Messaging outside of work

[InitialDave]

There's some stuff that I'm either the only person that can do it, or I can do it massively faster than others. I don't mind the very occasional request to help with something super urgent or critical when I'm off.

But my employer doesn't take the piss, it's a pretty rare event, and they usually really need it doing now.

[Ezra]

Countdown said:

Conversely I like my boss and I enjoy my work. If it's important enough for her to email or message me out of hours then I'm more than happy to respond. it's almost always a quick "the info is in the Q3 audit papers" rather than anything detailed. it means she can crack on with whatever needs doing rather than having to wait until the next day because "I only work fixed hours".

To clarify - There's no issue with people working their contracted hours. if that works for you and your boss doesn't need you outside of work hours then it's all good. However IF your boss needs something OOH and they know you won't be responding then (hard as it might be to accept for all the Powerfully Built on here) that will count against you. It may well be that because you're totally amazing at everything else that it doesn't make any difference to your career prospects but if you're one of 5/10/50 people and others are more willing to go the extra mile then it WILL affect your career prospects.

definitely this

[Sporky]

CheesecakeRunner said:

It sounds like you work for a relatively small organisation, given you have only two directors.

I should have said "two of the directors", though yes, we're not that big. 160ish staff I think, though only 50ish when I joined. Even at that scale there's no need for people to burn out answering questions out of hours.

Edited by Sporky on Thursday 16th March 13:49

[deja.vu]

Pit Pony said:

If someone messaged me about work at say midnight, I would respond thus :

Jon, you okay? Have you st the bed or something? Couldn't sleep? It could have waited you know.

I would do this at 6am whilst having a st

I have done this to our MD twice and followed it up with walking into his office later in the day without an invite and saying "Hi, Jon, are you okay? I'm really wooried about the hours you are doing? You really need to get a proper night's sleep, and learn to let go. You don't want to have a heart attack like me.

It really pisses him off, but he knows I'm right.

It’s dead easy to manage.
Don’t take your phone to bed with you.

I never have my phone with me in the evenings.
I’ll see mails and messages on iPad which im happy to respond to as I have a global job.

It’s just a case of training those who work with you.

[jm8403]

deja.vu said:

Pit Pony said:

If someone messaged me about work at say midnight, I would respond thus :

Jon, you okay? Have you st the bed or something? Couldn't sleep? It could have waited you know.

I would do this at 6am whilst having a st

I have done this to our MD twice and followed it up with walking into his office later in the day without an invite and saying "Hi, Jon, are you okay? I'm really wooried about the hours you are doing? You really need to get a proper night's sleep, and learn to let go. You don't want to have a heart attack like me.

It really pisses him off, but he knows I'm right.

It’s dead easy to manage.
Don’t take your phone to bed with you.

I never have my phone with me in the evenings.
I’ll see mails and messages on iPad which im happy to respond to as I have a global job.

It’s just a case of training those who work with you.

It's clear he knows how to manage it. First thing in the morning by saying 'wtaf'.

[frisbee]

Pete54 said:

I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.

If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.

People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.

Other, far more productive, countries have laws forbidding contacting employees outside hours, when they are on holiday etc..

[jm8403]

frisbee said:

Other, far more productive, countries have laws forbidding contacting employees outside hours, when they are on holiday etc..

Yes, but there are many factors which make them 'more productive' - do you think we should stop flexible working then? I get a lot of emails between 8pm-6am from people in the UK, I always call them out on it, but it seems that they are addicted.

[911Spanker]

I always answered messages out of hours. I made Partner at a large consulting firm. So not sure there is one rule for everyone.

Firms, industries and people are all different. Only the OP can really answer the question he has posed.

[N111BJG]

I’ve never felt the need to contact my employees out of office hours about routine work related issues.

However some have their home & personal mobile phone numbers on the burglar alarm companies list as contacts if the directors cannot be reached.

I think that mix would work for lots of small businesses

[Cotty]

The one that used to annoy me, when I took a week off, was my boss asking me to check my emails once a day and forward to him anything urgent. I used to deal with armed robbery claims so sometimes things needed to be dealt with quickly. However he and all my colleages have access to my inbox, ask them to check as im on holiday.

This is probably more my fault but I found it easier to check my emails on the laptop than my company phone. But once in I would think ill just chase that up, respond to that, answer that question etc. suddently I have been working for an hour on my day off.

Edited by Cotty on Thursday 16th March 22:47

[craigjm]

Doofus said:

This is a colleague messaging the OP, not his boss.

Exactly. Let’s get some perspective here. This is a case of just saying to the guy “sorry I don’t talk about work in my own time”

[Cotty]

Pete54 said:

I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
.

