Wheels causing twitchy handling?
Discussion
My bike gets "twitchy" once over speeds of about 32mph, which makes downhill road sections a bit stressful, especially if i am in a group as it feels like i wander about a fair bit as the bike doesn't want to stay in a straight line. Seems worse when its windy, but it doesn't need to be blowing hard to make it a nervous descent.
Its fitted with a pair of Vision 42 carbon/aluminium wheels which seem pretty good - light weight, look nice, spin straight, but might they be the cause of the twitchy handling? They aren't the deepest of rims, but maybe they are just aerodynamically poor.
I'm thinking of swapping them over to a pair of lower-profile alloy rims, which will probably be heavier, but I don't want to spend the money and then find that it doesn't improve the handling.
Anyone got any experience of twitchy bikes? Or are they all like that, and i just need to get used to it?
Its fitted with a pair of Vision 42 carbon/aluminium wheels which seem pretty good - light weight, look nice, spin straight, but might they be the cause of the twitchy handling? They aren't the deepest of rims, but maybe they are just aerodynamically poor.
I'm thinking of swapping them over to a pair of lower-profile alloy rims, which will probably be heavier, but I don't want to spend the money and then find that it doesn't improve the handling.
Anyone got any experience of twitchy bikes? Or are they all like that, and i just need to get used to it?
What you refer to is also known as death wobble.
It’s a resonant vibration in the frame. There are many supposed fixes for it: don’t hold the handlebars quite so tightly being the one trotted out most often. Also: take your weight slightly off the saddle, check your headset is tight (almost always never the culprit), change your stem length, reseat your front wheel in the front fork drop outs (worked like magic for me once coming down Alpe d’Huez - not somewhere you want death wobble), bin the frame and start again.
It’s a resonant vibration in the frame. There are many supposed fixes for it: don’t hold the handlebars quite so tightly being the one trotted out most often. Also: take your weight slightly off the saddle, check your headset is tight (almost always never the culprit), change your stem length, reseat your front wheel in the front fork drop outs (worked like magic for me once coming down Alpe d’Huez - not somewhere you want death wobble), bin the frame and start again.
OP - is the bike just wandering (with or without winds?) or is the death wobble / oscillation?
https://www.cyclingtips.com/2020/07/bicycle-speed-...
I have 50mm carbon rims on one of my bikes and if it's particularly windy, I will get buffeted or "nudged" when passing gates in hedges or other openings and a cross-wind can hit you.
I've had a death wobble once and it was not nice. I thought I'd be all "pro" and rather than descent on the drops, would aero tuck with my hands each side of the stem. I'll never know how I didn't visit a hedge or hit the tarmac but somehow stayed upright.
https://www.cyclingtips.com/2020/07/bicycle-speed-...
I have 50mm carbon rims on one of my bikes and if it's particularly windy, I will get buffeted or "nudged" when passing gates in hedges or other openings and a cross-wind can hit you.
I've had a death wobble once and it was not nice. I thought I'd be all "pro" and rather than descent on the drops, would aero tuck with my hands each side of the stem. I'll never know how I didn't visit a hedge or hit the tarmac but somehow stayed upright.
Edited by Harpoon on Monday 27th March 16:07
100% possible. Aero is weird and constructive interference is a b!tch.
Have you tried a different pressure? It won’t change the aero, but the additional pneumatic trail can calm things down.
The other possibility is rider related. Keep a gentle grip on the bars, resist the natural reaction which is to grip them harder.
Other possibilities include slack head or wheel bearings.
Try other wheels too!
Have you tried a different pressure? It won’t change the aero, but the additional pneumatic trail can calm things down.
The other possibility is rider related. Keep a gentle grip on the bars, resist the natural reaction which is to grip them harder.
Other possibilities include slack head or wheel bearings.
Try other wheels too!
Harpoon said:
OP - is the bike just wandering (with or without winds?) or is the death wobble / oscillation?
https://www.cyclingtips.com/2020/07/bicycle-speed-...
I have 50mm carbon rims on one of my bikes and if it's particularly windy, I will get buffeted or "nudged" when passing gates in hedges or other openings and a cross-wind can hit you.
I've had a death wobble once and it was not nice. I thought I'd be all "pro" and rather than descent on the drops, would aero tuck with my hands each side of the stem. I'll never know how I didn't visit a hedge or hit the tarmac but somehow stayed upright.
It's not as bad as that guy in the video gets, but maybe i just bottle it before I get that fast https://www.cyclingtips.com/2020/07/bicycle-speed-...
I have 50mm carbon rims on one of my bikes and if it's particularly windy, I will get buffeted or "nudged" when passing gates in hedges or other openings and a cross-wind can hit you.
