Overweight people at work

[vsonix]

daemon said:

None of the morbidly obese people i see every day appear to be of Samoan descent though, so not sure what their excuse is.

Maybe not but the UK is a genetic melting pot and so you can't say for sure if someone doesn't have a genetic issue with certain common foods - for example a half Japanese person might be fine with rice and wheat but gain weight eating potatot products or someone with levantine genetics might find carbohydrates derived from sugar beet cause them to gain weight faster. The bottom line is there is more nuance than the absolutist fixation on calories allows for.

[MC Bodge]

vsonix said:

Maybe not but the UK is a genetic melting pot and so you can't say for sure if someone doesn't have a genetic issue with certain common foods

From memory, when there was talk in the news of "genetics" causing people to gain weight, the difference in weight mentioned was of the order of a couple of Kg, not 20 Kg.

The people of the UK in past decades were not as fat as they are now.

[daemon]

vsonix said:

daemon said:

None of the morbidly obese people i see every day appear to be of Samoan descent though, so not sure what their excuse is.

Maybe not but the UK is a genetic melting pot and so you can't say for sure if someone doesn't have a genetic issue with certain common foods - for example a half Japanese person might be fine with rice and wheat but gain weight eating potatot products or someone with levantine genetics might find carbohydrates derived from sugar beet cause them to gain weight faster. The bottom line is there is more nuance than the absolutist fixation on calories allows for.

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. I believe that 99% of the problem here in the UK with obesity is simply down to too many calories in, related to bad eating habits and eating the wrong foods. You seem to want to give people excuses for being obese that absolves them of any need to do anything about it.

[MC Bodge]

daemon said:

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. I believe that 99% of the problem here in the UK with obesity is simply down to too many calories in, related to bad eating habits and eating the wrong foods. You seem to want to give people excuses for being obese that absolves them of any need to do anything about it.

It is a combination of bad foodstuffs, lack of exercise and the social acceptability of being in terrible physical shape.

[Mr Pointy]

MC Bodge said:

The people of the UK in past decades were not as fat as they are now.

That struck me when i was watching the Lauda v Hunt F1 programme the other night. In all of the crowd shots there seemed to be very few overweight people.

[MC Bodge]

Mr Pointy said:

MC Bodge said:

The people of the UK in past decades were not as fat as they are now.

That struck me when i was watching the Lauda v Hunt F1 programme the other night. In all of the crowd shots there seemed to be very few overweight people.

Indeed. It isn't nostalgia.

It is also very noticeable when returning from a trip abroad. Younger people, especially women, but also men, in the UK are generally large.

From their mid 30s onwards, most UK men seem to have a gut.

Many clothes shops have apparently made their women's sizes bigger, though, so people can still fit into a "smaller" size.

[daemon]

MC Bodge said:

daemon said:

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. I believe that 99% of the problem here in the UK with obesity is simply down to too many calories in, related to bad eating habits and eating the wrong foods. You seem to want to give people excuses for being obese that absolves them of any need to do anything about it.

It is a combination of bad foodstuffs, lack of exercise and the social acceptability of being in terrible physical shape.

[MC Bodge]

"being strong to be useful" fitness goals

[CooperS]

Wow that was a read....

My take on it as a professional (and regardless of whether your a line manager or not) you need to address the poor performance in a team.... There are different strategies to do this however regardless of how well intentioned you are you can't just assume that it's down to weight and confront him with your preconceived idea of the cause.

Be a grown up, be a professional and have a conversation about what you see as poor performance and how it is impacting you and the business whilst being clear what you need from them to improve. If this leads to them recognising a mental health issue such as over eating. Think how you can support but be clear that delivery of work at the standard you expect comes first.

Edited by CooperS on Thursday 25th January 12:53

[vsonix]

Mr Pointy said:

MC Bodge said:

The people of the UK in past decades were not as fat as they are now.

That struck me when i was watching the Lauda v Hunt F1 programme the other night. In all of the crowd shots there seemed to be very few overweight people.

