Being forced back into office even though we can WFH
Discussion
There's lots of purpose from working in an office. For one, face to face human interaction is a good thing. As long as your employer has factored in social distancing etc, you have no choice. Well, you do have a choice, but the end result might be you leaving your employer with a P45.
Are there actual risks that haven't been mitigated or do you just want to work from home because that's what you prefer?
Are there actual risks that haven't been mitigated or do you just want to work from home because that's what you prefer?
It is against government advice. Boris in his prepared address quite clearly said all those that can work from home should continue to do so.
It is a completely unnecessary risk to yourself, individuals in your household and you are congested roads and public transport at a time where the upmost is being done to ensure these services run with sufficient social distancing.
It all depends on whether enough of your colleagues are of the same thinking.
Dyson tried to pull the same move and faced a massive backlash and had to retreat.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/may/21...
It is a completely unnecessary risk to yourself, individuals in your household and you are congested roads and public transport at a time where the upmost is being done to ensure these services run with sufficient social distancing.
It all depends on whether enough of your colleagues are of the same thinking.
Dyson tried to pull the same move and faced a massive backlash and had to retreat.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/may/21...
PrinceRupert said:
Funny username said:
If you're sitting 2m apart as per government guidelines, what's the issue?
One wonders whether OP is actually that concerned about safety or just prefers WFH for whatever reason ...Reading what the OP has stated, it sounds like the only thing stopping them WFH is their boss(es). If it’s been proven over the last few months they can effectively WFH, it’s rather irresponsible and against the spirit of the guidance for their bosses to call them back into an office.
Whether the OP prefers WFH or not is irrelevant.
I think the OP can refuse, however they should be aware they have nothing to back them up from a legal perspective.
There will be 2m separation and "other measures" will be in place.
I do prefer WFH.
There has been no evidence that we have been less effective over the last couple of months while we WFH.
As far as I can see this is driven purely by presenteeism - it is introducing a (albeit small...) risk for no purpose at all.
Looking at the Dyson article it does appear that legally there is nothing I can do other than to appeal to their sense.
I do prefer WFH.
There has been no evidence that we have been less effective over the last couple of months while we WFH.
As far as I can see this is driven purely by presenteeism - it is introducing a (albeit small...) risk for no purpose at all.
Looking at the Dyson article it does appear that legally there is nothing I can do other than to appeal to their sense.
Edited by fishermanpaul on Friday 22 May 14:15
Funny username said:
If you're sitting 2m apart as per government guidelines, what's the issue?
If only it was as simple as that.Offices are generally enclosed spaces with a significant number of shared touchpoints; door handles, tables, printers etc. Then you have kitchens and fridges, toilets. You'll have 50-100+ using the same facilities every single day.
2m distance for most offices will generally mean 50 percent reduction in individuals in the office because you will need to have a desk space both next to you and opposite you. You'll need to have staggered start and finish times, the same with lunches.
You will not be able to have meetings unless your meeting room is sufficiently spaced where you can have a group of individuals maintaining 2m distance and then being to enter and exit without huddling.
You also cannot control what other people do, you have people with differing levels of risk appetite. A few days before lock down we still had people in the office going to the gym, swimming etc. while others had essentially stopped all non-essential activity due to the health risk to themselves or their family.
It really is a no brainer if you can work from home, you have good Teams/Skype set up - to continue to do so. It's very naive to think there will be some incredible productivity spike lugging people in to the office when in fact you've given then 50 new things to worry about and occupy their mind instead of work e.g, is it safe for me to enter the kitchen, I'm fourth in the queue, oh that person just sneezed and has a bit of a cough, this person in the meeting is sitting a bit too close to me etc. etc.
TopGear7 said:
If only it was as simple as that.
Offices are generally enclosed spaces with a significant number of shared touchpoints; door handles, tables, printers etc. Then you have kitchens and fridges, toilets. You'll have 50-100+ using the same facilities every single day.
2m distance for most offices will generally mean 50 percent reduction in individuals in the office because you will need to have a desk space both next to you and opposite you. You'll need to have staggered start and finish times, the same with lunches.
You will not be able to have meetings unless your meeting room is sufficiently spaced where you can have a group of individuals maintaining 2m distance and then being to enter and exit without huddling.
You also cannot control what other people do, you have people with differing levels of risk appetite. A few days before lock down we still had people in the office going to the gym, swimming etc. while others had essentially stopped all non-essential activity due to the health risk to themselves or their family.
