Trials of Finding New Job

[Teddy Lop]

lyonspride said:

Countdown said:

lyonspride said:

Always worth remembering that a lot of hiring managers don't want the best person for the job, they want the best person that won't take theirs.

Succession planning is one if the things that decent Managers should do.

I agree completely, unfortunately in the UK it seems to involve promoting people of a lower skill and intelligence level. I mean think about it, British firms are full of idiot managers, they came from somewhere, someone promoted them.
It's kinda snow balled, idiots promoting idiots, promoting bigger idiots. If your an idiot, it would make sense not to promote someone who could take your job from under your nose by doing a better job than you.

this x 1000.

While technically I'm very good at my job I'm not that socially switched on and its taken me years to learn by rote what comes naturally to many. One of those is the prudence to cover your arse and no more when you see the train derailment that's going to happen, rather than feel obligated to do or say anything to try to prevent it because it'll only ever been viewed as problem making and attempting to upstage your superiors and colleagues.

[lyonspride]

Teddy Lop said:

lyonspride said:

Countdown said:

lyonspride said:

Always worth remembering that a lot of hiring managers don't want the best person for the job, they want the best person that won't take theirs.

Succession planning is one if the things that decent Managers should do.

I agree completely, unfortunately in the UK it seems to involve promoting people of a lower skill and intelligence level. I mean think about it, British firms are full of idiot managers, they came from somewhere, someone promoted them.
It's kinda snow balled, idiots promoting idiots, promoting bigger idiots. If your an idiot, it would make sense not to promote someone who could take your job from under your nose by doing a better job than you.

this x 1000.

While technically I'm very good at my job I'm not that socially switched on and its taken me years to learn by rote what comes naturally to many. One of those is the prudence to cover your arse and no more when you see the train derailment that's going to happen, rather than feel obligated to do or say anything to try to prevent it because it'll only ever been viewed as problem making and attempting to upstage your superiors and colleagues.

I've got a bit of a situation at the moment, some of the electrics at work are if i'm not pulling punches, downright dangerous. I've made the mistake of pointing this out to the management, but they won't do anything for sake of cost/time, so i'm a little concerned they'll shoot the messenger and white wash the problem just in case anyone gets hurt. If they can deny all knowledge and blame the company that did the work 5 years ago, they don't care if someone gets killed, all for the sake of a £100 or so.

[bad company]

lyonspride said:

I've got a bit of a situation at the moment, some of the electrics at work are if i'm not pulling punches, downright dangerous. I've made the mistake of pointing this out to the management, but they won't do anything for sake of cost/time, so i'm a little concerned they'll shoot the messenger and white wash the problem just in case anyone gets hurt. If they can deny all knowledge and blame the company that did the work 5 years ago, they don't care if someone gets killed, all for the sake of a £100 or so.

If you want to cover your rear put your concerns in writing. An email to one of the directors should be sufficient.

[lyonspride]

bad company said:

lyonspride said:

I've got a bit of a situation at the moment, some of the electrics at work are if i'm not pulling punches, downright dangerous. I've made the mistake of pointing this out to the management, but they won't do anything for sake of cost/time, so i'm a little concerned they'll shoot the messenger and white wash the problem just in case anyone gets hurt. If they can deny all knowledge and blame the company that did the work 5 years ago, they don't care if someone gets killed, all for the sake of a £100 or so.

If you want to cover your rear put your concerns in writing. An email to one of the directors should be sufficient.

Unfortunately that won't work, management and directors are not technical, they won't understand that having 5A rated switches on 20A circuits, is a danger. They'll refer it to the technical director, who is basically a fraud (he knows a lot about a very narrow subject area, and makes everything else up) and probably "designed" the systems in question in the first place.

I've been there before at another company (defence sector), I pointed out an extremely bad flaw in their network security and the response was not what I expected, they were more concerned with how i'd found said flaw, than with actually fixing it.

It's very difficult when the issue is technical and the people your speaking to are not in the slightest, this is where your knowledge gets used against you and is seen as evidence of wrongdoing.
That's why in my current place of work I keep my knowledge to myself and try to subtly nudge people in the right direction instead.

