Has FoS grown too big?

[daydotz]

Thursday is definitely getting busier I had a text from Goodwood saying that it was almost sold out I think many people are being more cost conscious

[Northcote67]

Big Nanas said:

That's quite the racing pedigree, isn't it.
A few years ago at the FoS I had good fortune to get behind the scenes in the assembly area. I had a good chat with Lorinna whilst she waited to go up the hill. She was funny, relaxed and had some pretty eye-opening things to say about Christian Horner

I’d love to know what was said

Midweek motorsport are not a great fan of his either

[Turn7]

ChevronB19 said:

LukeBrown66 said:

It was too big about 20 years ago.

I was lucky enough to attend when it was majority all pro drivers or legends int e cars

Now it tends to be a bit of that but also very rich men or their wives who have no idea how the drive the expensive cars they are driving, and are probably ruining them.

Also, I have see a guy in a 92 or 93 Benetton, I have seen that car several times and I have never seen it running properly, now either he is so thick he doesn't know which is perhaps close to the truth or doesn't care as he gets an invite etc etc.

Regarding crowds, it has always been bad, for me I would make people who want to take pictures as amateurs go somewhere in particular or at least have an area for people who actually live their lives, rather than spending the entire time holding up a bloody phone or even Ipad. It is annoying, ride selfish and all the lovely things you associate with modern people sadly.

It is a shame, as it is a great event in base terms, but March will do anything he can to squeeze every last penny out of the thing, I thankfully realised this about 20 years ago and haven't been since.

Given your comments here and on the various motorsports sub fora, I’m convinced you don’t like motorsport and never have. Just out of interest, have you ever competed yourself? You are aware that old race cars can be quite temperamental, or would you prefer they are all run by rich people paying teams to prep them… oh, wait a moment…

Edited by ChevronB19 on Saturday 15th July 12:38

100% agree Chevron.....

EVERY.SINGLE.COMMENT.

JUST BORE OFF.

Edited by Turn7 on Saturday 15th July 16:48

[Big Nanas]

Northcote67 said:

Big Nanas said:

That's quite the racing pedigree, isn't it.
A few years ago at the FoS I had good fortune to get behind the scenes in the assembly area. I had a good chat with Lorinna whilst she waited to go up the hill. She was funny, relaxed and had some pretty eye-opening things to say about Christian Horner

I’d love to know what was said

Midweek motorsport are not a great fan of his either

Well, I suppose I'd better not say, but it was just after he had left his wife for Gerri Spice. She was quite...knowledgable about why he left his wife.

[WhyOne]

48k said:

LukeBrown66 said:

It was too big about 20 years ago.

I was lucky enough to attend when it was majority all pro drivers or legends int e cars

Now it tends to be a bit of that but also very rich men or their wives who have no idea how the drive the expensive cars they are driving, and are probably ruining them.

Also, I have see a guy in a 92 or 93 Benetton, I have seen that car several times and I have never seen it running properly, now either he is so thick he doesn't know which is perhaps close to the truth or doesn't care as he gets an invite etc etc.

Regarding crowds, it has always been bad, for me I would make people who want to take pictures as amateurs go somewhere in particular or at least have an area for people who actually live their lives, rather than spending the entire time holding up a bloody phone or even Ipad. It is annoying, ride selfish and all the lovely things you associate with modern people sadly.

It is a shame, as it is a great event in base terms, but March will do anything he can to squeeze every last penny out of the thing, I thankfully realised this about 20 years ago and haven't been since.

"The guy in the Benetton who is so thick he doesn't know what he's doing"

Yes indeed.

Pot-kettle Luke?

Oh...and the event is headed up by the Duke of Richmond not 'March' as you so disrespectfuly choose to call him

Edited by WhyOne on Saturday 15th July 15:51

[500TORQUES]

LukeBrown66 said:

It was too big about 20 years ago.