I've had a death wobble once and it was not nice. I thought I'd be all "pro" and rather than descent on the drops, would aero tuck with my hands each side of the stem. I'll never know how I didn't visit a hedge or hit the tarmac but somehow stayed upright.
Edited by Harpoon on Monday 27th March 16:07
It's not a side-to-side oscillation, more an unpredictable twitch. I'd say it is worse when going past gates or openings, but it is hard to tell as much of my rides are on the moors, where there are few walls/hedges on the big hills. I've tried loosening my grip on the bars, which didn't seem to have much of an effect.
My "winter" bike, is much more stable at speed (and is also 3kg heavier)
boyse7en said:
It's not as bad as that guy in the video gets, but maybe i just bottle it before I get that fast
It's not a side-to-side oscillation, more an unpredictable twitch. I'd say it is worse when going past gates or openings, but it is hard to tell as much of my rides are on the moors, where there are few walls/hedges on the big hills. I've tried loosening my grip on the bars, which didn't seem to have much of an effect.
My "winter" bike, is much more stable at speed (and is also 3kg heavier)
Ah - that doesn’t sound like death wobble at all! It sounds more like you, the frame and the wheel set acting like a sail caught in a crosswind. What frame is it? Something that looks like (eg) a Giant Propel has a relatively large lateral surface area, and being quite light can be moved around a bit by a crosswind, particularly a gusting crosswind of the sort you can get passing a gap in a hedge. Add to that deep profile light wheels and you get the picture…It's not a side-to-side oscillation, more an unpredictable twitch. I'd say it is worse when going past gates or openings, but it is hard to tell as much of my rides are on the moors, where there are few walls/hedges on the big hills. I've tried loosening my grip on the bars, which didn't seem to have much of an effect.
My "winter" bike, is much more stable at speed (and is also 3kg heavier)
OP, deeper section wheels will definitely feel twitchier than standard wheels, and you will feel even small gusts of wind through the bars. Once you get used to it, you can let it happen without reacting too much.
Some wheels are worse than others, and some of the latest deep section wheels are far better at dealing with cross winds than other wheels.
Maybe the wheels you have are particularly susceptible? If you can try standard wheels you will at least be able to identify the cause.
Good deep section wheels don’t necessarily cause issues even at the highest speeds, but as I said, some are definite worse than others. Hitting 50+ mph is a pretty common occurrence on downhills, so it’s not the speed, in itself, that’s the issue.
Some wheels are worse than others, and some of the latest deep section wheels are far better at dealing with cross winds than other wheels.
Maybe the wheels you have are particularly susceptible? If you can try standard wheels you will at least be able to identify the cause.
Good deep section wheels don’t necessarily cause issues even at the highest speeds, but as I said, some are definite worse than others. Hitting 50+ mph is a pretty common occurrence on downhills, so it’s not the speed, in itself, that’s the issue.
andyeds1234 said:
OP, deeper section wheels will definitely feel twitchier than standard wheels, and you will feel even small gusts of wind through the bars. Once you get used to it, you can let it happen without reacting too much.
Some wheels are worse than others, and some of the latest deep section wheels are far better at dealing with cross winds than other wheels.
Maybe the wheels you have are particularly susceptible? If you can try standard wheels you will at least be able to identify the cause.
Good deep section wheels don’t necessarily cause issues even at the highest speeds, but as I said, some are definite worse than others. Hitting 50+ mph is a pretty common occurrence on downhills, so it’s not the speed, in itself, that’s the issue.
The speed in itself is definitely not the issue, as I hit 45mph on my winter bike without issue. Some wheels are worse than others, and some of the latest deep section wheels are far better at dealing with cross winds than other wheels.
Maybe the wheels you have are particularly susceptible? If you can try standard wheels you will at least be able to identify the cause.
Good deep section wheels don’t necessarily cause issues even at the highest speeds, but as I said, some are definite worse than others. Hitting 50+ mph is a pretty common occurrence on downhills, so it’s not the speed, in itself, that’s the issue.
I might try swapping over the front wheel (the rears aren't cross-compatible) and see if it makes a difference. If it does, I'll be on the lookout for some old fashioned rims!
It might well be the wheels. My Canyon came with Reynolds assaults in 40mm which were terrifying in anything over a 5mph breeze, any sort of cross wind felt like death was imminent. Sold them and replaced with a set Miche 38 RX something or other. Never given wind a second thought soon as they were on, bike is firmly planted whatever the wind speed. I doubt it’s you if im honest
It might well be the wheels. My Canyon came with Reynolds assaults in 40mm which were terrifying in anything over a 5mph breeze, any sort of cross wind felt like death was imminent. Sold them and replaced with a set Miche 38 RX something or other. Never given wind a second thought soon as they were on, bike is firmly planted whatever the wind speed. I doubt it’s you if im honest
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