Working From Home. Torture
Discussion
ChevronB19 said:
Megaflow said:
Time for a revisit of this.
How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
This really does smack of the presenteeism attitude.How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
I was mostly wfh before Covid, and I’ve been to the office three times since - when I say “been to the office” I mean getting there, dumping laptop on hotdesk and me and my workmate - only people in the uk on our team - going to Wetherspoons for breakfast. We don’t leave Spoons all day. It’s “team building”.
They closed one office and halved the size of the other, so there’s not enough space for everyone. It’s meant to be one day a week in the office, but nobody bothers. Some people go in every day and some never. I’m not doing a horrific 80 mile round trip just to do all my meetings with people overseas on zoom/teams, with a smaller desk, fewer and smaller monitors etc.
I’m never doing a commute again. I’m 55 and if I can drag out another few years I’m golden. Mrs DS shares our home office and she’s just started drawing a rather good final salary, defined benefits pension while still working, mortgage paid so the pressure really is off now. Commuting was making me ill (M62).
They closed one office and halved the size of the other, so there’s not enough space for everyone. It’s meant to be one day a week in the office, but nobody bothers. Some people go in every day and some never. I’m not doing a horrific 80 mile round trip just to do all my meetings with people overseas on zoom/teams, with a smaller desk, fewer and smaller monitors etc.
I’m never doing a commute again. I’m 55 and if I can drag out another few years I’m golden. Mrs DS shares our home office and she’s just started drawing a rather good final salary, defined benefits pension while still working, mortgage paid so the pressure really is off now. Commuting was making me ill (M62).
Dog Star said:
Commuting was making me ill (M62).
I'll now sit on the M62 maybe once every two weeks. Pre covid it was every day. Not getting home till 7pm. Back out again at 6am. I genuinely cannot believe that I used to put up with that quality of life, and it was deemed normal. Never, ever again.
Megaflow said:
ChevronB19 said:
Megaflow said:
Time for a revisit of this.
How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
This really does smack of the presenteeism attitude.How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
In fairness, I used to work for a boss who watched people's statuses like a hawk and you got a call or message from them if you had been yellow for more than 10 minutes without her knowing why. Luckily those days are past and now I work for someone who just lets me get on with the job and it doesn't matter where I am or what my Teams status is.
Edited by parabolica on Monday 17th July 14:37
redrabbit29 said:
- Sometimes I have a feeling of "wtf am I even doing with my life" as I get up at 8:30am and stroll to the computer to once again sit in the same spot for the day whilst the big world is going on outside the house
- - - Similarly, sometimes I will look at clothes online and think "What's the point, no one ever sees me like they would in an office" - stupid but depends on my mindset and mood
Overall, I would say it's 70% good for me but 30% not so good.
I'd say more like 95% positive for me, but I definitely understand the bolded part above, or at least I did when I first WFH full time.- - - Similarly, sometimes I will look at clothes online and think "What's the point, no one ever sees me like they would in an office" - stupid but depends on my mindset and mood
Overall, I would say it's 70% good for me but 30% not so good.
I always hated commuting, but it was a 'necessary evil' that I just accepted whilst I had to do it. I didn't register any upside to commuting whilst I was doing it, but actually just having a reason to leave the house definitely is one.
I always used to make sure I got out of the house a few times a day in the early months of WFH, but I don't always feel the need now I'm used to it.
The only thing I miss about commuting is the enforced exercise. I often used to do 5 miles day brisk walking when I had to commute, and maintaining that when I no longer have a reason to is quite difficult.
parabolica said:
Megaflow said:
ChevronB19 said:
Megaflow said:
Time for a revisit of this.
How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
This really does smack of the presenteeism attitude.How many of you are still working from home?
Just over 3 years down the line from COVID and our office has still not fully returned. The official company line is 3 days a week in the office. That seems to change depending on which department you work for though, some have been told 2 days, and some are just flagrantly taking the piss, I saw somebody the other day for the first time since COVID, I forgot they even worked for us!