I was lucky enough to attend when it was majority all pro drivers or legends int e cars

Now it tends to be a bit of that but also very rich men or their wives who have no idea how the drive the expensive cars they are driving, and are probably ruining them.

Also, I have see a guy in a 92 or 93 Benetton, I have seen that car several times and I have never seen it running properly, now either he is so thick he doesn't know which is perhaps close to the truth or doesn't care as he gets an invite etc etc.

Regarding crowds, it has always been bad, for me I would make people who want to take pictures as amateurs go somewhere in particular or at least have an area for people who actually live their lives, rather than spending the entire time holding up a bloody phone or even Ipad. It is annoying, ride selfish and all the lovely things you associate with modern people sadly.

It is a shame, as it is a great event in base terms, but March will do anything he can to squeeze every last penny out of the thing, I thankfully realised this about 20 years ago and haven't been since.

Most of the cars seen at the FOS are privately owned and take significant money to keep in running condition. You have to be wealthy to own and use these things in anger. Without these people the event would not exist.

Some of these owners are not great drivers, but most of them are very competent, Goodwood also team up the car owners with a high level pro, so you do tend to see most cars being driven well over the weekend.

I've run cars there multiple years, the worst performing driver i dealt with was a top pro who was an F1 driver and indy 500 winner, he destroyed the clutch and flywheel in one run. That can happen when you put a modern pro in an old technology car that they dont understand, it's a completely alien experience for them.

I've driven at the FOS and also at the pre event press day in some CanAm cars, the course is much harder to drive than your tradional circuit, a proper racing car is a handfull following the road with its crowns and large camber changes and odd corners, the thing i drove was doing 130MPH. That concentrates the mind, if you get it wrong, even at half that speed you can get hurt and ruin a car, so it's not surprising if some of the less able drivers may look slow to you. I can guarantee they are still challenging themselves and will have a massive grin on their face, whilst they enable enthusiasts to enjoy a unique events sights and sounds. Long may it continue.

[pquinn]

I'm not sure it's grown too 'big', but would it be unfair to say its become a lot more stratified and fragmented over time into a lot of private/'special' bits with an ever smaller 'public' bit running alongside?

There's still a basic core anyone can sort of get to but mostly it just feels ever like a lot of private events being subsidised by the plebs. Fine when you're on the lists but otherwise less and less tempting.

At least that's been my feeling having dipped in and out. The cars are still OK but I can live without the rest of it.

[pquinn]

CooperS said:

I drove to work on Thursday (up to Guildford on the A3) and the volume of super cars, sports cars and nice metal was incredible for 08:00 as they funnelled down to Chichester in the other direction.

That's one way you can tell it's that time of year. Of all the exotica the one thing that I'd really been unaware of before I saw one was the Maybach van.

[ChevronB19]

Turn7 said:

EVERY.SINGLE.COMMENT.

JUST BORE OFF.

I am (hopefully) assuming that was aimed at Luke!

[Robw73]

Although he's getting some bad press, there are elements of what 'LukeBrown66' has written that I somewhat agree with.

I visited many grandstands over Thursday & Friday and did find myself amongst several navy blue blazers and their associated lady friends. Sadly, and although a sweeping statement, many of them had very little knowledge of the cars or drivers.

They did however like to keep reminding each other how the 'free hospitality' had been amazing!

Each to their own, but as a single dad who has to manage every penny these days (my mum bought me my friday ticket for Xmas and I picked up a Thursday ticket for £15 locally!) it does make my skin itch a bit.

It seems there still may be some privileges that money can gain you.

Edited by Robw73 on Saturday 15th July 16:38

[Turn7]

ChevronB19 said:

Turn7 said:

EVERY.SINGLE.COMMENT.

JUST BORE OFF.

I am (hopefully) assuming that was aimed at Luke!

Very much so !

[anonymous-user]

The event has changed. Now it's a moving motor show but they're not quite ready to market it as such. The manufacturer content had grown significantly which means there is less time and space for the historic cars. For some this is good, they want to see the new supercars, for others is boring after the first ten minutes

I'm really lucky, we started going to historic events in the early to mid 90s so I've seen all the "important" stuff on display or racing, now I'll go to catch up with friends not necessarily to see the cars.

