Nurburgring 2018

Author
Discussion

ecain63

10,588 posts

176 months

Wednesday 26th September 2018
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Twitchy

Adenauer

18,581 posts

237 months

Thursday 27th September 2018
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DN20 - Today.

Hottest day of the week - Today.

Figures. biggrin

Edited by Adenauer on Thursday 27th September 11:23

Digga

40,352 posts

284 months

Thursday 27th September 2018
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Wish I were there. Good luck and go well to everyone. Let's hope it's another successful day with no red flags.

Don't worry about me, I'm not jealous. Much.

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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How was DN20 for everyone? Great couple of days however driving standards on day one left a lot to be desired , quite a few stoppages and people overtaking on the right! Got my first wet laps in on day two which was great as track was pretty much empty, shame the fog lead to an early closure but those are the breaks...can’t wait for the next trip there.

Jaybmw

315 posts

82 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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Though trackdays your allowed to overtake on the right ?

ecain63

10,588 posts

176 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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Jaybmw said:
Though trackdays your allowed to overtake on the right ?
Depends on the organiser / level of experience of participants etc

Order66

6,728 posts

250 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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Jaybmw said:
Though trackdays your allowed to overtake on the right ?
No, UK standard is generally overtake on the left only. Only 1 TDO allows overtaking on both sides.

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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DN 20 was on the right only, seems some participants weren't paying attention at the briefing although most of the offending cars had continental plates so perhaps it got lost in translation

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Monday 1st October 2018
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should have said on the left only

nigelonich

1,017 posts

221 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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RSbandit said:
How was DN20 for everyone? Great couple of days however driving standards on day one left a lot to be desired , quite a few stoppages and people overtaking on the right! Got my first wet laps in on day two which was great as track was pretty much empty, shame the fog lead to an early closure but those are the breaks...can’t wait for the next trip there.
I had a good couple of days but I can see changes afoot based on some of the incidents. Track closure doesn't bother me too much as I feel so sorry for the people who damage the car, the track or worse.

However, does anyone have a video or picture of the Radical which lost control when leaving the TF car park and flung itself accross the DH main straight into the guard rail on the opposite side broadside for oncoming cars? I spotted the car as I left for a lap but I couldn't quite believe what I was seeing!

Digga

40,352 posts

284 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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RSbandit said:
DN 20 was on the right only, seems some participants weren't paying attention at the briefing although most of the offending cars had continental plates so perhaps it got lost in translation
IME, that has often been the case.

However, for the purpose balance, on the last DN I attended in May:

  • the E36 BMW that decided the no overtaking on the first half hour of sighting laps did not apply to him was (rented?) on German plates, but
  • the 991 GT3 RS that overtook several of us under caution flags was most definitely on UK plates
Unfortunately, some people are not capable of the sort of multi-tasking that enables them to listen to a driver's briefing (we all attended the same one) whilst also being excited about a track day.

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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nigelonich said:
I had a good couple of days but I can see changes afoot based on some of the incidents. Track closure doesn't bother me too much as I feel so sorry for the people who damage the car, the track or worse.

However, does anyone have a video or picture of the Radical which lost control when leaving the TF car park and flung itself accross the DH main straight into the guard rail on the opposite side broadside for oncoming cars? I spotted the car as I left for a lap but I couldn't quite believe what I was seeing!
Heard about this but didn’t see, can you imagine what would have happened if someone was hammering down the straight at 250kmh+ when the radical came across the track. Sounds like race teams will not be allowed in future but this guy clearly wasn't up to steering that car!
There is quite a wide gap in track knowledge and experience between the fastest and slowest people on these days and some of the fast cars can be extremely aggressive and frankly discourteous to participants who are clearly trying to learn. My friend who was quite inexperienced at the ring (less than 20 laps total) was using his own car there for the first time and in the space of one lap one of the race cars had stormed up on his bumper at quite a lick giving my mate a major fright ( he thought they were going to collide) then soon after another idiot in a quick Porsche decided to fly past him on the wrong side, to say my pal was annoyed and fairly pissed off when he came back in is an understatement! People need to remember that everyone has paid the same money to be there whether you're doing 7.30 min laps or 12 min ones, you'd swear there was a prize for fastest lap of the day or something. Still an awesome event but more dick heads present than usual this time.

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Tuesday 2nd October 2018
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Also given there were 73 on the reserve list for the event I don't know why any places are offered to race cars in the first place

Digga

40,352 posts

284 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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RSbandit said:
Also given there were 73 on the reserve list for the event I don't know why any places are offered to race cars in the first place
Speed differentials are always going to provide the potential for danger. There is no doubt about that.

