Cost of track days
Discussion
Yeah thats how track insurance works. If a £100 bmw crashes into a £100,000 porsche, the porsche owner claims on his insurance for the damage to his car.
The bmw, running without insurance, goes in the bin.
Ive never insured any of my track cars, as theyve all been basically disposable. Though if my car was worth £10k or more, id consider insurance. Though worth pointing out, insurance only covers collision damage... most track cars i write off are due to mechanical failure, which isnt covered.
The bmw, running without insurance, goes in the bin.
Ive never insured any of my track cars, as theyve all been basically disposable. Though if my car was worth £10k or more, id consider insurance. Though worth pointing out, insurance only covers collision damage... most track cars i write off are due to mechanical failure, which isnt covered.
brillomaster said:
Yeah thats how track insurance works. If a £100 bmw crashes into a £100,000 porsche, the porsche owner claims on his insurance for the damage to his car.
The bmw, running without insurance, goes in the bin.
Ive never insured any of my track cars, as theyve all been basically disposable. Though if my car was worth £10k or more, id consider insurance. Though worth pointing out, insurance only covers collision damage... most track cars i write off are due to mechanical failure, which isnt covered.
Where it get's all awfully complicated is when road policies and track policies...crash into each other.The bmw, running without insurance, goes in the bin.
Ive never insured any of my track cars, as theyve all been basically disposable. Though if my car was worth £10k or more, id consider insurance. Though worth pointing out, insurance only covers collision damage... most track cars i write off are due to mechanical failure, which isnt covered.
As I recall the following sort of situation happened and I do not remember how it was resolved.
Car A has a track policy. Spins and is stationary off the circuit.
Car B has a road policy, and manages to crash into Car A (presumably not following the yellow flag rules).
Car A owner, claims on his track policy and walks away from the mess. (minus his excess)
Car A's track insurer, then decides Car B's road policy legally covers 3rd parties for any dumb stuff the insured driver might do in their car regardless of location. And asks the road insurer to pay out for the costs.
Car B's road insurer might legally have to pay that, but then decide to sue the driver of Car B for doing things they said they wouldn't when they took out the policy (e.g. driving on a track).
I think it's this thread but have not read it to see if my recollection is actually correct:
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&...
Best thing is...keep away from other cars. Try not the crash.
By way of balance, using a cheap, relatively low powered lightish car I'd spend nothing more than a tank of fuel and a modest chunk of wear to the consumables. No special brakes/tyres etc., just enjoyed the thing as it came at low cost, which was slow but fun. I'd have thought you can dip your toe in the water in that fashion with a Clio/MX-5 and upgrade/spend as the mood takes you (unless there are serious deficiencies with those cars out of the box).
Out of interest, anybody suggest costs of more lightweight cars; Caterhams/Elise etc.?
Out of interest, anybody suggest costs of more lightweight cars; Caterhams/Elise etc.?
brillomaster said:
Haha yeah thats always advisable! Though, my hope is that thread is from 2013, and people are still doing trackdays 7 years later, so one hopes that that particular insurance pickle went away....
Nope, still at your own risk (public days and track days have different insurance rules), unless you take one of the track rentals available with fully comp insurance.no i mean the issue of the guy who crashed into someones caterham, then being pursued by their road insurer, as they were forced to pay out.
As mentioned at the time, if it was the new precedent that people could be taken to court for damage to other cars, then everyone would suddenly need 3rd person trackday insurance, lest they accidentally crashed into a £100,000 porsche and were then pursued for damages.
this situation would then put many newbies off ever going on a trackday, and even if they were still keen, the cost of third party insurance that you would have to take out every time you went on a trackday would make it prohibitively expensive.
i presume that something somewhere was changed, to say that a driver cannot be pursued under their road policy for an accident that happened on a trackday.
but this is by the by for me really, i'm out the trackday game now having sold my track car earlier in the year,
As mentioned at the time, if it was the new precedent that people could be taken to court for damage to other cars, then everyone would suddenly need 3rd person trackday insurance, lest they accidentally crashed into a £100,000 porsche and were then pursued for damages.
this situation would then put many newbies off ever going on a trackday, and even if they were still keen, the cost of third party insurance that you would have to take out every time you went on a trackday would make it prohibitively expensive.
i presume that something somewhere was changed, to say that a driver cannot be pursued under their road policy for an accident that happened on a trackday.
but this is by the by for me really, i'm out the trackday game now having sold my track car earlier in the year,
nickfrog said:
There is no need for 3rd party cover as everyone signs a disclaimer.