It really is a no brainer if you can work from home, you have good Teams/Skype set up - to continue to do so. It's very naive to think there will be some incredible productivity spike lugging people in to the office when in fact you've given then 50 new things to worry about and occupy their mind instead of work e.g, is it safe for me to enter the kitchen, I'm fourth in the queue, oh that person just sneezed and has a bit of a cough, this person in the meeting is sitting a bit too close to me etc. etc.
I work in an office, I have been seen Covid19 graced us. Moved further apart, cleaned a bit more, and carried on. Cleaning product available around all points of physical contact, should you wish to use it.Offices are generally enclosed spaces with a significant number of shared touchpoints; door handles, tables, printers etc. Then you have kitchens and fridges, toilets. You'll have 50-100+ using the same facilities every single day.
2m distance for most offices will generally mean 50 percent reduction in individuals in the office because you will need to have a desk space both next to you and opposite you. You'll need to have staggered start and finish times, the same with lunches.
You will not be able to have meetings unless your meeting room is sufficiently spaced where you can have a group of individuals maintaining 2m distance and then being to enter and exit without huddling.
You also cannot control what other people do, you have people with differing levels of risk appetite. A few days before lock down we still had people in the office going to the gym, swimming etc. while others had essentially stopped all non-essential activity due to the health risk to themselves or their family.
It really is a no brainer if you can work from home, you have good Teams/Skype set up - to continue to do so. It's very naive to think there will be some incredible productivity spike lugging people in to the office when in fact you've given then 50 new things to worry about and occupy their mind instead of work e.g, is it safe for me to enter the kitchen, I'm fourth in the queue, oh that person just sneezed and has a bit of a cough, this person in the meeting is sitting a bit too close to me etc. etc.
I can do 90% of my work from home too, but I choose to split time because office is good, and I like to work with my team.
grumbledoak said:
Drezza said:
Good way of moving up the forced redundancy list!
^^^ This. Face it, mass redundancies are coming. You would be stupid not to start with the furloughed and the awkward.
markyb_lcy said:
Why start with the furloughed? Many of them had no choice in whether to be furloughed or not. Many of them are probably keen to get back to work (either from home or in the office).
Because if the business is ticking over now and demand wont reach back to where it was why would you bring them back?markyb_lcy said:
Why start with the furloughed? Many of them had no choice in whether to be furloughed or not. Many of them are probably keen to get back to work (either from home or in the office).
Sorry, I was too terse and thus unclear. I was talking from his boss' point of view. Who to furlough and who to make redundant is likely to be a decision made by the same person, but the staff can obviously choose to influence that decision.
Thing folks forget is....
He who pays the piper calls the tune...
No one is forcing you to go back, as you can always tell them to foxtrot Oscar, however that usually comes with a drastic reduction in financial contributions to the cause. Ive always thought that those that like to dictate their conditions are often the ones that are quickly shown the door.
And what with the way things are going now there is going to be a lot of talent out there that will be more than capable of replacing you. in the grand scheme of things no one is irreplaceable. And the work from home brigade / champions often don't get the work environment integrated into working from home very well, suddenly they start to think they can do more of the household tasks as well as do work and even if they equate that and think that they can, the productivity and work flow suffers. sadly there are those that cant work from home as the distractions are too much for them to deal with.
He who pays the piper calls the tune...
No one is forcing you to go back, as you can always tell them to foxtrot Oscar, however that usually comes with a drastic reduction in financial contributions to the cause. Ive always thought that those that like to dictate their conditions are often the ones that are quickly shown the door.
And what with the way things are going now there is going to be a lot of talent out there that will be more than capable of replacing you. in the grand scheme of things no one is irreplaceable. And the work from home brigade / champions often don't get the work environment integrated into working from home very well, suddenly they start to think they can do more of the household tasks as well as do work and even if they equate that and think that they can, the productivity and work flow suffers. sadly there are those that cant work from home as the distractions are too much for them to deal with.
This older generation of luddites that dont like WFH will eventually age out and die. unfortunately we are in a transitional period of history where they are still alive and enforce their bulls
t on others. I suspect now kids at school or uni are being taught over video, the younger generation will get used to it from the off and demand home working as a normal part of their working lives as they begin their careers. Ive been doing it 7 years although im IT - projects so have to go visit places from time to time. Generally I am allowed to be an adult and decide when I need to be on site or not but its not like that everywhere.
t on others. I suspect now kids at school or uni are being taught over video, the younger generation will get used to it from the off and demand home working as a normal part of their working lives as they begin their careers. Ive been doing it 7 years although im IT - projects so have to go visit places from time to time. Generally I am allowed to be an adult and decide when I need to be on site or not but its not like that everywhere. Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff