CSL Vs 911 Turbo...
Discussion
Cheers, I do't have a 155 limiter so didn't know that. It was more the gearing I was questioning anyway:
Maximum Safe Engine RPM :8250
Tire Size Diameter :25.26
Differential Gear Ratio :3.62
Transmission Gear Ratio :1
Potential Calculated speed: 171.33
As you've done the driver training will BMW delimit your M5?
Maximum Safe Engine RPM :8250
Tire Size Diameter :25.26
Differential Gear Ratio :3.62
Transmission Gear Ratio :1
Potential Calculated speed: 171.33
As you've done the driver training will BMW delimit your M5?
both great cars and i love them both for what they do.
2 different tools for different things. CSLs should be compared to GT3s but don't even go there!
there really is nothing that will get you point to point more quickly and easily in any weather than a 996 TT.
the TT is great value now what with the 997 out
can be VERY expensive to keep running, especially the bits and pipes that corrode behind the engine after age and it is engine out job! just cost a friend of mine like 4k for new piping! and then he had to have new discs and pads and tyres. ouch is all I can say.
2 different tools for different things. CSLs should be compared to GT3s but don't even go there!
there really is nothing that will get you point to point more quickly and easily in any weather than a 996 TT.
the TT is great value now what with the 997 out
can be VERY expensive to keep running, especially the bits and pipes that corrode behind the engine after age and it is engine out job! just cost a friend of mine like 4k for new piping! and then he had to have new discs and pads and tyres. ouch is all I can say.
GregE240 said:
phatgixer said:
nbetts said:
with poetry coming from the phatgixer...
Just remember the little urban achievers.
Zod, I think it important we have a sense of hamour. Spank, spank!
When are you coming to a VMAX, PG? Missed your sparkly wit and general shouting at things Porsche.
When is the next Mercedes-fest?
So 3 fat blokes in a CSL matched a 996TT in a straight line
I had an unmodified 993TT and frankly it would have anialated an M3 CSL in a straight line. Round a track I accept it would be close (if both on the CSL cup type tyres).
I have owned two M3's and have driven a CSL aswell so I have no bias either way - just being honest and realistic!
Myabe the bloke in the Porker could'nt drive.
kinetic said:
So 3 fat blokes in a CSL matched a 996TT in a straight line
I had an unmodified 993TT and frankly it would have anialated an M3 CSL in a straight line. Round a track I accept it would be close (if both on the CSL cup type tyres).
I have owned two M3's and have driven a CSL aswell so I have no bias either way - just being honest and realistic!
Myabe the bloke in the Porker could'nt drive.
Depends if you call 22 seconds 'close' (993 Turbo Vs CSL times around the Nurburgring) ....
kinetic said:
So 3 fat blokes in a CSL matched a 996TT in a straight line
I had an unmodified 993TT and frankly it would have anialated an M3 CSL in a straight line. Round a track I accept it would be close (if both on the CSL cup type tyres).
I have owned two M3's and have driven a CSL aswell so I have no bias either way - just being honest and realistic!
Myabe the bloke in the Porker could'nt drive.
A 993TT annihilate a CSL? I love the extreme use of words on this forum. Annihilate it certainly would not, pull away maybe yes, maybe not but where the hell did you get annihilate from? I have hung onto the coat tail of a 996TT in my previous SLK55 AMG, and the CSL would be even with or just ahead of the SLK. We use these terms like slaughter, annihilate, destroy, massacre when you're talking 1-3 car lengths up to silly speeds which really isn't a big difference. I was in a remapped CSL the other day which was dynoed at 370bhp and in 2nd gear from around 40mph it quite comfortably pulled away from a 997C2S. The 997 though seemed very slightly quicker when you got over 120mph but I guess that's Porsche aerodynamics for you. The C2S and the CSL started equally and by the time we got out of 3rd gear I had to actually turn around and look out the back window to see where the 997 was. So with Dude's CSL having a remap and a little more BHP with the exhaust I don't see why it couldn't stay with a 996TT. No, certainly not quicker, that goes without saying but I don't see why he couldn't keep it in sight.
