I think I'm done with road...

[nickfrog]

I agree the anti-cycling sentiment is awful. I also agree that de-humanising someone because they happen to be on a push bike ("bloody cyclist") is utterly absurd.

Cyclists are no better or worse as human beings, just a little fitter.

And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.

Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.

There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".

[JEA1K]

nickfrog said:

Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.

There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".

Agreed. There are poor bahaviors and attitudes on both sides ... as always, sadly its the extremist elements amongst us. There are those that make a genuine mistake or a slight error in judgement which, although it may result in a moment of panic, if there is no harm caused, we can only hope that the responsible party 'learns a lesson'. These are still the majority of confrontations on the road rather than deliberate moves.

I mean, if the awful, vindictive drivers were in the majority, then we'd all be dead, right?!

[thepritch]

nickfrog said:

And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.

There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".

I don’t find it controversial at all. 100% agree. Sadly we’re all lumped in as a ‘group’ to the lowest common denominator. As the general public increasingly get told how bad cyclists are, they’ll of course only see bad behaviour.

When an angry driver shouts that we should all take a cycling test to get a license, I can’t argue, I tend to agree.

[Hugo Stiglitz]

You could take a cycle test, be advanced, pay £300 cycle tax a year, use cycle numberplate and you'd still get the same risk.

That's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.

My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.

This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.

They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.

[Siao]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

You could take a cycle test, be advanced, pay £300 cycle tax a year, use cycle numberplate and you'd still get the same risk.

That's because alot of drivers are bullies. They use a metal box to hide in. They wouldn't push you out of the way in the street but in a car? They can hide behind that steering wheel and escape afterwards.

My son won't cycle on the road and I'll never let him.

This is from someone who would spend all my money on bikes.

They are installing cycle lanes all round my area, they are just going to make it worse as drivers will think 'get off my road now'.

Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Ironically I shouted at a driver last week, crossing on foot he took the corner fast to avoid waiting for us to cross. I shouted at him. He slammed on, called me a few names then jumped out.

As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.

Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!

[Siao]

Hugo Stiglitz said:

Ironically I shouted at a driver last week, crossing on foot he took the corner fast to avoid waiting for us to cross. I shouted at him. He slammed on, called me a few names then jumped out.

As I was engaging him a cyclist pulled up and said to him repeatedly 'why did you drive so closely to me back there' etc.

Yes I should shut up but if I see bad behaviour I challenge it!

It doesn't surprise me that another person called him out! It would be so funny, if it wasn't so sad. These people can't even see what they are doing wrong. They can't be arsed sometimes and accelerate to avoid stopping for pedestrians, it happened to me with a bus recently. A freaking bus!

Brighton is fine, you get the occasional idiot, the annoying cyclists as well, the red light jumpers and the full-face masked Deliveroo maniacs with their illegal electric bikes, but it is generally ok. I feel generally safe to cycle here, stupid Beemer driver or not.

[JulianHJ]

Siao said:

Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece

The answer to this is front and rear cameras and the Op Crackdown website. It's a pain, but the more cyclists use it, the more prosecutions there will be. This will lead to greater public awareness and hopefully bad drivers will think twice before putting cyclists at risk.

[Siao]

JulianHJ said:

Siao said:

Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece

The answer to this is front and rear cameras and the Op Crackdown website. It's a pain, but the more cyclists use it, the more prosecutions there will be. This will lead to greater public awareness and hopefully bad drivers will think twice before putting cyclists at risk.

You are right, of course, but I never had a need for them. I know that "they are expensive" is not an excuse, I just never thought of getting any.

[emicen]

Siao said:

JulianHJ said:

Siao said:

Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece

The answer to this is front and rear cameras and the Op Crackdown website. It's a pain, but the more cyclists use it, the more prosecutions there will be. This will lead to greater public awareness and hopefully bad drivers will think twice before putting cyclists at risk.

You are right, of course, but I never had a need for them. I know that "they are expensive" is not an excuse, I just never thought of getting any.

The sad reality is, this is the way it’s going to go.

The Highway Code revision was just met with a load of tantrums from drivers and has had zero impact on behaviours.

People getting prosecuted will be the only thing that changes their attitude on the road.