Then we get on to how much work are people doing. I am online at just before 8:30 start time and I am there until 16:30 finish time, and get slightly paranoid about the teams status, other people seem a little... err... less bothered.
In fairness, I used to work for a boss who watched people's statuses like a hawk and you got a call or message from them if you had been yellow for more than 10 minutes without her knowing why. Luckily those days are past and now I work for someone who just lets me get on with the job and it doesn't matter where I am or what my Teams status is.
kingston12 said:
redrabbit29 said:
- Sometimes I have a feeling of "wtf am I even doing with my life" as I get up at 8:30am and stroll to the computer to once again sit in the same spot for the day whilst the big world is going on outside the house
- - - Similarly, sometimes I will look at clothes online and think "What's the point, no one ever sees me like they would in an office" - stupid but depends on my mindset and mood
Overall, I would say it's 70% good for me but 30% not so good.
I'd say more like 95% positive for me, but I definitely understand the bolded part above, or at least I did when I first WFH full time.- - - Similarly, sometimes I will look at clothes online and think "What's the point, no one ever sees me like they would in an office" - stupid but depends on my mindset and mood
Overall, I would say it's 70% good for me but 30% not so good.
I always hated commuting, but it was a 'necessary evil' that I just accepted whilst I had to do it. I didn't register any upside to commuting whilst I was doing it, but actually just having a reason to leave the house definitely is one.
I always used to make sure I got out of the house a few times a day in the early months of WFH, but I don't always feel the need now I'm used to it.
The only thing I miss about commuting is the enforced exercise. I often used to do 5 miles day brisk walking when I had to commute, and maintaining that when I no longer have a reason to is quite difficult.
One huge difference that I have made recently is to schedule lots of my time in the calendar - I don't mean meetings, I just mean just allocating time to do things.
Firstly it shows you as "busy" which means you won't get calendar invites. But it also helps focus my mind. E.g. I may have an entry saying 9-11 for "Report drafting for Client" and then at 1pm everyday I have lunch scheduled in for one hour.
It helps me structure the day a bit
Company I work for scraped the head office in London and amended all our contracts to WFA (mine was previously WFH anyway).
We now have staff that have upped sticks and moved to Dubai, India, Brazil, Ireland etc. and clients havent returned to their offices in the main so its all remote working and meetings too and 'just works'.
I have a Spaces/Regus account if I want to work from a shared working space which I do with other (ex)colleagues occasionally but never alone, as I may as well be at home with my big screens etc. rather squinting on a 14" laptop in an unfamlilar surrounding.
I have been working with a hopsital based client recently though and its been great getting out and about and back onsite again (albeit 1-2days/week), meeting new people and buildign a rapport and the banter etc. that comes with it all ... strangley at the first board meeting a few months ago I had nerves like I did when I was in my 20s and just starting to get into senior cirlces. I was quite taken back!
One thing that is prevalent though with my organisation (a small boutique consultancy) is the turnover of staff. Lots of younger, less experienced staff start, pass probabtion (6mths) and leave within another 6mths - clearly with more of us senior/experienced people being so remote is causing learning/sharing limitations for more junior staff - not sure how to resolve that one though.
We now have staff that have upped sticks and moved to Dubai, India, Brazil, Ireland etc. and clients havent returned to their offices in the main so its all remote working and meetings too and 'just works'.
I have a Spaces/Regus account if I want to work from a shared working space which I do with other (ex)colleagues occasionally but never alone, as I may as well be at home with my big screens etc. rather squinting on a 14" laptop in an unfamlilar surrounding.
I have been working with a hopsital based client recently though and its been great getting out and about and back onsite again (albeit 1-2days/week), meeting new people and buildign a rapport and the banter etc. that comes with it all ... strangley at the first board meeting a few months ago I had nerves like I did when I was in my 20s and just starting to get into senior cirlces. I was quite taken back!
