Crash at Shoreham Air show

[eccles]

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

[saaby93]

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

Maybe someone needs to invent a box with two green lights one for height and one for speed
Only if theyre both on do you know youre ok to continue

[anonymous-user]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

But if you don’t know why it happened why are you unhappy with the verdict?

[anonymous-user]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

There wasn’t evidence that he was wilfully reckless though. That’s why he wasn’t prosecuted.

If he was found to have had 10 pints before taking off he’d be in prison and everyone would be saying he deserved it.

[anonymous-user]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

I don’t know whether he was wilfully reckless or not. I’ve been flying for almost 30 years with over 16,000 hours in a wide variety of types and operations.

I’m not sure how you can know whether he was wilfully reckless or not.

[eccles]

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

[charlie7777]

eccles said:

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

Because he was cognitively impaired before the loop began.!!

[eccles]

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

Because he was cognitively impaired before the loop began.!!

In straight and level flight?

[charlie7777]

eccles said:

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

Because he was cognitively impaired before the loop began.!!

In straight and level flight?

No. Because he was not flying straight and level before the loop began.

[eccles]

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

Because he was cognitively impaired before the loop began.!!

In straight and level flight?

No. Because he was not flying straight and level before the loop began.

Yes he was, look at the video footage. He did a pass, followed by a circuit, brought the wings straight and level then began the loop manoeuvre, with the pilot appearing to be in full control at all times. You can see how crisply he levels the wings before the loop.

[Europa1]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

Ummm, what do you think all the media reports over the last few weeks have been about?

[charlie7777]

eccles said:

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

charlie7777 said:

eccles said:

saaby93 said:

eccles said:

Trophy Husband said:

The guy accidentally killed 11 people. He didn't mean to. Something went wrong. He didn't want that to happen. It just did. We're talking micro-seconds between right and wrong. It is just that those micro-seconds had massive consequences. This was a dreadful accident. But accident it was. Whether it was one waiting to happen due to his flying manner, we will never know. However, I'm sure that he struggles to sleep at night.

To just blandly say 'something went wrong' is to completely ignore all the evidence that has gone before.
Yes he didn't deliberately set out to kill people or to crash an aircraft but he, a professional pilot, made a catalogue of mistakes. The spilt second mattered far more because he was far outside the mandated safety margin which is there for the 'split second' moments that can happen, that's the whole reason they are there. He, the pilot, chose to fly far lower and slower than he should, he put the aircraft in a position where a split second wasn't enough to stop a tragedy happening.

Isnt that why the 'cognignative impairment'
He knows on a normal day he wouldnt have done all that, and yet for some reason the cockpit video shows everything being treated as normal, when it shouldnt have been

A smokescreen by the defence to introduce an element of doubt. He was making mistakes before he began the loop, how can you put that down to cognitive impairment?

Because he was cognitively impaired before the loop began.!!

In straight and level flight?

No. Because he was not flying straight and level before the loop began.

Yes he was, look at the video footage. He did a pass, followed by a circuit, brought the wings straight and level then began the loop manoeuvre, with the pilot appearing to be in full control at all times. You can see how crisply he levels the wings before the loop.

It was the considered opinion of the airshow display controllers that the circuit and pull up were enough to induce cognitive impairment.
That is what the jury believed.

[saaby93]

Anyone fancy a beer

[Dr Jekyll]

charlie7777 said:

It was the considered opinion of the airshow display controllers that the circuit and pull up were enough to induce cognitive impairment.
That is what the jury believed.

No, the jury believed that there was a possibility of cognitive impairment. They didn't say what might have induced it.

[Riley Blue]

janesmith1950 said:

eccles said:

The pilot was an 'unfortunate victim'? Dear god
He was a professional pilot, a professional display pilot, and he made a huge number of errors with previous form, that ultimately led to a bunch of people dying, and he's the 'unfortunate victim' !

He's AN unfortunate victim, rather than THE unfortunate victim.

Bloodlust is also unfortunate (and unhelpful).

There are 11 unfortunate victims but he is not one of them. If he is a victim at all, he is a very fortunate victim, he escaped the incident with his life.

[anonymous-user]

Why all the hate for the pilot?

Do you think he’s lying about not knowing what caused his actions? Do you think he got away with it or something? Or is it just a need for there to be something or someone to blame after all these people have died?

[Robertj21a]

It certainly comes over as though his defence lawyer has cleverly managed to get him off (as is his job).

Perhaps that's just the way I read it.

[IforB]

El stovey said:

Why all the hate for the pilot?

Do you think he’s lying about not knowing what caused his actions? Do you think he got away with it or something? Or is it just a need for there to be something or someone to blame after all these people have died?

Because "metropolitan elites" or some other nonsense.

It does seem that rational thought has disappeared when it comes to any kind of emotive incident. In this case, the hang him high mob were in full effect from the start, which makes this whole accident more difficult to deal with.

The press did their usual piece of whipping people up with no actual knowledge or understanding and those of us who did, got shouted down by the baying mobs who had decided that Andy Hill should hang despite knowing no more about display flying or aerobatics or operating complex aircraft than the average donkey.

That's why this result was inevitable and we're now in a situation where we'll never really know what caused the accident beyond the basic fact that the aircraft crashed. We really have reached peak stupid in the U.K. right now, where unqualified people think they know better than the experts because they have access to internet and aren't afraid to tell everyone.

This thread is a prime example of why sometimes, it is best just to ignore "public opinion" especially when it is utterly ignorant, but doesn't know that.

• Starts the slow hand-clap *

[Riley Blue]

El stovey said:

Why all the hate for the pilot?

Do you think he’s lying about not knowing what caused his actions? Do you think he got away with it or something? Or is it just a need for there to be something or someone to blame after all these people have died?

No hate at all from me, nor any reason for there to be.

Do I think he's lying? He might be, equally he might not be.
Do I think he 'got away with it'? It's not a phrase I'd use however he has been acquitted of the charge against him. Some people might consider that as 'getting away with it'; I don't.
Is there a need to apportion blame? No, but there is a need to find the reason.

[anonymous-user]

Riley Blue said:

No hate at all from me, nor any reason for there to be.

Do I think he's lying? He might be, equally he might not be.
Do I think he 'got away with it'? It's not a phrase I'd use however he has been acquitted of the charge against him. Some people might consider that as 'getting away with it'; I don't.
Is there a need to apportion blame? No, but there is a need to find the reason.

That’s all shown above.

The reason was that the aircraft wasn’t at the right height during the manoeuvre. That was caused by cognitive impairment. There’s even information at what probably caused the cognitive impairment.

The bloke comes around from an induced coma and discovers he’s killed loads of people. Goes through a trial with finger pointing from the stalls and people accusing him of all sorts. He has to live with knowing he’s killed these people through something which apparently wasn’t his fault.

Then gets acquitted and still people are saying he’s lucky?