Edited by lyonspride on Tuesday 7th January 10:42

[singlecoil]

I know what it's like to be in a job where you know more about a particular subject than the people who get to make the decisions, and they've decided that you are not a source of information they need to take any notice of.

In the end I left anyway, but it left a lasting negative impression, and I swore never to be that way myself.

[funkyrobot]

Applied for job that is two hours away from me by car, but about 50 mins by train. One of the benefits of said job is heavily discounted rail travel. The job wouldn't pay enough to drive.

Unfortunately, trains aren't the best from my local town so I would need to work specific hours.

I get through the first stage of the application and then a video interview. I finally have a chance to ask about the hours and also tell them about how I would be getting to work.

I ask them what the hours are. They say they dont know. I tell them I can work between the hours of x and x and will travel by train. They again say they dont know. In the meantime they invite me to an assessment day in a hotel 50 miles away.

I speak to them and say thanks, but I dont want to waste anybody's time by turning up to the day if I cant do the hours. I ask if they can find out. They still say they dont know and wont know.



I had to say thanks, but no thanks. Shame really as the job would have been good and affordable with the rail travel discount. I'm now getting the silent treatment and haven't had a reply. The last email sent to me seemed quite abrupt.

Why the hell can't employers tell you the hours they expect you to work?

It's bad enough that they ask you for your expected salary etc.

Edited by funkyrobot on Tuesday 14th January 17:36

[vaud]

funkyrobot said:

It's bad enough that they ask you for your expected salary etc.

Why is that bad? Surely its a handy part of the qualification process (getting a job being mutual qualification). You can always give a band based on benefits vs base vs bonus.

It's good to know a candidates expectations. I was interviewing a guy from a peer company for a role and asked, expecting (knowing they weren't the best payer) it to be in a certain range. He came back with 2x. Turns out he had done some very canny moves but was now way above market rate for his role. He was willing to take some cut but not that much...

[funkyrobot]

vaud said:

Why is that bad? Surely its a handy part of the qualification process (getting a job being mutual qualification). You can always give a band based on benefits vs base vs bonus.

It's good to know a candidates expectations. I was interviewing a guy from a peer company for a role and asked, expecting (knowing they weren't the best payer) it to be in a certain range. He came back with 2x. Turns out he had done some very canny moves but was now way above market rate for his role. He was willing to take some cut but not that much...

I thought it was a way of filtering people out. If you want more pay than they are willing to give, you dont get shortlisted.

[donnie85]

Is it just me or does it seem quiet out there job wise at the minute?? Everyone says January is the best time to find a new job but doesn't seem alot out there unless it's still to early for employers to start recruiting as they look at there budgets for the year?!

[donnie85]

Another thing, keep hearing most new jobs are not advertised. So how do you find them??

Is it worth approaching companies directly to see if they have vacancies rather then constantly looking at job boards online when I'm sure 90% of the jobs are not real anyway.

[lyonspride]

donnie85 said:

Another thing, keep hearing most new jobs are not advertised. So how do you find them??

Is it worth approaching companies directly to see if they have vacancies rather then constantly looking at job boards online when I'm sure 90% of the jobs are not real anyway.

It's social networking, people who know people who known people, this also a big way in which incompetent bullstters end up in top positions.

[V8mate]

donnie85 said:

Is it just me or does it seem quiet out there job wise at the minute?? Everyone says January is the best time to find a new job but doesn't seem alot out there unless it's still to early for employers to start recruiting as they look at there budgets for the year?!

Not for me. November and December, the whole country might as well have been closed. The Brexit/General Election/Christmas triumvirate turned the whole country to stone.

But it has really woken up now; have had one interview and applied for four good quality jobs since the 6th January. There was just nothing around or moving like that last year. The interview was for a job I applied for in late October. I thought I'd just been discarded, but progress was simply delayed.

[donnie85]

V8mate said:

donnie85 said:

Is it just me or does it seem quiet out there job wise at the minute?? Everyone says January is the best time to find a new job but doesn't seem alot out there unless it's still to early for employers to start recruiting as they look at there budgets for the year?!