The only 3rd party issue is at the Nurburgring on a TF day. If you hit somebody then you may be / probably will be liable if they're from a Euro country. Whatever you do, do not injure somebody on a TF. Not only will you suffer the guilt, but you could spend the rest of your (now s
tty) life funding their (paid for) life. TF can be a fantastic experience and I've done a few laps in that environment. But, treat it like a sighting lap, not a time trial.
Track days at the Ring with insurance or a rental are the way to go if you want peace of mind.
FWIW said:
God, I’m glad my wife won’t read this thread. I’ve never added up trackday costs, it would probably scare me.
That said, an NA VX220 could be very cheap and engaging to track, can’t believe it would be anywhere near £500/day.
Yes not cheap but for me really good value for money. I find the driving 100 times more exciting than any road driving and the challenge of mastering or even surviving some of the best tracks a very special and addictive experience. That said, an NA VX220 could be very cheap and engaging to track, can’t believe it would be anywhere near £500/day.
nickfrog said:
Yes not cheap but for me really good value for money. I find the driving 100 times more exciting than any road driving and the challenge of mastering or even surviving some of the best tracks a very special and addictive experience.
Couldn’t agree more. (4 days booked next week!)
My mx5 track car would be ideal.
It's road legal but has TR Lane roll bar and harness bar, Luke harness, OMP wheel, coilovers. Slightly stripped interior. LSD
Spare wheels with NS2R tyres, road legal for driving to the track.
Running costs are cheap. The NS2Rs were £250 and are hardly worn after 3x evenings and one full day, plus driving to/from circuits. Brake pads are 1144 mintex but could do with an upgrade if i'm honest, but they've not worn much. Fuel is about 3/4 of a tank for an evening incl getting there snd back, or a full tank plus a bit more for a full day.
Classic insurance too.
I've just bought a Clio 200 so mulling over letting the mazda go. PM if interested
It's road legal but has TR Lane roll bar and harness bar, Luke harness, OMP wheel, coilovers. Slightly stripped interior. LSD
Spare wheels with NS2R tyres, road legal for driving to the track.
Running costs are cheap. The NS2Rs were £250 and are hardly worn after 3x evenings and one full day, plus driving to/from circuits. Brake pads are 1144 mintex but could do with an upgrade if i'm honest, but they've not worn much. Fuel is about 3/4 of a tank for an evening incl getting there snd back, or a full tank plus a bit more for a full day.
Classic insurance too.
I've just bought a Clio 200 so mulling over letting the mazda go. PM if interested
£500/ day? no chance.. more like half that!
Caterham:
Tyres - I'm looking at £400 for a set of r888r's. 7 days plus road use on the current ZZs, they're down to the wear bars. You could get a lot more, but I work it hard. Call it 60/day tyres..
Brakes - £200 for a complete set (DS2500). as above, and I've still not killed them - £30/day
Fuel - 2x tanks at about 35/tank. - £70/day
So about 160 on consumables. Oil and brake fluid changes tend to be done on time anyway, but are pretty much change - diy.
Throw in another 40, round it up to 200..
Not sure if we're counting the cost of day - anything from 100ish upwards.
In fairness, the £500 ish rang true when I tracked a boxster, loved it, but too heavy, like most modern cars and consequently destroyed tyres and brakes.
P.S. I *totally* blame nickfrog for talking me into joining the boxsters on track many years back. First step on a slippery slope!
Caterham:
Tyres - I'm looking at £400 for a set of r888r's. 7 days plus road use on the current ZZs, they're down to the wear bars. You could get a lot more, but I work it hard. Call it 60/day tyres..
Brakes - £200 for a complete set (DS2500). as above, and I've still not killed them - £30/day
Fuel - 2x tanks at about 35/tank. - £70/day
So about 160 on consumables. Oil and brake fluid changes tend to be done on time anyway, but are pretty much change - diy.
Throw in another 40, round it up to 200..
Not sure if we're counting the cost of day - anything from 100ish upwards.
In fairness, the £500 ish rang true when I tracked a boxster, loved it, but too heavy, like most modern cars and consequently destroyed tyres and brakes.
P.S. I *totally* blame nickfrog for talking me into joining the boxsters on track many years back. First step on a slippery slope!
upsidedownmark said:
P.S. I *totally* blame nickfrog for talking me into joining the boxsters on track many years back. First step on a slippery slope!
Sorry. Was that 2012?
The irony is that you saw the light straight away (pardon the pun) and I am the one still trying to track road cars that are 300 to 500 kg too heavy!
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