I think I'm done with road...
Discussion
nickfrog said:
It's brilliant isn't it? We're taking the train to Eastbourne next month to ride back to Findon and effectively do a half SDW. I am sure it could be done on the road but I can't see the fun in that.
What? Ride up Butts Lane? Then past Beachy Head on one of the nicest bits of road in the SE? Maybe along Highnover to Alfriston? Or through Exceat to Cadence cafe and maybe the Longman brewery? Then the fantastic new cycle lane besides the A27, you can have a go at Bo Peep and Firle Beacon? Over at Glynde and on to Lewes for a couple of beers? Then back along the road at the bottom of the Downs, maybe have a go at Streat and Ditchling? You don't know what you're missing! I'd start at 6 am on a Sunday though, get some of it done before the a
holes get up...nickfrog said:
That's a fair comment and I should have said the off road route appeals much more to me, including thanks to the absence of cars and the ability to not have to pick my time to avoid them.
There are some awesome routes around here, on and off road. Plus, so many nice places to stop and have a drink. Hardly leaves any time to cycle!!!As a professionally trained car driver, motorbiker and cyclist I will freely state thr standards and behaviour that I've seen on UK roads is very substandard.
Drive throughout Europe - back over the ferry and it's absolutely carnage.
Brake testing, indicator means 'I have the right to move right now into your lane', speeding (why can't I it's scameras isn't it) etc etc.
The good thing about a motorbike compared to a car or bike is when someone does drive badly they can't escape you at their window asking them calmly about what they just did.
Drive throughout Europe - back over the ferry and it's absolutely carnage.
Brake testing, indicator means 'I have the right to move right now into your lane', speeding (why can't I it's scameras isn't it) etc etc.
The good thing about a motorbike compared to a car or bike is when someone does drive badly they can't escape you at their window asking them calmly about what they just did.
As a motorcyclist, exposing yourself to such risk by confronting car drivers and generating conflict is really unwise. The general public are psychopaths, boiling over in a world of deadlines and social media, caught up in a ton of work related stress and at breaking point with financial and emotional pressures. The road is generally the environment where the pressure cooker explodes, and on a motorcycle you are only one purposeful swerve away from being seriously injured by these people. I have seen it before and it continues to happen.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
Random_Person said:
As a motorcyclist, exposing yourself to such risk by confronting car drivers and generating conflict is really unwise. The general public are psychopaths, boiling over in a world of deadlines and social media, caught up in a ton of work related stress and at breaking point with financial and emotional pressures. The road is generally the environment where the pressure cooker explodes, and on a motorcycle you are only one purposeful swerve away from being seriously injured by these people. I have seen it before and it continues to happen.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
I always wonder what people are thinking when they drive poorly, and would love to hear that logic/justification...but I know the only person I can really influence is me and any interaction is likely to end in confrontation, which won't help anyone. I have only reached this conclusion through unpleasant interactions, some initiated by me and some by other road users. I believe it's know as adulting 
Its like most things in life, it just isn't worth it. There is never any significant change to the status quo, whether you decide to get involved in one confrontation or be one of those cycling camera wearing social media hitmen - what improvements to the appalling state of the UK roads is achieved by either? None. Absolutely none. Therefore, accept, and move on.
Hugo Stiglitz said:
As a professionally trained car driver, motorbiker and cyclist I will freely state thr standards and behaviour that I've seen on UK roads is very substandard.
Drive throughout Europe - back over the ferry and it's absolutely carnage.
Brake testing, indicator means 'I have the right to move right now into your lane', speeding (why can't I it's scameras isn't it) etc etc.
The good thing about a motorbike compared to a car or bike is when someone does drive badly they can't escape you at their window asking them calmly about what they just did.
This annoys the sDrive throughout Europe - back over the ferry and it's absolutely carnage.
Brake testing, indicator means 'I have the right to move right now into your lane', speeding (why can't I it's scameras isn't it) etc etc.
The good thing about a motorbike compared to a car or bike is when someone does drive badly they can't escape you at their window asking them calmly about what they just did.
t out of me. People indicate and automatically think that it gave them the right to move into you. And if you don't back off you get "the look" as you overtake them... What the hell is wrong with them?My best mate was stationary on a traffic light and the car that stopped next to him started turning left onto him. He banged the window and the confused lady told him "but I indicated". He had to explain to her that two vehicles can't occupy the same space at the same time and that indicators mean intent, not right of way...