Not for me. November and December, the whole country might as well have been closed. The Brexit/General Election/Christmas triumvirate turned the whole country to stone.

But it has really woken up now; have had one interview and applied for four good quality jobs since the 6th January. There was just nothing around or moving like that last year. The interview was for a job I applied for in late October. I thought I'd just been discarded, but progress was simply delayed.

Congratulations on the interviews.

What industry are you looking at??

I'm looking to move from Supply Chain into Procurement so applying for procurement roles. Doesn't seem much out there SO FAR. Hopefully picks up for me end of Jan. I have applied for 3 jobs last week or so but heard nothing back so far.

[V8mate]

donnie85 said:

Congratulations on the interviews.

What industry are you looking at??

I'm looking to move from Supply Chain into Procurement so applying for procurement roles. Doesn't seem much out there SO FAR. Hopefully picks up for me end of Jan. I have applied for 3 jobs last week or so but heard nothing back so far.

I do all kinds of stuff. Project/Programme/Strategic Development leadership positions.

But there's LOADS of procurement stuff available.

Look up the following recruiters on LinkedIn:
Apsiz Services (public and private sector)
Hammond Clarke

Also check out:
Bloom Procurement Services
Sign up for job alerts with every County Council you'd be prepared to travel to

If I recall any more I'll let you know.

[ceesvdelst]

My situation has picked up immeasurably this week, was dead the last month or so, might aswell have been applying for non existent roles, endless automated rejections.

But this week booked about 3 or 4 interviews and all for good companies and decent jobs.

Very odd how things work, but it has always been that way for me, nothing then a run of good news. Lots of people I think simply working over Xmas and pre XMas then sorting out stuff first week back and recruitment takes a back seat.

[Newky Brown]

Does anyone have experience of the current 50+ job market?

I'm considering moving to another area - East Anglia, and although there's a good possibility that I can work remotely, I fancy a complete change. I've a broad range of skills in the manufacturing industry including production/project management, sales and product development.

I'm considering anything, including part time and really fancy an outdoors job, maybe environment agency or similar. Has anyone made the switch to this with no relevant experience?

[V8mate]

Newky Brown said:

Does anyone have experience of the current 50+ job market?

I'm considering moving to another area - East Anglia, and although there's a good possibility that I can work remotely, I fancy a complete change. I've a broad range of skills in the manufacturing industry including production/project management, sales and product development.

I'm considering anything, including part time and really fancy an outdoors job, maybe environment agency or similar. Has anyone made the switch to this with no relevant experience?

I'm 50+ and live in East Anglia.

What are you earnings aspirations? Job market is reasonably fluid but well paid jobs are harder to come by. £30k is considered a well paid job.

If you don't have a mortgage or major outgoings and want a job more for sanity than income, then you may well find something interesting. But it won't have the responsibility of your previous roles. The EA, like most places will want a relevant degree or experience for their professional roles, as will their local authority opposite numbers, who work together to manage flooding risk etc.

If you fancy working outside in a role a bit more interesting than the local tip, do check out the County Council jobs websites, as they control the big country parks in each area. Here they'll have 'park rangers' who will cover a number of roles within their respective outdoor environment. The parks will have visitor features, events etc, as well as maintaining the woods etc.

[Newky Brown]

Thanks V8mate, i hadnt thought of the Council and Park rangers.

I'm in the lucky position that i dont have to worry too much about the salary, more that i enjoy the job and it doesn't involve emails, meetings and sitting in an office all day.

I originally lived in the area but moved away for work and really want to return soon.

Had a look at your facebook page and will join if i may?

[V8mate]

Newky Brown said:

Thanks V8mate, i hadnt thought of the Council and Park rangers.

I'm in the lucky position that i dont have to worry too much about the salary, more that i enjoy the job and it doesn't involve emails, meetings and sitting in an office all day.

I originally lived in the area but moved away for work and really want to return soon.

Had a look at your facebook page and will join if i may?

[V8mate]

Well... after the flurry of activity in the first few days of the new year, there's been precisely nothing suitable advertised since.

I might have to start knocking on doors and telling people they've got a loose roof tile soon