I'll go once every three or four years, interspersed with silverstone classic, le mans classic etc but everyone now knows what they're getting at goodwood, you know its going to be busy, expensive and traffic is a pain in the arse..

[WhyOne]

Big Nanas said:

ChevronB19 said:

WhyOne said:

LukeBrown66 said:

Also, I have see a guy in a 92 or 93 Benetton, I have seen that car several times and I have never seen it running properly, now either he is so thick he doesn't know which is perhaps close to the truth or doesn't care as he gets an invite etc etc.

You clearly pay close attention and know your stuff....that 'guy' was/is Lorina McLaughlin.

Also, Luke, when we raced in historic formula junior in the 80’s, Lorina (Boughton as she was known then)kicked pretty much everyone’s arses.

She is a phenomenally quick driver, and also an extremely nice person.

http://speedqueens.blogspot.com/2015/08/lorina-mcl...

That's quite the racing pedigree, isn't it.
A few years ago at the FoS I had good fortune to get behind the scenes in the assembly area. I had a good chat with Lorinna whilst she waited to go up the hill. She was funny, relaxed and had some pretty eye-opening things to say about Christian Horner

Ah yes, all of this may be so, but our Luke knows best and 'he' is apparently 'thick'

[ecsrobin]

We’ve said we won’t return next year unless we get given free tickets (that aren’t GRRC Thursday tickets). And I’ve given up with breakfast club.

GRRC I said this year would be my decider if I continue, unless I have a big change of heart at the revival I think I’ll give goodwood a kiss for a few years.

There’s better events out there for less money so I’ll start ticking them off.

[Turn7]

ecsrobin said:

We’ve said we won’t return next year unless we get given free tickets (that aren’t GRRC Thursday tickets). And I’ve given up with breakfast club.

GRRC I said this year would be my decider if I continue, unless I have a big change of heart at the revival I think I’ll give goodwood a kiss for a few years.

There’s better events out there for less money so I’ll start ticking them off.

Serious question - what event do you consider better than FOS ?

[Timothy Bucktu]

LukeBrown66 said:

Regarding crowds, it has always been bad, for me I would make people who want to take pictures as amateurs go somewhere in particular or at least have an area for people who actually live their lives, rather than spending the entire time holding up a bloody phone or even Ipad. It is annoying, ride selfish and all the lovely things you associate with modern people sadly.

Gotta agree there.
The folks tutting because you dared to get too close to the car just as they were 10 feet away framing a picture did spoil it for me. I'm there to grt up close to the cars, not worry the whole time that someone might be trying to get a good shot.
In the end you just have to ignore them.

The Sunday Scramble is a good day out. But like Goodwood, the cost is rising and so are the numbers of people. Eventually it'll get too big to enjoy.

[EVOTECH3BELL]

Turn7 said:

ecsrobin said:

We’ve said we won’t return next year unless we get given free tickets (that aren’t GRRC Thursday tickets). And I’ve given up with breakfast club.

GRRC I said this year would be my decider if I continue, unless I have a big change of heart at the revival I think I’ll give goodwood a kiss for a few years.

There’s better events out there for less money so I’ll start ticking them off.

Serious question - what event do you consider better than FOS ?

I'd also like to know a similar list of events, mainly focusing on classic/historic racing.

I've not done silverstone classic or classic leman so maybe thats a good starting point.
I've just joined Shelsley Walsh Membership as its local and you don't get much more opposite than Goodwood than that.

[IanH755]

Timothy Bucktu said:

LukeBrown66 said:

Regarding crowds, it has always been bad, for me I would make people who want to take pictures as amateurs go somewhere in particular or at least have an area for people who actually live their lives, rather than spending the entire time holding up a bloody phone or even Ipad. It is annoying, ride selfish and all the lovely things you associate with modern people sadly.