One thing that is prevalent though with my organisation (a small boutique consultancy) is the turnover of staff. Lots of younger, less experienced staff start, pass probabtion (6mths) and leave within another 6mths - clearly with more of us senior/experienced people being so remote is causing learning/sharing limitations for more junior staff - not sure how to resolve that one though.
I no longer work from home.
I no longer do my old job either.
I am thankful for both changes for the better.
For socially normal people, people who do not like to sit and stare solidly at a monitor for 8 hours per day and people who actually enjoy working with, and learning from, others for tangible results, working from home is not good at all.
Sitting on your backside all day every day is not good for health and judging by the seemingly ever-increasing mass of people that I see locally, not good for your waistline either (When I worked from home, I exercised most lunch times and a few evenings, bit this appears to be relatively rare).
Having said that, my old workplace was particularly rubbish, though. There was very little job satisfaction and I suspect that very few people actually enjoyed the work, other than many of them never really having to actually deliver anything to completion, whilst being paid quite well.
With hindsight, it was almost entirely crap even when we were working from the office. It wasn't just me and I wasn't the problem.
Maybe working from home would not have been quite so bad in a better job?
My new job is much more varied and involves a mixture of desk time, productive(!) meetings and site work.
I wonder how many companies will eventually die away due to people realising that they do not actually offer anything much to clients or employees?
I no longer do my old job either.
I am thankful for both changes for the better.
For socially normal people, people who do not like to sit and stare solidly at a monitor for 8 hours per day and people who actually enjoy working with, and learning from, others for tangible results, working from home is not good at all.
Sitting on your backside all day every day is not good for health and judging by the seemingly ever-increasing mass of people that I see locally, not good for your waistline either (When I worked from home, I exercised most lunch times and a few evenings, bit this appears to be relatively rare).
Having said that, my old workplace was particularly rubbish, though. There was very little job satisfaction and I suspect that very few people actually enjoyed the work, other than many of them never really having to actually deliver anything to completion, whilst being paid quite well.
With hindsight, it was almost entirely crap even when we were working from the office. It wasn't just me and I wasn't the problem.
Maybe working from home would not have been quite so bad in a better job?
My new job is much more varied and involves a mixture of desk time, productive(!) meetings and site work.
I wonder how many companies will eventually die away due to people realising that they do not actually offer anything much to clients or employees?
Edited by Woodrow Wilson on Tuesday 18th July 19:45
I’ve stopped WFH and have the odd day here and there but nothing routine,took a new job based on-site.
I’m throughly enjoying the commute to and from work as work stops when I get in the car, there’s no overthinking or additional research in the evenings.
I’m WFH this week and to be honnest I miss the crack of the office and just being able to talk and see someone to sort an issue.
I’m throughly enjoying the commute to and from work as work stops when I get in the car, there’s no overthinking or additional research in the evenings.
I’m WFH this week and to be honnest I miss the crack of the office and just being able to talk and see someone to sort an issue.
snotrag said:
Dog Star said:
Commuting was making me ill (M62).
I'll now sit on the M62 maybe once every two weeks. Pre covid it was every day. Not getting home till 7pm. Back out again at 6am. I genuinely cannot believe that I used to put up with that quality of life, and it was deemed normal. Never, ever again.
Did it in a LS400 when I was earning £19kpa.
I must have been mental.
x5tuu said:
(snip)
One thing that is prevalent though with my organisation (a small boutique consultancy) is the turnover of staff. Lots of younger, less experienced staff start, pass probabtion (6mths) and leave within another 6mths - clearly with more of us senior/experienced people being so remote is causing learning/sharing limitations for more junior staff - not sure how to resolve that one though.