So instead of blaming fat people for being fat, what are the differences in lifestyle between then and now? Considering in those days diet was probably poorer (less green veg, less salad, more chips & pies) and that we didn't have so many gyms. Is it that people didn't spend so long behind a desk? Is it because people couldn't afford cars and had to walk everywhere? Is it because you could still buy amphetamines over the counter? Is it because of packaged food and ready meals?

[MC Bodge]

vsonix said:

So instead of blaming fat people for being fat, what are the differences in lifestyle between then and now? Considering in those days diet was probably poorer (less green veg, less salad, more chips & pies) and that we didn't have so many gyms. Is it that people didn't spend so long behind a desk? Is it because people couldn't afford cars and had to walk everywhere? Is it because you could still buy amphetamines over the counter? Is it because of packaged food and ready meals?

Not everybody is fat nowadays, but it has become socially acceptable to be so and once people are surrounded by overweight people they won't feel the pressure to stay lean.

Activity levels are probably not vastly different to those in the 1980s. Diet and booze are possibly the difference.

[Sa Calobra]

MC Bodge said:

Mr Pointy said:

MC Bodge said:

The people of the UK in past decades were not as fat as they are now.

That struck me when i was watching the Lauda v Hunt F1 programme the other night. In all of the crowd shots there seemed to be very few overweight people.

Indeed. It isn't nostalgia.

It is also very noticeable when returning from a trip abroad. Younger people, especially women, but also men, in the UK are generally large.

From their mid 30s onwards, most UK men seem to have a gut.

Many clothes shops have apparently made their women's sizes bigger, though, so people can still fit into a "smaller" size.

It's scary to watch especially the 'you can't critise' crowd as you'll be seen as prejudiced or a bully. Over eating isn't healthy in any shape or form yet society is heading the way to normalise it.

I'm 6ft1 and currently 16stone 8. I am overweight. I get the BMI argument and broad men story bks but I feel lethargic. I don't feel energetic. T-shirts show my gut.

It's not rocket science. I need to drop 1-2stone.

As Michael Winner said it's simple less calories in more exercise = weight loss.

[zygalski]

Try giving up the booze.
You can easily drink 500 calories a night without even thinking about it.

[RDMcG]

I wonder how much of this "concern" is really prejudice.

I have had a lot of senior position in technology and of course scads of highly technical people. Some have been quite overweight ;.However some of these people had also been brilliantly creative and productive.

Since I judge people professionally by the quality of their output it never really occurred to me to worry about their appearance.

Evidently businesses exist to provide shareholder value over time and if someone had a performance issue it has to be addressed fairly and transparently but I would caution against jumping to conclusions. Of course, if its a soldier for instance ,there is a direct physical fitness requirement and this is known and communicated to recruits before they join, which is fair enough.

I do see comments about disgusting people stuffing their faces in various threads, or girlfriends getting fat etc, along with chav, council comments etc and I truly wonder who these commenters are to take such a lofty position of judgement. I have some question as to how well they have earned their positions of success to judge others. It is certainly far more pejorative than sympathetic.

Of course, it IS the web.

[MC Bodge]

RDMcG said:

I wonder how much of this "concern" is really prejudice.

I don't know, but for most people, it is letting themself go. There is no need to be massively overweight.

From a personal point of view, I would hate to be restricted by being out of condition or hugely heavy, but not everybody is.

[Sa Calobra]

RDMcG said:

I wonder how much of this "concern" is really prejudice.

I have had a lot of senior position in technology and of course scads of highly technical people. Some have been quite overweight ;.However some of these people had also been brilliantly creative and productive.

Since I judge people professionally by the quality of their output it never really occurred to me to worry about their appearance.

Evidently businesses exist to provide shareholder value over time and if someone had a performance issue it has to be addressed fairly and transparently but I would caution against jumping to conclusions. Of course, if its a soldier for instance ,there is a direct physical fitness requirement and this is known and communicated to recruits before they join, which is fair enough.

I do see comments about disgusting people stuffing their faces in various threads, or girlfriends getting fat etc, along with chav, council comments etc and I truly wonder who these commenters are to take such a lofty position of judgement. I have some question as to how well they have earned their positions of success to judge others. It is certainly far more pejorative than sympathetic.

Of course, it IS the web.

I hear you.

Conversely the race to the bottom being as liberal as possible?