Random_Person said:
Its like most things in life, it just isn't worth it. There is never any significant change to the status quo, whether you decide to get involved in one confrontation or be one of those cycling camera wearing social media hitmen - what improvements to the appalling state of the UK roads is achieved by either? None. Absolutely none. Therefore, accept, and move on.
Staying into dangerous territory here, and I don't want to send the thread spiralling off into that rabbit hole...but I have zero issues with people being reported to Old Bill for phone use or other carpy road behaviour. fk 'em, they know what they are doing is wrong so they get what they deserve; every prosecution is a win in my opinion.But therein lies the misunderstanding. What do you think happens if you submit a report of bad driving to the old bill? Depending on where you live, its is a lottery with how it will be dealt with. I know for one particularly large area of the UK, such submissions are filed and instantly closed with no further action. If you happen to live in a sleepier county that has the appetite and systems to progress such reports, they may get a "letter" in some circumstances. Generally it is rare / by exception that any proactive follow up or action is taken by reports of poor driving.
trails said:
Random_Person said:
As a motorcyclist, exposing yourself to such risk by confronting car drivers and generating conflict is really unwise. The general public are psychopaths, boiling over in a world of deadlines and social media, caught up in a ton of work related stress and at breaking point with financial and emotional pressures. The road is generally the environment where the pressure cooker explodes, and on a motorcycle you are only one purposeful swerve away from being seriously injured by these people. I have seen it before and it continues to happen.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
I always wonder what people are thinking when they drive poorly, and would love to hear that logic/justification...but I know the only person I can really influence is me and any interaction is likely to end in confrontation, which won't help anyone. I have only reached this conclusion through unpleasant interactions, some initiated by me and some by other road users. I believe it's know as adulting I did the best thing that came to my mind, I told him the truth. That I was frustrated that he cut me off and it was a moment of red mist, nothing personal. So he gave me his hand, gave me some advice that it may be a dangerous thing to do if the other driver was a nutter and we parted ways. He was incredibly cool about it and made me think better about my actions. A very nice way to de-escalate things. Obviously it was luck, but not all confrontations end up badly.
Random_Person said:
But therein lies the misunderstanding. What do you think happens if you submit a report of bad driving to the old bill? Depending on where you live, its is a lottery with how it will be dealt with. I know for one particularly large area of the UK, such submissions are filed and instantly closed with no further action. If you happen to live in a sleepier county that has the appetite and systems to progress such reports, they may get a "letter" in some circumstances. Generally it is rare / by exception that any proactive follow up or action is taken by reports of poor driving.
There is no misunderstanding on my part thanks, plenty of info online about how successful certain high profile submitters of driving infringement videos are if you care to look.Anyways, as per my post above lets no go down that rabbit hole, it will ruin the thread
Siao said:
I had a road rage incident years ago, when I swore to someone that cut me off, maybe a finger was raised too! Then the guy (much older) stopped the car, came to my open window and asked me about the gesture and thing I said.
I did the best thing that came to my mind, I told him the truth. That I was frustrated that he cut me off and it was a moment of red mist, nothing personal. So he gave me his hand, gave me some advice that it may be a dangerous thing to do if the other driver was a nutter and we parted ways. He was incredibly cool about it and made me think better about my actions. A very nice way to de-escalate things. Obviously it was luck, but not all confrontations end up badly.
Whilst he was calm and considered, just getting out of the car makes him the aaggressor...so he needed to take a leaf out of his own book I did the best thing that came to my mind, I told him the truth. That I was frustrated that he cut me off and it was a moment of red mist, nothing personal. So he gave me his hand, gave me some advice that it may be a dangerous thing to do if the other driver was a nutter and we parted ways. He was incredibly cool about it and made me think better about my actions. A very nice way to de-escalate things. Obviously it was luck, but not all confrontations end up badly.
