HMS Queen Elizabeth

[wildcat45]

Thanks for that. Bar located. All is well. :-)

[wildcat45]

It just reminds me of Swan Hunter nearly 20 years ago. The business model of basically having only one client (MOD) with a few other jobs now and then will lead to closure.

We're not building warships like we used to.

We can get better value for money if our fleet support ships are made by Daewoo.

The day Swan Hunter shut in 1994 with the delivery of HMS RICHMOND, that yard had just produced what was at the time, the worlds most advanced and capable anti-submarine warfare frigate. She was defect free, and just about as good as it gets.

It mattered nothing. The shipyard is flattened.

I am afraid it is too late for anger. You can trace all this back to the 1960s when yards in the UK ignored what was happened in then in Japan, with shipbuilding.

With a sub fleet of just eleven new hulls coming on streat, you have to wonder at the viability of Barrow long term. Our next generation SSNs - if we ever have a next generation to follow Astute - could well be designed here, but built in France.

A sorry state of affairs

[hidetheelephants]

doogz said:

When Barrow have finished with Astute class, they're likely to have some Vanguard replacements to build that'll keep them busy for a good few years.

Plus they have nice DIS payments to keep a core of knowledge on salary in the dry spells, even if they are only drinking tea and playing minesweeper. It's not much of stretch to suggest the same policy could be applied to surface ships as well.

[AshVX220]

A piece on southern news last night. Go to about 13'20" in.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01p1mpj/Sout...

[del 203]

doogz said:

I have no sound.

What's the general gist of the piece?

Its big


HTH

[AshVX220]

doogz said:

del 203 said:

Its big


HTH

Oh

Thanks.

Thought maybe it was about this yard closure malarkey.

They only touched on that really, it's mainly a PR piece. Tonight they look at the Mission System and the test building we commissioned for Large Scale Integration recently. It's a feel good story, which is something this project desperately needs.

[AshVX220]

Part 2 of BBC South Today's piece, starts at 14'12".

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01p1mq0/Sout...

[ninja-lewis]

doogz said:

The carriers could be built much quicker than they are being.

But you'd have to find more workers, not the biggest problem.

Then you'd have to pay them all off in a year or two when they're done building, as we've nothing else for them to do, and our economy/infrastructure/build capacity is such that we cannot pick up export contracts in the way that the Koreans can. We're not competitive when it comes to the number one factor. Price.

That and the Government would have to manage the project properly in the first place. Less than a year after they signed the contract, they 'reprofiled' the project by slowing down work and pushing expenditure to later years. Added an extra £1.5 billion to cost overall but all the Government cared about was reducing the in-year expenditure in the first couple of years.

Besides, Prince of Wales is coming on fast as well.

[rhinochopig]

Paddy_N_Murphy said:

TBH more of the Ninjas version I feel.

Public spend / misdirection, Red Tape and the most fking bizarre build sequencing / locations is where the problem is.

And to be fair a completely different set of standards to work to. Astute was a nightmare in terms of finding kit that met the appropriate defstans and that would meet the requirements placed upon it by the operational and nuclear safety cases. Granted Lizzy isn't a nuke powered ship but much of the kit will be designed and built to the same standards.

Things like the platform management system will be horrendously complicated as an example.

Plus don't forget the Korean DA won't have the same issues of up-skilling / down-skilling that UK companies who only do these projects once in a career rather than once every few couple of years have.

[Godalmighty83]

As far as I was aware the build of the CVF is actually going very well with the only delays related to government interference in a daft attempt to save money.

Add on to that the they are the biggest ships by far that the RN has ever had built, far bigger then a single yard can deal with and the added complexity of a military vessel designed to run some of the most complex systems possible while travelling twice the speed of a commercial hauler while dealing dealing with possible battle damage and its easy to see why things take extra time.

The build itself seems to be progressing as planned and rumour mill has it as under budget as well.

[megaphone]

Building a ship is not difficult, the Italians build very big cruise ships, in under two years. However a military ship is a different beast, building the superstructure is easy, it's the systems that go onboard which will take the time.

[AshVX220]

A reasonable piece on Sky News yesterday. Including an interview with the driver of the Goliath crane. (one minor error in the piece referring to an SSBN as an Hunter Killer, but hey-ho).

[url]http://news.sky.com/story/1045502/uks-largest-warship-starts-to-take-shape[/url}

[ralphrj]

I'll have to watch that later.

In the meantime here is a pic


View from the head of the dock, January 2013 by QEClassCarriers, on Flickr

[hidetheelephants]

Impressive largeness. Any chance of a tour when it gets a bit further on?

Edited by hidetheelephants on Friday 1st February 11:42

[AshVX220]

doogz said:

I'll watch it in a bit.

Does he mention anything about the crane being fked due to a st casting, which tbh is to be expected when you buy something like this from China?

Speaking of subs up the page a bit, I was offered a job yesterday in Barrow as a principal shock and dynamics engineer.

No thanks

Yeah, I don't fancy doing stuff on those things, sneaky, horrible targets that they are!!

hidetheelephants, I think your best chance would be to try and get one if they have a ship visit when she's in service, no doubt she'll do the occasional UK tour as she's doing work-ups etc.

[TTwiggy]

ralphrj said:

I'll have to watch that later.

In the meantime here is a pic


View from the head of the dock, January 2013 by QEClassCarriers, on Flickr

I hope they're going to paint her grey, as otherwise she's going to stand out like a sore thumb at sea

[anonymous-user]

ralphrj said:

In the meantime here is a pic


View from the head of the dock, January 2013 by QEClassCarriers, on Flickr

Can the smarter boatists enlighten me as to why the snout is so long? persumably for more than pure hydrodynamic reasons (sonar etc??)

[AshVX220]

doogz said:

AshVX220 said:

Yeah, I don't fancy doing stuff on those things, sneaky, horrible targets that they are!!

hidetheelephants, I think your best chance would be to try and get one if they have a ship visit when she's in service, no doubt she'll do the occasional UK tour as she's doing work-ups etc.

TBH it's more the fact that it's in Barrow, that I don't want it. sthole that the place is!

I've never had the pleasure mate, so I'll make a note to avoid it in future.

[hidetheelephants]

doogz said:

No sonar on QEC.

Hopefully we will be able to afford some choppers with dipper things, even if we can't afford any planes.

[Godalmighty83]

doogz said:

Bulbous bow

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulbous_bow

Helps reduce pitching of the ship,

So our carrier looks like it won't be used in that manner, as we're going STOVL, but:

A. They didn't know that at the time.
.

The reduction in pitching is still very useful for us as we will be using STO and SRVL, the CVF also used Neptune stabilisers for increased roll stability as well not to mention its larger size makes it harder to disturb. The bow is more about fuel efficiency and is one of the reasons that despite weighing about the same as all 3 invincible carriers combined each of the CVF's is more fuel efficient.

Over the years the Sea Harriers embarrassed a lot of conventional carriers by being able to launch and recover in weather that had a cat and trap aircraft hiding in its hanger, the CVF should be a very stable platform for use in a similar fashion.