I think that is a big issue.One thing that is prevalent though with my organisation (a small boutique consultancy) is the turnover of staff. Lots of younger, less experienced staff start, pass probabtion (6mths) and leave within another 6mths - clearly with more of us senior/experienced people being so remote is causing learning/sharing limitations for more junior staff - not sure how to resolve that one though.
More experienced, dare I say older people, will likely have a decent home environment and perhaps have grown to hate the commute. They likely already have the networking elements nailed, meaning they can pick up a phone or hop on a zoom and already have shared experiences with the others to banter over, before getting down to business.
WfH is great for them!
For younger people (my offspring are mid-20s as examples of that), they much prefer more interaction: that is how they can learn loads. They don’t mind a commute at that stage in their career: heck, I used to drive 25k miles pa in my Rover 214 & enjoyed it, back in the day!
Those younger ones still appreciate having some flexibility for home working, but for them it might be the corner of their bedroom, or a shared lounge in rented accommodation: less desirable.
We had a very good younger sales rep who left our tech firm when we closed our office. The office was never rammed, BUT they found they could bounce ideas off the techies which was hard to do on the phone. Random chats opened up possibilities they hadn’t thought of. Removing the office removed that, & much of the fun banter, so they left.
Keeping some office presence, even if a shared facility, makes a lot of sense to me in the new world…
We're Hybrid and I cant see it changing.
I must do minimum 1 day a week in the office, I can do more if I want to or if I have workshops etc that face to face / being in the room together is beneficial.
We try and co-ordinate in my team so that we all come in on the same day, and then we have lunch together on that day, so we get "face time with each other"
We have a team "daily call" Monday to Thursday at 09:00 where we talk to each other, I work in Tech, so we have Kanbans to manage our workload and we talk about what, We have done / what we are doing / what is new work / what work is blocked or stuck.
Then we have a weekly "wrap" call on a Friday, this is chaired by a different team member each week and can be used for anything sometimes we do a quiz, or a tech demo of something new somebodies learned or we talk about something that somebody is interested in, we also review the week and call out key achievements for that week.
On Fridays as long as my work for that week is done I have it in my contract that I can finish at 2pm as the company recognised that by Friday most people were knackered and nobody really got much done on a friday anyway.
We're measured on "output" and the flow of work left to right in the Kanbans boss doesnt care where we work from or what times we're working at. the day I come in the office he's happy for me to leave early and work on the train on the way home if I am writing documentation then I can get a fair bit done on the train and also I get home a little earlier.
All in all it works pretty well, we're getting through our work and we can demonstrate that we are as said we talk to each other once a day every day which means that none of us feel isolated.
I'd not go back to what I was doing Pre Covid, no way, not on your nellie !
I must do minimum 1 day a week in the office, I can do more if I want to or if I have workshops etc that face to face / being in the room together is beneficial.
We try and co-ordinate in my team so that we all come in on the same day, and then we have lunch together on that day, so we get "face time with each other"
We have a team "daily call" Monday to Thursday at 09:00 where we talk to each other, I work in Tech, so we have Kanbans to manage our workload and we talk about what, We have done / what we are doing / what is new work / what work is blocked or stuck.
Then we have a weekly "wrap" call on a Friday, this is chaired by a different team member each week and can be used for anything sometimes we do a quiz, or a tech demo of something new somebodies learned or we talk about something that somebody is interested in, we also review the week and call out key achievements for that week.
On Fridays as long as my work for that week is done I have it in my contract that I can finish at 2pm as the company recognised that by Friday most people were knackered and nobody really got much done on a friday anyway.
We're measured on "output" and the flow of work left to right in the Kanbans boss doesnt care where we work from or what times we're working at. the day I come in the office he's happy for me to leave early and work on the train on the way home if I am writing documentation then I can get a fair bit done on the train and also I get home a little earlier.
All in all it works pretty well, we're getting through our work and we can demonstrate that we are as said we talk to each other once a day every day which means that none of us feel isolated.
I'd not go back to what I was doing Pre Covid, no way, not on your nellie !
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