I have had a Gt3 that i sold to buy a Csl as they were discounted so much from new...both cars imo are virtually identical in performance and i actually found the csl more fun than the gt3.On the track both cars are very close in performance because that is what they have been partially designed to do.On the track either car would very quick and capable compared to a tt. On the road however both cars are compromised (Michelin cup sports hardly confidence inspiring in anything other than perfect conditions on the csl)and the gt3 not to much fun in the rain either.I then bought a 996tt which i know for a fact on the road is miles quicker than both the cars mentioned as its ablilty to travel at ridiculous speeds in all conditions cannot be matched by the others.On the road to travel quick at 90% committment you need torque and grip and predictability from the car which is where the tt out scores the csl and gt3.I loved the csl for its exclusivity and noise etc however if i end up on the road in a tear-up i know the best car to be in bar none is the tt.(especially after a bit of help from the dms chaps).All imo of course.
You make a good point. How often do we drive ten-tenths on the highway?
Although i own a CSL and love it, what a car can do in expert hands (or even our hands come to think of it) on a smooth and warm track isn't really the point if you buy a car for the road. Mileage wise even experienced trackday members on here who i know do infinitely more road miles than track miles.
If we are talking about the public roads then quite often the car statistically quicker won't be, in actual fact. If it is it is often by a very small amount.
I did a run-out in my heavy relatively low-powered BMW derv (remapped 535d) and got left behind about twice, staying with loads of supposedly faster cars on the way.
Although i own a CSL and love it, what a car can do in expert hands (or even our hands come to think of it) on a smooth and warm track isn't really the point if you buy a car for the road. Mileage wise even experienced trackday members on here who i know do infinitely more road miles than track miles.
If we are talking about the public roads then quite often the car statistically quicker won't be, in actual fact. If it is it is often by a very small amount.
I did a run-out in my heavy relatively low-powered BMW derv (remapped 535d) and got left behind about twice, staying with loads of supposedly faster cars on the way.
Surely this would be Pistonhead nirvana to bring together those two prickly topics into one discussion thread - namely kayc's eulogy to the 996TT and the longest thread of 2006 about the fastest car in the real world (535d). There's still 12 hours of 2006 remaining so plenty of time for a good bust up.. 
The other day I was in the CSL, towing my mate in his 535d and we like totally destroyed a 996 Turbo. I never even got out of 3rd gear and the Porsche driver gave up at 170mph. I felt a bit sorry for him so we slammed it in reverse to find him again. Once we'd caught him up, I wrote "PWNED!" in the condensation on my windscreen. I think he saw the funny side.
Some years ago I owned an M3EVO (E36) and a Griffith 500. 'Statistically' there was not much to choose in performance terms (0-100 in 10.5 v 0-100 in 12). In reality the Griffith was embarrasingly faster. Off the line I could use second gear and it would still do a sub 5.0 sec 60 and chase down the M3 in a matter of seconds before disappearing off into the distance.
Point being a High reving, low torque, relatively small engined performance car is always going to get a drubbing from a big torque Turbo engined car in 'road' driving conditions no matter what the stats say. (Hence your 535D Turbo can appear v quick on the road against statistically faster machinery)
I defy anyone whose actually driven a CSL and a 911 Turbo back to back to suggest there's anything other than a huge gulf in performance between the two!
Track driving is a different issue altogether. The CSL is designed for it and does it very well especially on those sticky tyres.
'22 secs around the 'ring - well the cup tyres are worth approx 3 secs per lap around donington's 2 miles. The 'Rings 13 miles if I recall, So thats 13 /2 x 3 secs = 19.5secs so in actual fact the diff between the cars on track is about 2-3 secs over 13 miles - like i said there's nothing in it
phatgixer said:
CSLs are rubbish. They cost so much less than an equivalent 911, so they must be rubbish....
CSL's are all driven by people who wish they could afford a Porsche but can't, I mean its dead obvious init. I mean look at the cars in your garage, I bet you wished you could afford a Porsche..............oh, wait a minute, you have a car worth more than Mansfield so that must be wrong then........but this bloke in Halfords said so.....
Edited by housemaster on Sunday 31st December 18:53
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