Turbo trainers/Zwift/Peleton

[J4CKO]

Made it up the "Alpe Du Zwift" was fairly hard but doable or me (slowly), averaged 220 W for the duration, heart rate at 159/160 for an hour or so.

A lot of it is mental, found it very daunting but once you have done it, its less scary and a known quantity, few levels to get to it but its a good way to burn 1350 calories fairly quickly.

Made the mistake of a curry last night, was not pleasant in that garage this morning

[J4CKO]

pablo said:

J4CKO said:

Made it up the "Alpe Du Zwift" was fairly hard but doable or me (slowly), averaged 220 W for the duration, heart rate at 159/160 for an hour or so.

A lot of it is mental, found it very daunting but once you have done it, its less scary and a known quantity, few levels to get to it but its a good way to burn 1350 calories fairly quickly.

Made the mistake of a curry last night, was not pleasant in that garage this morning

I quite like the scenery up the alpe du zwift, fair play to them for actually making it interesting to look at whilst we slog up it at 8kmh because god knows at that speed you can really take it all in....

Yeah, reminded me of Chechen Itza in parts.

[J4CKO]

And also, if you have had enough 20 miles from home you are stuck with it, cant just get off and go in the house.

I have noticed with alcohol how much it affects me, in the Apple health app, since I have been riding more on Zwift and cut out mid week boozing and just drinking on weekends I look at my resting heart rate graph and it drops over the week and then spikes back up over the weekend.

Overall its come down, 44 yesterday which is the lowest I think I have ever seen mine go, and HRV is going up the more I do, 58 today assuming the Apple watch is reasonably accurate.

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

okgo said:

While I do agree that booze isn't great, after the first hour of cycling I would imagine you're back to a level sort of playing field as you would have been had you not drunk the night before. I've actually had some of my best legs in rides where I've had a skinful the night before, clearly it takes a while to burn through it but once you do its all much for much.

Personally speaking I've never bothered with HRM full stop, until more recently for some reason, but I think whoop and similar are pretty gimmicky and most folks I know who use it have said similar in that it's just so random that not a lot can be drawn from it - https://twitter.com/JamesMarkHayden/status/1327521... . For me it's just one more bit of data that I don't care about, I can't change how I've slept or whatever, so no need worrying about it was how I saw it.

This is what the data teaches you, once you've had a 30days+ to set a baseline. The impact of booze is far greater, and for far longer. Not just a bottle of wine, but a full sesh knocks stats for several days.

People love to knock Whoop, but if you approach people who have done more in-depth research, they highlight where it is very effective (Recovery/HRV/RHR) and where it isn't (acting as a HRM being one). The greatest research has been done by the investors earlier this month who have now valued the business at $1.2bn!! The biggest failing of users who dislike is their use of the product. Guy I know used it for 3 months that decreed it was useless.... only to then admit he only wore it for around half the time.

For those that think it's a gimmick, they are in luck - its adoption is not compulsory.

I think Whoop is for the more hardcore and pros, Apple Watch does me fine and gives me enough feedback to motivate me, but like you say, it does have to be on you most of the time to be of any use.

Its good to see things like Heart Rate Recovery, resting Heart Rat, Vo2 etc improving as it puts some context around getting a bit fitter.

I like being told how many calories I am using but I reckon its a bit optimistic, yesterday it said I used 4203, that's with an hour on Zwift and a 3.1 miles brisk walking, respectively 715 and 360 "active" calories which is above what you would burn on the couch, including that its 844 and 520. Plus it says my resting energy has gone up from around 2000, to nearer 2400.

Am losing weight so maybe its not that far off ?

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

okgo said:

Ares said:

None are so blind as those that will not see.

What have you done with this data then?

Learned.
my alcohol consumption

I have this thing that logs every unit I drink, tots it up over the week and provides alerts if I go over my units, am remotely inebriated or drink on more than two consecutive nights etc.




















