SCUBA diving, CMAS

SCUBA diving, CMAS

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Original Poster:

2,146 posts

95 months

Monday 2nd October 2017
quotequote all
To be honest, I can't find the attraction to dive in UK.
It has to be warm water diving.

Last year in Turkey we observed a family of squid.

Prior to this, I always thought squid as horrible things, but after watching them in the sea, they really are quite tame, and amazing.

These ones were a purple brown colour, about 18 inches long.

We were only about 8 meteres down, what a treat.!

Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Monday 2nd October 2017
quotequote all
That's good, however we get squid here, and cuttlefish and seal, dolphins.

Happy if you want to dive warm, please don't think you will see anything we don't. We get Mola Mola (sunfish) too, squid yes lots

AJB88

12,466 posts

172 months

Monday 2nd October 2017
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Angrybiker said:
Recommend doing the course in the UK completely, for a few reasons:
1. It's colder and visibility is shorter, meaning that when you go to Greece it'll feel really easy; and you'll spend more time enjoying the dive.
2. You won't waste any time on holiday getting qualified
3. The schools in the UK can be very good (especially if you go for a PADI 5 star place). PADI standards are the same worldwide but the teachers here can be a bit better than ones you get on resort.
Thats what I plan to do.

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
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Phud said:
That's good, however we get squid here, and cuttlefish and seal, dolphins.

Happy if you want to dive warm, please don't think you will see anything we don't. We get Mola Mola (sunfish) too, squid yes lots
smile

...*anything* we don't? What, like:

- Anemone fish
- Octopus (mimic, blue ringed, etc)
- Rays (insert variety here, like blue spotted, manta, eagle, etc etc. Discounting Plaice of course which you could classify as a ray but really isn't quite the same thing)
- Sharks (white, black and grey reef, hammerhead, Blue, Thresher, epaulette, lemon, tiger, leopard, bronze whaler etc)
- Batfish
- Angel fish
- pipe fish (incl. ghost, harlequin)
- Pygmy sea horses
- Frog fish
- Leaf fish
- any of thousands of types of nudibranch
- flamboyant cuttlefish
- blue/black ribbon eels
- Cowfish
- Dragonfish
- Flying gunard
- Scorpion fish
- Lion fish
- Stone fish
- Trigger fish
- porcelain crab
- parrot fish
- box crab (and boxer crab)
- blue spotted urchin; fire urchin
- giant clam (like over 1m across)
- wonderpus
- leafy sea dragon
- barracuda
- sail fish
- harlequin shrimp
- etc
- etc

Perhaps when you thought 'warm' you thought just Mediterranean - which is good for beginners but fairly rubbish diving in the grand scheme of things.

UK has a little more than a lot of 'warm water divers' give it credit for, but the cold water and crap vis is a fair enough deterrent, especially considering the truly awesome species you can only see in certain parts of the world. There's a reason that all the underwater photo pros go abroad.

Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Angrybiker said:
smile

...*anything* we don't? What, like:

- Anemone fish we have wrasse which folow you
- Octopus (mimic, blue ringed, etc) Yes we have then in UK water no blue ringed but they are really small if you have seen them.
- Rays (insert variety here, like blue spotted, manta, eagle, etc etc. Discounting Plaice of course which you could classify as a ray but really isn't quite the same thing) Blond, thornback and otheres no plaie is a fish and not the same.
- Sharks (white, black and grey reef, hammerhead, Blue, Thresher, epaulette, lemon, tiger, leopard, bronze whaler etc) Yes we have sharks, Blue, Basking, threser
- Batfish Bib
- Angel fish generic
- pipe fish (incl. ghost, harlequin) we have pipe fish
- Pygmy sea horses sea horses too
- Frog fish
- Leaf fish
- any of thousands of types of nudibranch So does the UK
- flamboyant cuttlefish
- blue/black ribbon eels
- Cowfish
- Dragonfish
- Flying gunard
- Scorpion fish
- Lion fish
- Stone fish
- Trigger fish
- porcelain crab
- parrot fish
- box crab (and boxer crab)
- blue spotted urchin; fire urchin
- giant clam (like over 1m across)
- wonderpus
- leafy sea dragon
- barracuda
- sail fish
- harlequin shrimp
- etc
- etc

Perhaps when you thought 'warm' you thought just Mediterranean - which is good for beginners but fairly rubbish diving in the grand scheme of things.

UK has a little more than a lot of 'warm water divers' give it credit for, but the cold water and crap vis is a fair enough deterrent, especially considering the truly awesome species you can only see in certain parts of the world. There's a reason that all the underwater photo pros go abroad.
No I did not mean that, I meant all warm water.