Gotta agree there.
The folks tutting because you dared to get too close to the car just as they were 10 feet away framing a picture did spoil it for me. I'm there to grt up close to the cars, not worry the whole time that someone might be trying to get a good shot.
In the end you just have to ignore them.

Thats the impression I took away from my only visit to Goodwood a few years ago. Just like Glastonbury and other high profile events, for a lot of people it's become a hotspot for "must be seen there to get social media clout" types who don't actually care about the various events they go to, they just want to be there to say "I've been there and here's all my selfies" with things like the racing, the cars and history all wasted on them as they live in their self absorbed little narcissistic world.

On the other side, I can understand actual fans wanting some images of rare, unusual, expensive cars and those folks rarely seemed to get annoyed by other fans getting up close to the various cars.

[anonymous-user]

Turn7 said:

ecsrobin said:

We’ve said we won’t return next year unless we get given free tickets (that aren’t GRRC Thursday tickets). And I’ve given up with breakfast club.

GRRC I said this year would be my decider if I continue, unless I have a big change of heart at the revival I think I’ll give goodwood a kiss for a few years.

There’s better events out there for less money so I’ll start ticking them off.

Serious question - what event do you consider better than FOS ?

Personally I think the Silverstone classic is a better event.

Wide range of racing cars on track, and at least the top 25% are really pushing.
Big range of car club displays (if that’s your thing)
Pit access
Open grandstands
shuttle buses
Enough space to always get a spot trackside at the fence
Easier ingress/egress

I know Goodwood as a venue has a certain appeal but for me, FOS is waning until it decides what sort of event it wants to be. The Members Meeting will always be the best event on the UK calendar though, FOS just appears to me to be a little tired.

If you only have one day a year to go watch racing cars, but also want to see the latest supercars etc, then yes FOS is probably your “best day out” in terms of an “experience” but everything is compromised……but if you can afford more than one day out , Silverstone Classic, VSCC at Prescott, Classic Nostalgia at Shelsley and HSCC October meetIng at Silverstone are all great days out and less stress than FOS.

Did our first Classic Le Mans this year but that was really good fun, took a bit of planning but Arnage at midnight watching a horde of angry Lola T70s was almost erotic….

Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 16th July 09:11

[ChevronB19]

EVOTECH3BELL said:

Turn7 said:

ecsrobin said:

We’ve said we won’t return next year unless we get given free tickets (that aren’t GRRC Thursday tickets). And I’ve given up with breakfast club.

GRRC I said this year would be my decider if I continue, unless I have a big change of heart at the revival I think I’ll give goodwood a kiss for a few years.

There’s better events out there for less money so I’ll start ticking them off.

Serious question - what event do you consider better than FOS ?

I'd also like to know a similar list of events, mainly focusing on classic/historic racing.

I've not done silverstone classic or classic leman so maybe thats a good starting point.
I've just joined Shelsley Walsh Membership as its local and you don't get much more opposite than Goodwood than that.

From my pov, having raced historics (mostly with the HSCC) for the last 25 years, I personally prefer full on competition rather than car demos with a smattering of competition, I’d start with (in no particular order):

Goodwood Revival (done 5x, best result 4th)
Goodwood Members Meeting (done once, broke)
Spa 6 hours (my only outright win! - in a support race)
Oulton Park Gold Cup (favourite circuit)
Croft Historic Festival (when it was good, it’s a bit of a shadow of itself now)
Brands Superprix
Silverstone Classic (pity Bridge has gone)
Any British hillclimb championship meeting
Any number of historic club races

This isn’t to downplay FoS (my name isn’t Luke), it just isn’t my particular thing. Other than the Goodwood ones, you can pretty much wander through the paddock to your hearts content, although increasingly people are run by pro’s so it isn’t quite as friendly as it used to be. Never been to classic Le Mans, but it’s on the list, my folks went to the Nurburgring classic once and thought it excellent.