Its called "Wife"

[J4CKO]

How often do you guys ride/Zwift ?

I have been neglecting actually going out, been over two weeks, novelty of Zwift and was going to go out this weekend but ended up meeting my mate on there.

Sunday spent gardening, went on last night, walked for four miles tonight lost in podcasts, will go on tomorrow. Dont want to go too mad and get pissed off with it or feel obligated.

[J4CKO]

Can safely say the Zwift thing is working for me, down by half a stone since I got it at the end of October. Am combining it with eating a bit less, no midweek boozing and walking 2/3 miles a day. Want to get from 229 pounds to about 200.

It seems a very efficient way to burn calories, nip in the garage, turn it all on, get on and pedal. No traffic lights, traffic and other distractions, not a substitute for actual riding but for using a load calories in a spare hour or so its brilliant.

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

J4CKO said:

Can safely say the Zwift thing is working for me, down by half a stone since I got it at the end of October. Am combining it with eating a bit less, no midweek boozing and walking 2/3 miles a day. Want to get from 229 pounds to about 200.

It seems a very efficient way to burn calories, nip in the garage, turn it all on, get on and pedal. No traffic lights, traffic and other distractions, not a substitute for actual riding but for using a load calories in a spare hour or so its brilliant.

Thats amazing Jacko..... really well done. Get yourself onto some group rides, a lot more enjoyable, naturally harder and you'll go for a lot longer. My 75min/50km session earlier honestly felt like 20mins. The banter was so good, laughing made my heart rate 20bpm higher.

Cheers, just feels like have made a start really, aiming for a pound a week, if more happens then thats all good. Imagining that out on the road will move a bit quicker being 36 pounds lighter, even if I am still a lump by cycling standards.

[J4CKO]

okgo said:

J4CKO said:

Can safely say the Zwift thing is working for me, down by half a stone since I got it at the end of October. Am combining it with eating a bit less, no midweek boozing and walking 2/3 miles a day. Want to get from 229 pounds to about 200.

It seems a very efficient way to burn calories, nip in the garage, turn it all on, get on and pedal. No traffic lights, traffic and other distractions, not a substitute for actual riding but for using a load calories in a spare hour or so its brilliant.

Yes, for sure. And the cruel irony of cycling is that the fitter (more watts) you get the more calories you burn, its fairly easy for me to burn 800 cals in 40 mins, to do that at a barry's bootcamp or something I'd feel like I'd been in the ring with Tyson. With the bike I can just hop off and crack on with the day.

For various reasons, children, work etc I've been mostly turbo based since the summer, which is rare for me. I would say I average around 5 hours a week, which is approx half what I've done for the previous 9 or so years, but I think I'm not that much less fit. Obviously the endurance won't be there, but I'm not worried about producing a race winning effort in the 3rd hour of a ride at the minute, so not too bothered.

I did some research and essentially in a 90 min ride outside (I do live in inner London) I would spend only 50 minutes of it actually pushing more than 200w (anything below that technically not doing my much good), so turbo does feel like its approx 2x as efficient for me. Not the same if you live more rurally of course, but a lot of my riding used to be made up of 2 hours commuting a day, think they'd be even worse value for the time if training was the sole concern, obviously more easy to write that off given its transport and saves you money and from the tube.

Yeah, does seem to be very effective at burning energy, did four hours in the garden last Sunday shifting leaves, digging and all that, said I used 300 calories as "Active Energy" and really felt it the next day but can burn that or more in half an hour on Zwift.

Obviously more to it than just calorie burn but for me trying to shift lard at the moment its a pretty good option.

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

J4CKO said:

Yeah, does seem to be very effective at burning energy, did four hours in the garden last Sunday shifting leaves, digging and all that, said I used 300 calories as "Active Energy" and really felt it the next day but can burn that or more in half an hour on Zwift.

Obviously more to it than just calorie burn but for me trying to shift lard at the moment its a pretty good option.