Of course up here, we don’t even have access to such online reporting tools as there isn’t budget to implement and resource it. Now they’re paying permanent overtime for 40 officers worth of resource to investigate online hurtful words, I doubt it will change any time soon either.

[Siao]

emicen said:

Siao said:

JulianHJ said:

Siao said:

Sigh, I had another close call this morning, even though I used a small, narrow residential road in Brighton to avoid traffic. A Beemer was behind me and I could hear it accelerating, not slowing down. Then he squeezed past me, barely a few inches from my elbow, didn't stop at the stop sign and sped off to the distance. I shouted at him, but what was the point? Cowards hiding inside a metal box as you said... At least I'm in one piece

The answer to this is front and rear cameras and the Op Crackdown website. It's a pain, but the more cyclists use it, the more prosecutions there will be. This will lead to greater public awareness and hopefully bad drivers will think twice before putting cyclists at risk.

You are right, of course, but I never had a need for them. I know that "they are expensive" is not an excuse, I just never thought of getting any.

The sad reality is, this is the way it’s going to go.

The Highway Code revision was just met with a load of tantrums from drivers and has had zero impact on behaviours.

People getting prosecuted will be the only thing that changes their attitude on the road.

Of course up here, we don’t even have access to such online reporting tools as there isn’t budget to implement and resource it. Now they’re paying permanent overtime for 40 officers worth of resource to investigate online hurtful words, I doubt it will change any time soon either.

It is sad indeed. Drivers not wanting to take responsibility (although I'd say the same holds for any road user, pedestrians included). They need to take this seriously, I remember years ago the police stopped my mate and his girlfriend in Brighton when they crossed a red light while cycling. They gave them a whole speech and showed them inside a bus, what little visibility the driver has, talked to them about the dangers of crossing a light, etc. Sounds silly, but everyone needs reminding sometimes, even for basic stuff. I haven't seen anything like this recently, they just about gave up it feels. Drivers need to be reminded how dangerous it is, especially the big vehicles ones.

I still remember this video and it gives me the chills:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV-rhiGRFTE&ab...

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Wow.

[Daveyraveygravey]

Siao said:

It is sad indeed. Drivers not wanting to take responsibility (although I'd say the same holds for any road user, pedestrians included). They need to take this seriously, I remember years ago the police stopped my mate and his girlfriend in Brighton when they crossed a red light while cycling. They gave them a whole speech and showed them inside a bus, what little visibility the driver has, talked to them about the dangers of crossing a light, etc. Sounds silly, but everyone needs reminding sometimes, even for basic stuff. I haven't seen anything like this recently, they just about gave up it feels. Drivers need to be reminded how dangerous it is, especially the big vehicles ones.

I still remember this video and it gives me the chills:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV-rhiGRFTE&ab...

Part of the issue is there are NO traffic cops any more, just speed cameras and cctv. What traffic cops there are are on the motorway, attending accidents and trying to keep some flow.

[Daveyraveygravey]

nickfrog said:

I agree the anti-cycling sentiment is awful. I also agree that de-humanising someone because they happen to be on a push bike ("bloody cyclist") is utterly absurd.

Cyclists are no better or worse as human beings, just a little fitter.

And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.

Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.

There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".

Not sure this is true, maybe in the vaguest possible terms. The reactions of most cyclists are because of the awful behaviour of drivers, whether that is deliberate or just ignorance of what good driving is. What possible reason could bad drivers have for their behaviour? 85 people a day are killed or seriously injured on our roads, every bloody day. And almost every one of them is down to a driver, not a cyclist or a pedestrian. Almost every one of them could be avoided. Drivers pick and choose which laws they obey, and they make up laws they think cyclists should obey. There are some drivers who think because they haven't actually hit you with their vehicle, you've nothing to complain about. There are some drivers that don't hit you with their vehicle because they think the metal is too precious.

[heebeegeetee]

Daveyraveygravey said:

Not sure this is true, maybe in the vaguest possible terms. The reactions of most cyclists are because of the awful behaviour of drivers, whether that is deliberate or just ignorance of what good driving is. What possible reason could bad drivers have for their behaviour? 85 people a day are killed or seriously injured on our roads, every bloody day. And almost every one of them is down to a driver, not a cyclist or a pedestrian. Almost every one of them could be avoided. Drivers pick and choose which laws they obey, and they make up laws they think cyclists should obey. There are some drivers who think because they haven't actually hit you with their vehicle, you've nothing to complain about. There are some drivers that don't hit you with their vehicle because they think the metal is too precious.