Last VLN ably demonstrated the hazard, and this with top-level professional drivers: https://www.facebook.com/nuerburgring/videos/25441...

Generally I quite like the 'buzz' of race cars passing you, flat out, but on the other hand, it can be disconcerting and even experienced track day drivers will be busy just trying to get the hang of the 'Ring for their first few trips, so I can see it might intimidate some.


Boxster_racer

265 posts

72 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Digga said:
Speed differentials are always going to provide the potential for danger. There is no doubt about that.

Last VLN ably demonstrated the hazard, and this with top-level professional drivers: https://www.facebook.com/nuerburgring/videos/25441...

Generally I quite like the 'buzz' of race cars passing you, flat out, but on the other hand, it can be disconcerting and even experienced track day drivers will be busy just trying to get the hang of the 'Ring for their first few trips, so I can see it might intimidate some.
Fully agree with all the comments so far.
I’m no experienced organiser, and have only praise for Darren and his DN team, but from a purely business perspective, getting new ‘inexperienced’ drivers through the pipeline is what secures future revenue and therefore the lifeblood of this enterprise. In the other hand racing teams may just be trying to get as cheap as possible access to the track, and would switch at a moments notice if more affordable comes up by any other means. Furthermore, none f the ‘inexperienced’ drivers caused any of the accidents during the two track day event. Going forwards perhaps drivers with less than X number of Ring laps could carry and L on the car and be offered extra tuition at a cost?
Happy to stand corrected though if I got anything wrong.

Digga

40,352 posts

284 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Boxster_racer said:
I’m no experienced organiser, and have only praise for Darren and his DN team...
Likewise, they do an excellent job.

I should add that I would always try to step up and help them in instances where I think other drivers are taking the piss. Some people might not be bothered, or think it's someone else's job, but at the end of the day, if drivers are doing things that put other attendees at risk, or threaten to jeopardise the session, then it really is up to 'us' to help the organisers and marshals police the event. If they don't know they can't do anything about it.

Boxster_racer

265 posts

72 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Digga said:
ikewise, they do an excellent job.

I should add that I would always try to step up and help them in instances where I think other drivers are taking the piss. Some people might not be bothered, or think it's someone else's job, but at the end of the day, if drivers are doing things that put other attendees at risk, or threaten to jeopardise the session, then it really is up to 'us' to help the organisers and marshals police the event. If they don't know they can't do anything about it.
Absolutely, it’s the third time I enjoy DN track days, and their organisation is always getting better ! smile
I did try to help in identifying risky drivers, and they were very prompt in addressing the issues. I would be happy to volunteer for them if this helps DN continue to be successful in the future.

Digga

40,352 posts

284 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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I'd guess DN might say it's down to all drivers to report issues they see.

Track day organisers can only act on issues presented to them and this can only come from marshals or drivers.

Wh00sher

1,590 posts

219 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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You are correct, it needs the drivers on track to report driving they feel is not acceptable on the event. That happened on Day 1 and Darren told us to speak to every driver on Friday morning explaining in no uncertain terms the fact it was a track day and certain driving standards would not be tolerated.

I`d like to think standards were much improved on Friday and we only had to speak to a very few people that day.


Whilst non of the novices may have had an incident, there was some less than ideal driving from some. Braking mid corner for no apparent reason and dropping to what felt like walking pace when they probably felt they were going too fast or not indicating to invite the train of cars behind didn`t help.

I know we all had to learn sometime, I`d like to think I`m a courteous driver and wait for the invite rather than diving up the inside, but they have to take some responsibility for the overtake, it was hard to know if they were moving out of the way to let you past or taking a weird line sometimes.


Every event is a learning experience and one of the most complained about things a few years ago was race teams. Darren took the decision to not allow them on the events after a lot of feedback. Now people complain about novices.
I don`t envy him trying to find the balance. It`s surprising how you see some situations reported aren`t quite as black and white as the drivers involved may believe.


I have to say, I had a bloody fantastic time biggrin

RSbandit

2,615 posts

133 months

Wednesday 3rd October 2018
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Digga said:
Speed differentials are always going to provide the potential for danger. There is no doubt about that.

Last VLN ably demonstrated the hazard, and this with top-level professional drivers: https://www.facebook.com/nuerburgring/videos/25441...

Generally I quite like the 'buzz' of race cars passing you, flat out, but on the other hand, it can be disconcerting and even experienced track day drivers will be busy just trying to get the hang of the 'Ring for their first few trips, so I can see it might intimidate some.
Wow incredible save from the guy in the Merc scary stuff