Calories calculations are pretty tenuous at the best of time. Your body would burn more than 300 calories doing nothing for 4hrs!

I got off a 75min bike session, Wahoo said I'd burnt just over 1000cal, Apple Watch said 650. I then let a bottle of smoothie explode, covering the kitchen. It took 25 minutes of work to wipe the floor, cupboards, ceiling, fridge..... Apple Watch said I burnt 900 calories doing that!!

Indeed, my thinking is that if it says I used 923 calories yesterday, thats better than the 3407 the previous day, but not as good as Saturday when I did the Alpe Du Zwift which was 4363.

So it doesn't pay to take them too literally but as a guide to and some verification that more energy has been expended on one day vs another, plus I like to see the number climbing higher so it spurs me on a bit. It does differentiate between Active and Resting calories.

Also, with food, you look at the calories on the packet, again its a guide as your body processes things differently, some stuff uses a lot more energy to digest.

A 300 calorie steak for example, a those calories will go to digest that Protein, where if you have 300 calories of carbs, its 10 percent or less so you get more energy.

But, my thinking is, look at what my watch said I have used and tot up what I have shoved in my face and if the former is greater than the latter by a good margin then I should lose weight, which seems to be working thus far.

Did it before in 2017 and got down to 14 1/2 stone, having peaked at 18 st 2, dont make a habit of taking photos in changing rooms (been told about that...) but my wife wanted to see what a gym t shirt looked like before I bought it, life got in the way, redundancy and stuff and some back on.

[J4CKO]

Went outside, on the actual road for a couple of hours today, for the first time in two weeks today.

Couldnt get gong, jelly legs for about 15 miles, then kind of picked up a bit, just struggled which was disappointing as was hoping to feel a bit of an improvement after a few weeks of Zwift and being a bit lighter.

[J4CKO]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

I noticed some improvement through a general malaise, and a chap on a Cervelo was behind me for a while and then went past and did that overtake but go actually no faster thing, so for about three miles he kept looking round, yep still here.

Then pulls over for some reason...

Felt hint of improvement through a wall of "meh"

Had the biggest dirty burger I have seen for a while tonight, think I just need a proper feed and a decent sleep. kids appeared home at 1 am and 6 am last night, knackered !

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

J4CKO said:

Went outside, on the actual road for a couple of hours today, for the first time in two weeks today.

Couldnt get gong, jelly legs for about 15 miles, then kind of picked up a bit, just struggled which was disappointing as was hoping to feel a bit of an improvement after a few weeks of Zwift and being a bit lighter.

Depends how much you've ridden on the previous 48hrs. It could just be an element of fatigue, muscle or CV.

It was a cold grotty day yesterday - I went out with a pal for 3.5hrs, took me a good 30 to warm up and him almost an hour.

Try taking a couple of days rest beforehand next time. You're near me....I'll gladly take you out!

Yeah, went on Zwift on Sat, went out for a decent walk, might just be me getting old

Will have to sort something out for next weekend, you sure you want me slowing you down and cramping your style ?

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

J4CKO said:

Ares said:

J4CKO said:

Went outside, on the actual road for a couple of hours today, for the first time in two weeks today.

Couldnt get gong, jelly legs for about 15 miles, then kind of picked up a bit, just struggled which was disappointing as was hoping to feel a bit of an improvement after a few weeks of Zwift and being a bit lighter.

Depends how much you've ridden on the previous 48hrs. It could just be an element of fatigue, muscle or CV.

It was a cold grotty day yesterday - I went out with a pal for 3.5hrs, took me a good 30 to warm up and him almost an hour.

Try taking a couple of days rest beforehand next time. You're near me....I'll gladly take you out!

Yeah, went on Zwift on Sat, went out for a decent walk, might just be me getting old

Will have to sort something out for next weekend, you sure you want me slowing you down and cramping your style ?

