Discussion
fido said:
Ditto most of what has been said. Two 'problems' i remember were:-
1) detonation/pinking when using 95RON fuel in the summer
2) 5-speed 'box doesn't like block changes
1) detonation/pinking when using 95RON fuel in the summer
2) 5-speed 'box doesn't like block changes
I havent had any problems block changing in mine.
I've just changed the tyres on mine, makes a big difference. Car handles superbly now. I love the way it seems to corner with a tail out stance. I'd defy anyone to say this car doesnt handle better than practically any hot hatch.
Add to that the noise it makes and the way it looks, it really is a special and classic car for me. I had actually planned to ditch FWD cars when I was looking for a new one, but when I drove the teg I just had to have one.
Wonderful cars IMO.
pbirkett said:
I'd defy anyone to say this car doesnt handle better than practically any hot hatch.
Add to that the noise it makes and the way it looks, it really is a special and classic car for me. I had actually planned to ditch FWD cars when I was looking for a new one, but when I drove the teg I just had to have one.
Wonderful cars IMO.
Add to that the noise it makes and the way it looks, it really is a special and classic car for me. I had actually planned to ditch FWD cars when I was looking for a new one, but when I drove the teg I just had to have one.
Wonderful cars IMO.
EVO magazine agree with you too of course. Had mine three years+ now and still enjoy driving it. I've even bought a scooter so I can lessen the miles put on it from commuting
fido said:
the rear strut brace sits a few cm from rear of the car (if i recall correctly) so it hardly gets in the way of things.
That's a chassis brace. The cross-brace is an optional fit which mounts on top of the suspension towers...there're two black plastic6x8 sections which can be taken out to reveal the tower-tops.But yes, it's ridiculously practical...although as it's longer than a Focus that's not really surprising...
hey, if practicality wasn't a consideration i'd definitely choose an S2000 over a DC5, but i need to do the odd trip to B&Q, musical instruments, dead bodies, etc. looking at the prices though, you can now get a good '03 S2000 GT < £15k, and i'm guessing an '02/'03 DC5 is similar ... though i'd imagine being an import, it will also cost the same as the S2k to insure.
the DC5 is a good car, right? i mean it can't be that bad - has won the BTCC several times over, LSD, 220PS ...
anyway, i should start another thread.
the DC5 is a good car, right? i mean it can't be that bad - has won the BTCC several times over, LSD, 220PS ...
anyway, i should start another thread.
Edited by fido on Thursday 31st May 09:59
graememac said:
OK, next question...has anybody driven or owned the DC5 version, is it a better drivers car??
i could probably stretch to one but i presume being an import the insurance is expensive?
Been quoted about £470 for a DC2
Exactly the question that I was going to ask. Is the later car worth the premium. Haven't seen both side by side, but the interior appears much improved / modern.i could probably stretch to one but i presume being an import the insurance is expensive?
Been quoted about £470 for a DC2
mat205125 said:
Exactly the question that I was going to ask. Is the later car worth the premium. Haven't seen both side by side, but the interior appears much improved / modern.
I've owned the DC2 and it's a great car, an icon, no doubt about it. But the EP3 (CTR) is so much better & easier to drive in many respects - the delicious 6spd box being one of them (though somehow Honda have managed to f*k the 3rd gear on the new one, allegedly, but i digress). The DC5 is essentially a longer-wheelbase version of the EP3; similar ergonomics - expect the gearshift is on the floor again, and it remedies some of the faults with the EP3 (LSD, 20PS more, ...) so it's definitely a step in the right direction. It costs more (£15k for an '03?) but you get more, and it's still alot cheaper than the new Jap CTR (£23k OTR) which lacks that huge boot.http://www.litchfieldimports.co.uk/civic.asp
Soz, i feel i've spewed enough on this subject!
Edited by fido on Thursday 7th June 11:19
fido said:
mat205125 said:
Exactly the question that I was going to ask. Is the later car worth the premium. Haven't seen both side by side, but the interior appears much improved / modern.