Marriage seems to be an extreme way to de-escalate though
Random_Person said:
As a motorcyclist, exposing yourself to such risk by confronting car drivers and generating conflict is really unwise. The general public are psychopaths, boiling over in a world of deadlines and social media, caught up in a ton of work related stress and at breaking point with financial and emotional pressures. The road is generally the environment where the pressure cooker explodes, and on a motorcycle you are only one purposeful swerve away from being seriously injured by these people. I have seen it before and it continues to happen.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
When I first started commuting to work on my bicycle I was the angry man, trying to educate motorists on how not to potentially kill vulnerable road users. I regularly would stop at car windows and make clear how they'd almost just killed me, adrenalin pumping. It took a while but I did come to realise that it was an absolutely pointless exercise. Those who were deliberately dangerous hated cyclists and engaging with them clearly just supported their opinion of us and those who were accidentally dangerous were just completely oblivious to their own shortcomings and having a red faced cyclist at their window wasn't going to change their ingrained driving habits.Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
As such, I changed to the grey man (admittedly covered in hi-viz and100 lumens lights front and rear and try to keep my distance from those around me. My route to work has been carefully sculpted over 10 years to take me the least confrontational route into town. I avoid major roads, roundabouts and minimise turns across traffic. The route takes longer, but it makes me less stressed and less likely to be killed.
Going against the grain of this thread I probably commuted to work off and on for around 10 years, but haven't done so in earnest for the last 4 years. All that is about to change - I have bought a new gravel bike with hydraulic disc brakes and fitted mudguards and pannier bags. My new lights should arrive this weekend, then I have every intention of starting again next week. Fingers crossed it goes well.
trails said:
Siao said:
I had a road rage incident years ago, when I swore to someone that cut me off, maybe a finger was raised too! Then the guy (much older) stopped the car, came to my open window and asked me about the gesture and thing I said.
I did the best thing that came to my mind, I told him the truth. That I was frustrated that he cut me off and it was a moment of red mist, nothing personal. So he gave me his hand, gave me some advice that it may be a dangerous thing to do if the other driver was a nutter and we parted ways. He was incredibly cool about it and made me think better about my actions. A very nice way to de-escalate things. Obviously it was luck, but not all confrontations end up badly.
Whilst he was calm and considered, just getting out of the car makes him the aaggressor...so he needed to take a leaf out of his own book I did the best thing that came to my mind, I told him the truth. That I was frustrated that he cut me off and it was a moment of red mist, nothing personal. So he gave me his hand, gave me some advice that it may be a dangerous thing to do if the other driver was a nutter and we parted ways. He was incredibly cool about it and made me think better about my actions. A very nice way to de-escalate things. Obviously it was luck, but not all confrontations end up badly.
Marriage seems to be an extreme way to de-escalate though
I am just about divorcing, so didn't learn my lesson!
JQ said:
Random_Person said:
As a motorcyclist, exposing yourself to such risk by confronting car drivers and generating conflict is really unwise. The general public are psychopaths, boiling over in a world of deadlines and social media, caught up in a ton of work related stress and at breaking point with financial and emotional pressures. The road is generally the environment where the pressure cooker explodes, and on a motorcycle you are only one purposeful swerve away from being seriously injured by these people. I have seen it before and it continues to happen.
Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
When I first started commuting to work on my bicycle I was the angry man, trying to educate motorists on how not to potentially kill vulnerable road users. I regularly would stop at car windows and make clear how they'd almost just killed me, adrenalin pumping. It took a while but I did come to realise that it was an absolutely pointless exercise. Those who were deliberately dangerous hated cyclists and engaging with them clearly just supported their opinion of us and those who were accidentally dangerous were just completely oblivious to their own shortcomings and having a red faced cyclist at their window wasn't going to change their ingrained driving habits.Self preservation is absolute key, and this is achieved by being the "grey man". Much better to be a passive observer and stay alive, than try and influence something that cannot be influenced as it is already ruined, and end up dead.
As such, I changed to the grey man (admittedly covered in hi-viz and100 lumens lights front and rear and try to keep my distance from those around me. My route to work has been carefully sculpted over 10 years to take me the least confrontational route into town. I avoid major roads, roundabouts and minimise turns across traffic. The route takes longer, but it makes me less stressed and less likely to be killed.
Going against the grain of this thread I probably commuted to work off and on for around 10 years, but haven't done so in earnest for the last 4 years. All that is about to change - I have bought a new gravel bike with hydraulic disc brakes and fitted mudguards and pannier bags. My new lights should arrive this weekend, then I have every intention of starting again next week. Fingers crossed it goes well.
Anyway, good luck, I'm sure you'll love your new gravel adventures!
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