I take you you have a few dives in the UK? If not try Oban, Aberdeen, Orkney and Scillies before you do the normal UK crap viz, I have had crap viz in Africa, Oman, HK and south China sea. Oh yes Ireland too.

As for your list, we have the same diversity around the UK, but I am happy to admit not the seemingly wonderous shapes,

Have you ever played with cuttlefish?
Crawfish? Seal? Leatherback of cardigan bay?

Angrybiker I think you might need to look at a few UK sites to see what life we have.

Are you a PADI instuctor?

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Phud said:
No I did not mean that, I meant all warm water.

I take you you have a few dives in the UK? If not try Oban, Aberdeen, Orkney and Scillies before you do the normal UK crap viz, I have had crap viz in Africa, Oman, HK and south China sea. Oh yes Ireland too.

As for your list, we have the same diversity around the UK, but I am happy to admit not the seemingly wonderous shapes,

Have you ever played with cuttlefish?
Crawfish? Seal? Leatherback of cardigan bay?

Angrybiker I think you might need to look at a few UK sites to see what life we have.

Are you a PADI instuctor?
Yep, done fair share of UK diving and yes sometimes the vis is OK. The difference is sometimes the UK vis is good and sometimes warm water vis is crap. I do still have Scapa and Ireland on my list but I've been having way too much fun with the camera in SE Asia.

Yep, played with cuttlefish. In fact I've actually talked to cuttlefish. The owner of a resort on Bunaken island had some resident ones, learned over the years how to make shapes with her hands and get them to respond, and she taught me. That was awesome.
Yep, been to La Paz in Mexico, if you go around 2nd week of September like I did then you can catch the baby seals getting their first taste of swimming away from their mothers. We did a whole week going back to the same few sites and I could have done 2. they really are the cutest things ever, especially when they steal your bandana from your head and play with it and tease you with it; and when they come and give you some play bites. Awesome as well (but a little inadvisable) is to accidentally get a little too close to the main group and have the massive males make near passes warning you off with ultrasound that shakes your whole body. Unfortunately my wide angle lens decided to completely break its autofocus that week so I have lots of amazing but out of focus and useless shots of that trip. Guess I'll have to go back sometime.
Also chased a 6m wide manta in Thailand - starting at 20 bar pressure at the end of the last dive of the trip - caught up with it and managed to cut it free from a big fishing weight that was wrapped around its tail. Holy cow they are quick. It did some circuits around me after that, I like to think in gratitude, as I gulped the last bit of air from the tank and controlled emergency ascent. Surreal and incredibly moving experience.
Turtles - 10 days in Sipadan - enough said.
Of course done the cliché feeding stingrays at stingray city in Grand Cayman. (there's also one site in Tenerife where you can do that too, if you ever get bored with all the rocks and black urchins that dominate the rest of the diving there)
Been chased off by a nesting titan triggerfish (very scary). chunk taken out of my fin (glad it wasn't out of me!)
Close encounter with Boris the 200kg grouper at Coolidge wreck in Oz, he gave my buddy a massive hicky on his stomach. laughed so hard I flooded my mask. Dead now, poor fish.
Many more treasured memories..

Yeah, PADI instructor. Did some teaching of a weekend years ago. Tons of fun but too busy now.


Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
I am chuckling at the cliche dives.

Enjoy your diving, I am really glad that cold water diving is not for everyone, get to Ireland and have fun with the seals, also the dolphins.






RobM77

35,349 posts

235 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
A question for the enthusiastic UK divers from a 'warm' water diver: Most of my diving experience is in Mexico and Egypt. In both locations, with sea temperatures between 27 and 29 degrees C, I've seen a whole range of temperature tolerance; some people wear board shorts and a t-shirt, whereas others need a 5mm full suit with a hood. In cooler months in Egypt I've even seen dry suits used in 24/25 degree water. My question is how does this translate to UK diving - the person who shivers uncontrollably if he or she tries a 3mm fullsuit in 29 degree water - how would they cope with UK diving? (in a dry suit, obviously!). Or is UK diving only for people who would happily dive in a shortie in 29 deg water?

Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
RobM77 said:
A question for the enthusiastic UK divers from a 'warm' water diver: Most of my diving experience is in Mexico and Egypt. In both locations, with sea temperatures between 27 and 29 degrees C, I've seen a whole range of temperature tolerance; some people wear board shorts and a t-shirt, whereas others need a 5mm full suit with a hood. In cooler months in Egypt I've even seen dry suits used in 24/25 degree water. My question is how does this translate to UK diving - the person who shivers uncontrollably if he or she tries a 3mm fullsuit in 29 degree water - how would they cope with UK diving? (in a dry suit, obviously!). Or is UK diving only for people who would happily dive in a shortie in 29 deg water?
Rob77, now days you can buy drysuits and undersuits which means you sweat all year round, it is how you look after them is the issue.