I've owned the DC2 and it's a great car, an icon, no doubt about it. But the EP3 (CTR) is so much better & easier to drive in many respects - the delicious 6spd box being one of them (though somehow Honda have managed to f*k the 3rd gear on the new one, but i digress). The DC5 is essentially a longer-wheelbase version of the EP3; similar ergonomics - expect the gearshift is on the floor again, and it remedies some of the faults with the EP3 (LSD, 20PS more, ...) so it's definitely a step in the right direction. It costs more (£15k for an '03) but you get more, and it's still alot cheaper than the new Jap CTR (£23k new).http://www.litchfieldimports.co.uk/civic.asp
The EP3 CTR is nowhere NEAR the DC2 ITR from the perspective of driving experience. The 'box is sweeter, yes, and the engine is marginally more powerful/tractable. But it's got an extra 100kg to lug around, so real-world the 'teg, on-cam, is actually ever-so-slightly quicker.
General comparison:-
Grip - both have more than enough. DC2 is more progressive (and therefore fun) at the limit due to 15" rims with 55-profiles not 17"s with low-profiles.
Traction - DC2 wins every time as the EP3 hasn't got a diff. Oh, and the EP3 has those god-awful S03's, but they can be changed. DC2 will corner like it's hooked a lamp-post, the diff is very good.
Steering - EP3 is marginally more 'direct' than the DC2 due to the smaller sidewalls, but both turn in very well, and the feedback and 'instinctiveness' of the DC2 is miles ahead...this is the EP3's main weakspot...you just don't have much faith in knowing when the front wheels are going to go.
Handling - DC2 is an absolute hoot, and adopts the most delicious tail-out (but stable) cornering stance if set up properly. EP3 does have lift-off oversteer, but due to snappier limits and less feedback it's harder to control...I was getting the 'teg into 4-wheel drifts when I got it right!
Away from the full-on driving experience:-
Driving position - Both very good. DC2 is lower and more sporty, seats are 'snug' for those with expanding waistlines. I personally could do with something under my right thigh to give more support, as the long-travel clutch pedal can mean your right knee is unsupported if you're the wrong shape.
Noise - EP3 IS a little quieter, and the 6th gear helps cruising on M-ways. But neither are a Jag, lets face it. Oh, and the B18 is the best sounding 4-pot since they stopped using carbs (well, a tuned K-series with individual throttle-bodies (i.e. Caterham) sounds pretty tasty too).
Ride - EP3 feels marginally 'crashier' (sidewalls), but not a lot in it. Not worth worrying, certainly, you'll need a chiropractor with either one!
Economy - DC2 marginally better, despite the 6th gear on the EP3. I got up to 35 on a long cruise in a 'teg, but typically 29-32. EP3 I understand (don't know) is lucky to hit 30.
Interior - DC2 interior very dated. Seats are nice, steering wheel very nice...and that's about it.
Practicality - score draw - 'teg has larger boot, Civic has more sensible aperture.
In short, the EP3 is 'Type-R lite'...which is no disrespect to it as it's the more habitable car as a result. But it's lost a little something that the ITR and ATR have in spades.
Now...the DC5 (vs EP3). Has got a diff. Has got better steering, albeit still lacking in detail feedback. Looks better from outside, better seats inside (best of all 3 cars), interior probably marginally better than EP3, practicality on a par with DC2. Adjustability, IMHO, half-way between the two. Grip unbelievable on good tarmac...S2000 levels, IMHO. Ride crashiest of the 3, due to JDM suspension, which also upsets it on bumpy B-roads.
Summary: If I was only driving on smooth tarmac, and needed a practical, habitable every-day car, I'd be very tempted by a DC5 - as an all-round proposition it's VERY good. For the UK, and for ultimate fun, it's gotta be the DC2. But the DC2 will need more care/repairs due to the extra age/mileage. If you're seriously tempted by a DC5, go onto their forum and see if/how they've resolved the ride issue, and it could be a winner!
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