Absolutely spot on with this.

[Siao]

Daveyraveygravey said:

Siao said:

It is sad indeed. Drivers not wanting to take responsibility (although I'd say the same holds for any road user, pedestrians included). They need to take this seriously, I remember years ago the police stopped my mate and his girlfriend in Brighton when they crossed a red light while cycling. They gave them a whole speech and showed them inside a bus, what little visibility the driver has, talked to them about the dangers of crossing a light, etc. Sounds silly, but everyone needs reminding sometimes, even for basic stuff. I haven't seen anything like this recently, they just about gave up it feels. Drivers need to be reminded how dangerous it is, especially the big vehicles ones.

I still remember this video and it gives me the chills:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV-rhiGRFTE&ab...

Part of the issue is there are NO traffic cops any more, just speed cameras and cctv. What traffic cops there are are on the motorway, attending accidents and trying to keep some flow.

You are right, I rarely see them nowadays. Didn't notice this before.

CCTV and speed cameras have limitations, they can only address part of the problem; they won't catch someone being drunk and driving erratically if they keep under the speed limit for example.

[nickfrog]

Daveyraveygravey said:

nickfrog said:

I agree the anti-cycling sentiment is awful. I also agree that de-humanising someone because they happen to be on a push bike ("bloody cyclist") is utterly absurd.

Cyclists are no better or worse as human beings, just a little fitter.

And there lies my main issue. Which is going to make me controversial.

Some cyclists react precisely how some people react to them being on the road, with hatred, bias and rage.

There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists who give the cycling community I belong to a bad name and fuel the anti-cycling prejudice by de-humanising drivers, "bloody drivers".

Not sure this is true, maybe in the vaguest possible terms. The reactions of most cyclists are because of the awful behaviour of drivers, whether that is deliberate or just ignorance of what good driving is. What possible reason could bad drivers have for their behaviour? 85 people a day are killed or seriously injured on our roads, every bloody day. And almost every one of them is down to a driver, not a cyclist or a pedestrian. Almost every one of them could be avoided. Drivers pick and choose which laws they obey, and they make up laws they think cyclists should obey. There are some drivers who think because they haven't actually hit you with their vehicle, you've nothing to complain about. There are some drivers that don't hit you with their vehicle because they think the metal is too precious.

When you say "most cyclists" you seem to agree with me when I say "There is a small but very vocal fringe of cycling activists".

Nothing vague at all. I come across them rarely but with worrying regularity.

Edited by nickfrog on Wednesday 17th April 15:17

[Castrol for a knave]

You only have to read the comments on a cycling related Facebook post or reel, to see how many mouth breathers are out there. These people drive and could end my life or turn me into a soup enthusiast, for no other reason than incompetence or spite.

We see it here from time to time, when the spacktards come out to whine and mither about cyclists, as if we are one homogenous lump of mung bean whittling, yoghurt plaiting, lentil frotters.

[Hugo Stiglitz]

Castrol for a knave said:

as if we are one homogenous lump of mung bean whittling, yoghurt plaiting, lentil frotters.

Although I don't eat that normally it does sound quite tasty!

[Rich Boy Spanner]

Castrol for a knave said:

You only have to read the comments on a cycling related Facebook post or reel, to see how many mouth breathers are out there. These people drive and could end my life or turn me into a soup enthusiast, for no other reason than incompetence or spite.

We see it here from time to time, when the spacktards come out to whine and mither about cyclists, as if we are one homogenous lump of mung bean whittling, yoghurt plaiting, lentil frotters.

If you are unlucky enough to ever read an article about cyclists in the god awful Daily Mail online the comments are so stupid and bigoted it's hard to believe these people can even type. Then you think of them in control of a car.
I gave up road riding years ago. Utter muppets in cars being the reason. I go mountain biking or I take my hybrid in the car to the coast and do a Lytham to Fleetwood and back ride. All on the costal / promenade path.