensibly.

Sorry, I wasn't referring to the extractor fan particularly as a source of ingition, rather flourescent light starters or switches.

I'm going to seriously look into building a cabinet.

[Red Firecracker]

dr_gn said:

Sorry, I wasn't referring to the extractor fan particularly as a source of ingition, rather flourescent light starters or switches.

I'm going to seriously look into building a cabinet.

Same applies to all electrical appliances/devices though if you're concerned with spark ignition. The firework magazines I use all have spark protected lights, switches etc in them so they are available (including flourescents).

A cabinet/extraction booth is well worth it though.

[Evangelion]

Zad said:

... has anyone tried Alclad II paints? ...

I have and they work quite well, I'm just not convinced the result looks like real metal! I much prefer Bare Metal foil, having said that I used ordinary kitchen aluminium foil as well on my last model and it was indistinguishable from BMF! In fact looking at it now I can't remember which panel was which.

I'll take a photo and post it here later today.

[Eric Mc]

I find metal foil too glary for 1/72 scale aircraft. It makes them look far too shiny in the smaller scales. On full sized aircraft, most metals dull quite quickly and the Alclad finishes I've seen seem to mimic that dulled down look better.

In larger scales I think metal foils look better.

[Evangelion]

Here are the results of an experiment I did last year using Alclad, Bare Metal Foil, ordinary aluminium foil and just about everything else I could think of!

Right, all main parts were assembled, canopy attached and masked. Then:

Canopy and area round it were sprayed Humbrol silver followed by clear lacquer and masked.

Rest of aircraft given two coats of Halfords white Plastic Primer, followed by two coats of Halfords Appliance white.

Selected panels were then sprayed with various other colours; black, greys, blues, browns, yellows etc. It was at this point that I realised I could achieve the same effect by applying areas of coloured decal, so I did that in the more inaccessible and difficult to mask areas.

So now it looked like this:




When all that was dry, I then airbrushed, over everything, some Halfords Aluminium, mixed approximately 50/50 with clear lacquer. When I could just see the difference in colour between the various panels, I stopped.

Then I removed the masking from the canopy area and did the remaining panels. Elevators were silver decal. Flaps and ailerons were Alclad. Leading edges were alternately BMF and ordinary foil.

Then decals were applied, followed by another coat or two of clear, a polish when dry, and all the other bits were added to finish it off:




An interesting side effect is that the various colours seem to change according to where you stand, and where the light source is.

(And if you tell me that the Tempest wouldn't have been natural metal, but painted in Airframe Silver - yes, I know!)