[RDMcG]

Sa Calobra said:

I hear you.

Conversely the race to the bottom being as liberal as possible?

I have little time for extreme political correctness and would classify myself as being relatively libertarian.
My only point was that the sentiments being expressed here seems to be more about distaste for fat people than genuine experience with performance, The thread was about work performance. My point was...depends on the job and the person.

I am not a huge fan of the sort of comparative snideness about others who are 'council" or :"chav" or the like either. Not for a moment suggesting that these threads should be discontinued , just that they say as much about the poster as the target.

[daemon]

RDMcG said:

I wonder how much of this "concern" is really prejudice.

I have had a lot of senior position in technology and of course scads of highly technical people. Some have been quite overweight ;.However some of these people had also been brilliantly creative and productive.

Since I judge people professionally by the quality of their output it never really occurred to me to worry about their appearance.

Absolutely. There are many people overweight where i work and theres no issues with that. I think the people being discussed here - certainly the two i am thinking of and am referring too - are morbidly obese. Absolutely huge. Whilst both those people seem to be able to function at their jobs - though i cant comment personally on their productivity as i'm not their manager - both have a much higher than average list of ailments (most of which are either weight related or could be eased by not being morbidly obese) - AND both take a lot more time off sick.

Whilst ultimately thats not my concern, i do have a frustration for these particular individuals as they are both genuinely lovely people however both have themselves convinced that theres nothing they can do about their weight. As i said usually as they're tucking in to biscuits, chocolate or crisps.

So, no its not prejudice on my part, its a combination of frustration and concern.

RDMcG said:

Evidently businesses exist to provide shareholder value over time and if someone had a performance issue it has to be addressed fairly and transparently but I would caution against jumping to conclusions. Of course, if its a soldier for instance ,there is a direct physical fitness requirement and this is known and communicated to recruits before they join, which is fair enough.

Dont forget a big part of our employment sector is the public sector - so not held to the same standard as a financial performance driven business.

RDMcG said:

I do see comments about disgusting people stuffing their faces in various threads, or girlfriends getting fat etc, along with chav, council comments etc and I truly wonder who these commenters are to take such a lofty position of judgement.

Well i've never linked my observations to implying fat people are disgusting or insinuating they must be chavs or council. One of these people in particular seems to be quite well off - always planning or jetting on off nice holidays, good cars, seems to have of savings, etc.

RDMcG said:

I have some question as to how well they have earned their positions of success to judge others. It is certainly far more pejorative than sympathetic.

Of course, it IS the web.

Through getting off my ass and doing something about my excess weight, rather than sitting around saying its not my fault.

And for the record, sympathy from others about your weight problems DOESNT shed the lbs.

[daemon]

Sa Calobra said:

It's scary to watch especially the 'you can't critise' crowd as you'll be seen as prejudiced or a bully. Over eating isn't healthy in any shape or form yet society is heading the way to normalise it.

I'm 6ft1 and currently 16stone 8. I am overweight. I get the BMI argument and broad men story bks but I feel lethargic. I don't feel energetic. T-shirts show my gut.

It's not rocket science. I need to drop 1-2stone.

As Michael Winner said it's simple less calories in more exercise = weight loss.

[daemon]

RDMcG said:

Sa Calobra said:

I hear you.

Conversely the race to the bottom being as liberal as possible?

I have little time for extreme political correctness and would classify myself as being relatively libertarian.
My only point was that the sentiments being expressed here seems to be more about distaste for fat people than genuine experience with performance, The thread was about work performance. My point was...depends on the job and the person.

I am not a huge fan of the sort of comparative snideness about others who are 'council" or :"chav" or the like either. Not for a moment suggesting that these threads should be discontinued , just that they say as much about the poster as the target.

I think the thread has meadered - as threads do - beyond the original question and we're now in to the realms of morbidly obese people in society generally and the weight of the nation, as it were.

I have no distaste for morbidly obese people - i mostly feel frustration that they could do something about it, but appear not to have any will power to do so.

Likewise, i'm not at all talking about someone carrying a few pounds or even a few stone extra weight. The two individuals i work closest with are hugely driven people and i've a huge respect for them but are both carrying easily a couple of stone too much.