That will be it. Try 48hrs rest before you go out next time.

Happy to take you out! Weekends are a bit busy for the next 2 (fresh out of lockdown ), good for 90mins weekday, over over the festive break.

Yeah, that would be good, am around over the festive period, am covering the Wednesday morning but that will most likely be, log on, have a look round and log off.

Had a go before, failed on the Wringer at a higher level with 515 watt intervals on the 8th one, felt a bit weird so stopped and did a massive burp Will try again tomorrow and aim for 450 watts.

Then realised that my son had gone out and left me the keys, but critically not the ones for the front door so had to try the back, which s behind a 6 ft gate that I managed to get over and am feeling rather pleased with myself that it didnt involve splintered wood, or bones ! The pratt had left the back door open.

[J4CKO]

Had another go at "The Wringer" today after my fail at 250 FTP with the 515 Watt intervals, at 220 it gives you 450 Watt intervals which I managed, I wont say easily but I could have gone a smidge higher.


I was feeling crap last week, had a look at the various graphs on Apple Health that I havent really taken much notice of them, but looked at the VO2 max one as it gets populated when I select the walking workout when I take the dog out. Its obviously only sort of simulated but if its inaccurate its at least consistently so.

It tanked by over 5, from 35 around the 10th November down to under 30 on the 28th and over the last few days its steadily going back up and can see the plot on the graph, what would cause that ?

[J4CKO]

Also, with cycling on the road there is a degree of risk taking like how fast you descend, whether you cut corners or run red lights, how you deal with and traffic you encounter and all that. Its amazing what people will do for a Strava segment.

And have encountered the cyclist vs runner thing, chap I worked with did a Marathon, ran regularly and was a very occasional cyclist yet couldn't keep up with me on a bike, which as you will understand is pitiful

[J4CKO]

Managed "The Wringer" at the 225 FTP which has 460 Watt intervals and it felt fairly comfortable. I think the intervals work quite well for me as despite not being that strict (But not going mad) diet wise weight is coming off, am combining it with a 2 to 4 mile walk every evening as well. Down to 227 pounds, so 10 pounds or so off.

[J4CKO]

defblade said:

J4CKO said:

Managed "The Wringer" at the 225 FTP which has 460 Watt intervals and it felt fairly comfortable. I think the intervals work quite well for me as despite not being that strict (But not going mad) diet wise weight is coming off, am combining it with a 2 to 4 mile walk every evening as well. Down to 227 pounds, so 10 pounds or so off.

I've just been reading "Fast after 50" by Joe Friel, he's very keen on interval work like that... but not all the time!
Funnily enough, I did the same workout yesterday, @238FTP so 490w on the highs... it was hard work for me towards the end of each interval, but had enough gap before the next one... just about, by the last 3

I have felt a bit weird today, didnt sleep last night and not sure if I didnt overdo it a bit but might have been the curry the wife made, which was very nice but think it upset my stomach a bit.

But, will have another go later in the week.

[J4CKO]

Ares said:

lufbramatt said:

Intense exercise makes the body release the cortisol (stress) hormone which stops you sleeping until hormone levels reside.

ditto any physical (or emotional) stress inducing activity.

I train first thing. Bike 5.30/5.40am, gym at 8.10am. On the rare occasions I do even a light session in the evening, I can't sleep for at least 90mins, and I'm usually asleep within seconds of my head hitting the pillow.

Yeah, doesnt pay to exercise too late, I did take the dog for a pretty brisk walk at 10 PM, then came back and made a coffee, which in hindsight seems a daft thing to do.

Plus was looking at a car today so had that going round in my head.

[J4CKO]

Went for an Zwift session today and 15 mins in just as I was getting into it Zwift locked up, annoying so started again and had a go at a workout called Jon's Mix which was a good one, nice bit of variety, not as hard as The Wringer despite a slightly higher FTP setting (230) but pretty good. I like the workouts as reduces my tendency to amble