Are you taking into account people who work in different time zones. Luckily most of my communication was vial email and emails from California, Hong Kong and Australia would be dealt with when I am 9-5 UK time otherwise I would not sleep.

[Sporky]

911Spanker said:

I always answered messages out of hours. I made Partner at a large consulting firm. So not sure there is one rule for everyone.

Yup. As someone said, all other factors are never equal. The problem (as usual) is the people who think how they do something is the only right way, and there's something wrong about anyone with different approaches and priorities. Especially the ones who then call everyone else names.

[Harry Flashman]

Doofus said:

It's possible your colleague has things in his private life, about which you no nothing, which could be causing him additional stress, and it's possible that he prefers to get things off his chest asap. It's also possible he wants to know what he'll be walking into on Monday because otherwise he'll worry and not sleep.

It's possible he's looking to you for some support because he values teamwork.

It's possible that this is about him, not you.

This. What gets me about the OP is why would you not speak to him and find out what is going on, rather than posting this on a forum for advice?.

The lack of basic social skills demonstrated by supposed adults on this forum never ceases to amaze.

I agree on people answering calls outside of work. I do, as I am paid to do so. I have told my more junior folk, who are not, that I do not expect them to be dealing with "urgent" client enquiries to the team inbox at weekends, for example, as that is my and a couple of other people's roles, as the leaders. And I will not respond in detail to such enquiries unless they are actually urgent. Work/life balance is important for mental health.

But the comment I am making here is the fact that, if you have a problem with someone's behaviour or expectations, just speak to them. I have seen suggestions like exiting WhatsApp groups, calling people names, and using passive aggression in this thread. It's rather depressing to read.

Edited by Harry Flashman on Friday 17th March 08:07

[911Spanker]

Sporky said:

911Spanker said:

I always answered messages out of hours. I made Partner at a large consulting firm. So not sure there is one rule for everyone.

Yup. As someone said, all other factors are never equal. The problem (as usual) is the people who think how they do something is the only right way, and there's something wrong about anyone with different approaches and priorities. Especially the ones who then call everyone else names.

Indeed. In my line of work, I don't expect to "switch off" - I knew that when I signed up to the career and it isn't how I operate anyway.

I don't care when people do the work provided it's done to the highest level and does not impact the client or the team.

7-8 hours is usually the minimum to get by and "meet expectations" of the role provided that time is well managed.

But people do need to work around others' diaries which does inevitably mean extra hours when things are busy.

[snotrag]

frisbee said:

Pete54 said:

I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.

If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.

People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.

Other, far more productive, countries have laws forbidding contacting employees outside hours, when they are on holiday etc..

In a previous role I worked closely with people at a large vehicle/engine manufacturer based in Stuttgart (you know the place, famous for unsuccessful, unprofitable automotive companies....)


If you emailed someone whilst they were on Holiday or Leave - you received the following message:


"Hello customer, Herr Smith is currently on Annual Leave. He will be back on XXth, please contact him them, alternatively if urgent call XXXXXX to be directed to someone else. Your message has now been automatically deleted"


Herr Smith always had lovely, stress free Holidays, and we had a good catch up about work stuff when he returned.

[pherlopolus]

I employ people, I have told them (and even shown them) how to set do not distrub on phones (they install Outlook on own phones but not because we insist!). I have had a bit of a battle moving work conversations from facebook messenger to teams as well.

If you don't want to play their games don't!

[Mr Penguin]

I think its natural to want to know if you need to be up early to deal with a mess or look for a particular issue rather than read through 2000 emails which aren't urgent. Its not nice to come in thinking you'll have a quiet day to catch up only to be told that you need to deal with a crisis.

Its easy enough to say "everything's fine" or "we have a problem, talk tomorrow", but you can also ignore him if you don't like it.

[jm8403]

pherlopolus said:

I employ people, I have told them (and even shown them) how to set do not distrub on phones (they install Outlook on own phones but not because we insist!). I have had a bit of a battle moving work conversations from facebook messenger to teams as well.

If you don't want to play their games don't!

wow, i cant believe people like using fb messenger. utterly horrible platform

[Random84]

I think the key thing is that we're comparing vistly different roles. I can totally understand some roles have a need to message colleagues at all hours, I'm fortunate that mine definitely doesn't and that's the issue.

As for their mental health/well-being.... If there was an issue during their week off I would deal with it 100% but if it's been a particularly busy week I look forward to my break at the weekend! There's no need to spend time summarising everything that has happened on a Sunday evening, it won't achieve anything and a handover on a Monday morning will cover everything. One reply creates multiple questions and before you know it you've spent all evening discussing work.

This is obviously a question which raises many opinions, I don't agree with some of them but it's good to hear different views!