The hood and gloves are the key areas, cold hands, sod diving, so you can get dry gloves, if you want to wear semi dry, then maybe not all year for you.

It all comes down to cost, a good dry suit is quite expensive. And most UK divers are shall we say chubby!!! So we, OK, I, use the blubber covering to stay warm.

Hoods are thicker diving in cold water, this gives a few folks issues, claustrophobia feelings, so your movement on land is not as agile as the red sea.

To answer fully, there is the same range of temp tolerance in dry suits too, some folk wear winter undersuits all year, some just wear a vest.

I am incredibly bias, O'Three dry suits and PBB. Different dry suits have different thermal properties, neoprene and membrane. So no difference.

Cold water diving is for anybody who wants too. Ice diving is for the mad, it's great...

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Phud said:
RobM77 said:
A question for the enthusiastic UK divers from a 'warm' water diver: Most of my diving experience is in Mexico and Egypt. In both locations, with sea temperatures between 27 and 29 degrees C, I've seen a whole range of temperature tolerance; some people wear board shorts and a t-shirt, whereas others need a 5mm full suit with a hood. In cooler months in Egypt I've even seen dry suits used in 24/25 degree water. My question is how does this translate to UK diving - the person who shivers uncontrollably if he or she tries a 3mm fullsuit in 29 degree water - how would they cope with UK diving? (in a dry suit, obviously!). Or is UK diving only for people who would happily dive in a shortie in 29 deg water?
Rob77, now days you can buy drysuits and undersuits which means you sweat all year round, it is how you look after them is the issue.

The hood and gloves are the key areas, cold hands, sod diving, so you can get dry gloves, if you want to wear semi dry, then maybe not all year for you.

It all comes down to cost, a good dry suit is quite expensive. And most UK divers are shall we say chubby!!! So we, OK, I, use the blubber covering to stay warm.

Hoods are thicker diving in cold water, this gives a few folks issues, claustrophobia feelings, so your movement on land is not as agile as the red sea.

To answer fully, there is the same range of temp tolerance in dry suits too, some folk wear winter undersuits all year, some just wear a vest.

I am incredibly bias, O'Three dry suits and PBB. Different dry suits have different thermal properties, neoprene and membrane. So no difference.

Cold water diving is for anybody who wants too. Ice diving is for the mad, it's great...
Yep quite possible to be toasty most of the time with the right gear and good thermals. Even with all that though it can get a bit nippy after a while. You can't cover your cheeks so you lose heat from your face; and if you have bad circulation in your hands like me then you'll start to feel it there too even with thick gloves. Downside - all this gear adds buoyancy so you need extra weight; and if you have really thick gloves then forget tweaking controls on your camera. I almost failed on my open water instructor assessment because it was so cold my first stage froze; and I had trouble with my poor hands getting the dry suit hose back on after I was playing victim in a rescue assessment. Had to turn away from the course directors so they couldn't see me struggling! By the time I got to my 'spot and correct the deliberate mistake' part of my assessment I was shivering uncontrollably. That was fun.. To be fair there was a lot of hanging around doing nothing waiting for other people, but still.

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Nice soft coral Phud - good example of something colourful in UK waters!







RobM77

35,349 posts

235 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Angrybiker said:
Phud said:
RobM77 said:
A question for the enthusiastic UK divers from a 'warm' water diver: Most of my diving experience is in Mexico and Egypt. In both locations, with sea temperatures between 27 and 29 degrees C, I've seen a whole range of temperature tolerance; some people wear board shorts and a t-shirt, whereas others need a 5mm full suit with a hood. In cooler months in Egypt I've even seen dry suits used in 24/25 degree water. My question is how does this translate to UK diving - the person who shivers uncontrollably if he or she tries a 3mm fullsuit in 29 degree water - how would they cope with UK diving? (in a dry suit, obviously!). Or is UK diving only for people who would happily dive in a shortie in 29 deg water?
Rob77, now days you can buy drysuits and undersuits which means you sweat all year round, it is how you look after them is the issue.

The hood and gloves are the key areas, cold hands, sod diving, so you can get dry gloves, if you want to wear semi dry, then maybe not all year for you.

It all comes down to cost, a good dry suit is quite expensive. And most UK divers are shall we say chubby!!! So we, OK, I, use the blubber covering to stay warm.

Hoods are thicker diving in cold water, this gives a few folks issues, claustrophobia feelings, so your movement on land is not as agile as the red sea.

To answer fully, there is the same range of temp tolerance in dry suits too, some folk wear winter undersuits all year, some just wear a vest.

I am incredibly bias, O'Three dry suits and PBB. Different dry suits have different thermal properties, neoprene and membrane. So no difference.

Cold water diving is for anybody who wants too. Ice diving is for the mad, it's great...
Yep quite possible to be toasty most of the time with the right gear and good thermals. Even with all that though it can get a bit nippy after a while. You can't cover your cheeks so you lose heat from your face; and if you have bad circulation in your hands like me then you'll start to feel it there too even with thick gloves. Downside - all this gear adds buoyancy so you need extra weight; and if you have really thick gloves then forget tweaking controls on your camera. I almost failed on my open water instructor assessment because it was so cold my first stage froze; and I had trouble with my poor hands getting the dry suit hose back on after I was playing victim in a rescue assessment. Had to turn away from the course directors so they couldn't see me struggling! By the time I got to my 'spot and correct the deliberate mistake' part of my assessment I was shivering uncontrollably. That was fun.. To be fair there was a lot of hanging around doing nothing waiting for other people, but still.
Thanks. I guess the main barrier is the cost of a dry suit. I did my dry suit diver speciality after my PADI OW and it took over an hour to find a suit that fitted me, and the one I ended up using was awful. I too have experienced uncontrollable shivering, and it really wasn't nice, thus the question!

Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
Rob77

If you want your question answered, I would suggest a trip to O'Three at Portland, yes you need to give them time, however the service and time they will return should answer any question.

I will write it again, I am bias, but in my experience they are the best around and fit all sizes, the under suit is also my under leather winter bike suit.

Not cheap, but my last one managed 11 years so money well spent. Good hoods too.

No this is colour in the UK,

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
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Seconded. If I was going for a dry suit I'd go o-three too; 4th element maybe too.

lol @ uk colour

RobM77

35,349 posts

235 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
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Thanks, I've heard good things yes

marcosgt

11,021 posts

177 months

Tuesday 3rd October 2017
quotequote all
I dive a lot in the UK and a bit overseas.

I can see that people like the easiness, comfort and novelty of diving only in warm water, but you're missing out not diving in the UK.

It's also very expensive to go abroad enough to keep your skill levels up, which diving in the UK allows you to maintain, making overseas diving a bit of a doddle on the whole (obviously a dive to 100M is a challenge anywhere, but I'm really talking about recreational diving - Down to 30-40M).

The assumption that there's nothing to see in UK waters is so very, very wrong!

M

Bikesalot

1,835 posts

159 months

Tuesday 17th October 2017
quotequote all
Keen diver here - Although my motorbike hobby has taken over more recently.

Some of the best dives i've done have been in the UK - i love wreck diving and the UK coast is littered with gooduns'

Diving is a great sport thats taken me all over the world:

Thailand
Oman
Maldives
Egypt
Bonaire

But i'd still take a Plymouth wreck trip or a couple of days in the Farnes diving with the seals...

Night dives are my favourite, some great sites in Oman and didn't see another boat for a week, hopefully it's still the same.

Phud

1,262 posts

144 months

Wednesday 18th October 2017
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One of my dive friends used to turn up with his twin tanks riding his bike, a little 125, so can be done.

Was last in Oman 2012 and it was nice an quiet then.

Angrybiker

557 posts

91 months

Wednesday 18th October 2017
quotequote all
marcosgt said:
I dive a lot in the UK and a bit overseas.

I can see that people like the easiness, comfort and novelty of diving only in warm water, but you're missing out not diving in the UK.

It's also very expensive to go abroad enough to keep your skill levels up, which diving in the UK allows you to maintain, making overseas diving a bit of a doddle on the whole (obviously a dive to 100M is a challenge anywhere, but I'm really talking about recreational diving - Down to 30-40M).

The assumption that there's nothing to see in UK waters is so very, very wrong!

M
Yeah sure there's lots to see in the UK, but the colder water and the viz (generally) means it's not completely an arbitrary or irrational decision to focus overseas. When I was teaching the vast majority of my students wanted to get their cert just to give them something else to do on a particular holiday. A lot of people don't evolve past that.
For the more experienced it just depends what you want to get out of diving. As for me, my diving has evolved into primarily photography and you just can't get the pictures that I look for, in the UK; and of a weekend I have lots of other stuff to fill up my time.

creampuff

6,511 posts

144 months

Wednesday 18th October 2017
quotequote all
I got my OW ticket in about 1994 and AOW in about 1995.

Haven't been diving for a few years but I'd never do it in a cold water place as it is too much flaffing around for the reward. Plus if you go in SE Asia, it is usually a lot cheaper.