Hawker Typhoon
Discussion
Dr Jekyll said:
aeropilot said:
Half of an original Typhoon wing was discovered in small museum in Indiana recently.
How on earth did it get there?http://warbirdinformationexchange.org/phpBB3/viewt...
chuntington101 said:
If the Saber had had the support the Merlin had, could this have made an impact in the war? Maybe faster bombers? Or was the Griff always going to be better than the Saber? Applicants that hindsight is 20:20!
The Merlin was tried and tested, the Griffon not hugely significant difference in terms of production capacity/tooling/logistics etc. RR had its share of failures of 'better' alternatives, such as the Peregrine, Vulture etc, so why rock the boat.The Bristol sleeve valve radials were also tried and tested too, so we had enough engine designs, so while the Sabre, had it been given the development chances, the trouble is the jet engine was already close to making the piston engine redundant, so there was really little interest in developing the Sabre engine further.
aeropilot said:
The Merlin was tried and tested, the Griffon not hugely significant difference in terms of production capacity/tooling/logistics etc. RR had its share of failures of 'better' alternatives, such as the Peregrine, Vulture etc, so why rock the boat.
The Bristol sleeve valve radials were also tried and tested too, so we had enough engine designs, so while the Sabre, had it been given the development chances, the trouble is the jet engine was already close to making the piston engine redundant, so there was really little interest in developing the Sabre engine further.
The Griffon had a fairly tenuous connection with the Merlin - which followed its own development path. Work on the Griffon had begun as early as 1938 and was initially intended as the engine of the Royal Navy's new Fairey Firefly fighter.The Bristol sleeve valve radials were also tried and tested too, so we had enough engine designs, so while the Sabre, had it been given the development chances, the trouble is the jet engine was already close to making the piston engine redundant, so there was really little interest in developing the Sabre engine further.
Eric Mc said:
aeropilot said:
The Merlin was tried and tested, the Griffon not hugely significant difference in terms of production capacity/tooling/logistics etc. RR had its share of failures of 'better' alternatives, such as the Peregrine, Vulture etc, so why rock the boat.
The Bristol sleeve valve radials were also tried and tested too, so we had enough engine designs, so while the Sabre, had it been given the development chances, the trouble is the jet engine was already close to making the piston engine redundant, so there was really little interest in developing the Sabre engine further.
The Griffon had a fairly tenuous connection with the Merlin - which followed its own development path. Work on the Griffon had begun as early as 1938 and was initially intended as the engine of the Royal Navy's new Fairey Firefly fighter.The Bristol sleeve valve radials were also tried and tested too, so we had enough engine designs, so while the Sabre, had it been given the development chances, the trouble is the jet engine was already close to making the piston engine redundant, so there was really little interest in developing the Sabre engine further.
There is a Typhoon under restoration in this country. From what I've heard on the grapevine, the bloke reckons it will be a flier and there is certainly all sort of impressive CAD drawings for remade parts being posted by him on the internet. Everyone else reckons he's being, well, somewhat optimistic about it being more than a static piece. He has also hoarded all the remaining Sabre engines and spares, reckoning he'll get them certified as airworthy. Apparently the cost of even just appraising them would be absolutely astronomical, but still he insists it will all happen.
This is apparently of considerable annoyance to one chap who not only wants a Sabre to restore as a static runner for shows (which would be a hell of a sight!) but also has the skill and wherewithal to do it, having recently finished a Hercules that most people would have weighed in for scrap.
This is apparently of considerable annoyance to one chap who not only wants a Sabre to restore as a static runner for shows (which would be a hell of a sight!) but also has the skill and wherewithal to do it, having recently finished a Hercules that most people would have weighed in for scrap.
Remanufacture seems the best bet for getting a Sabre certified for flight; lumps of 70 year old grotty aluminium or worse still mag alloy casting spinning at ludicrous speed, of alloys that wouldn't be approved for the manufacture of novelty ashtrays today, are too much of a crapshoot to convince the CAA of it being anything other than a bad idea. Plus there's the advantage that remanufacture and ready availability of spares will give added incentive to those restoring airframes to get on with it, the massive progress made in materials and lubricant technology offers the prospect of greatly improved reliability, and those hoarding grotty old crocks that can never safely power aircraft will be more inclined to flog them to loons who want to mount them on trailers to convert petrol into noise or even better fit into cars of some kind.
hidetheelephants said:
Remanufacture seems the best bet for getting a Sabre certified for flight; lumps of 70 year old grotty aluminium or worse still mag alloy casting spinning at ludicrous speed, of alloys that wouldn't be approved for the manufacture of novelty ashtrays today, are too much of a crapshoot to convince the CAA of it being anything other than a bad idea. Plus there's the advantage that remanufacture and ready availability of spares will give added incentive to those restoring airframes to get on with it, the massive progress made in materials and lubricant technology offers the prospect of greatly improved reliability, and those hoarding grotty old crocks that can never safely power aircraft will be more inclined to flog them to loons who want to mount them on trailers to convert petrol into noise or even better fit into cars of some kind.
But wouldn't the remanufactured one be technically a brand new design and need some kind of certification? Although I believe the CAF in the USA did something similar for their B29.ChemicalChaos said:
There is a Typhoon under restoration in this country. From what I've heard on the grapevine, the bloke reckons it will be a flier and there is certainly all sort of impressive CAD drawings for remade parts being posted by him on the internet. Everyone else reckons he's being, well, somewhat optimistic about it being more than a static piece. He has also hoarded all the remaining Sabre engines and spares, reckoning he'll get them certified as airworthy. Apparently the cost of even just appraising them would be absolutely astronomical, but still he insists it will all happen.
Yup, Dave Robinson, and it's really a recreation, using the mortal remains of the rear fuselage of RB396, which for many years had been in the care of a Dutch aviation group. I must admit I'm not sure where he's sourced his Sabre parts from though.....I was pretty sure, Kermit Weeks had managed to acquire the worlds stock of suitable Sabre engines and parts!!
There is also a group in Canada that is attempting a similar recreation, but a static rebuild, of a Tiffie using small remains recovered from various sources, and it's this group that have just acquired this wing section from the museum in the USA.
Hawker Typhoon Preservation Group is meeting at Boultbee Academy on the 29th. Sadly it's sold out, but the plan is to get RB396 restored
http://hawkertyphoon.com/
http://hawkertyphoon.com/
There's a great update on the typhoon restoration, they have managed to source a Napier engine!.
I'd ask why the Napier Engines are so rare, were they just used in a few applications? Seems a waste of R & D time and money if they were.
https://hawkertyphoon.com/new-year-round-up/#more-...
I'm intending to go the open day on either the 25th Feb or 25th March
Eric, that's an awesome model you have there. I've just purchased the Airfix starter kit. Hopefully it'll turn out better than the awful Revell Corsair I made, whch believe it or not was a modern kit.
I'd ask why the Napier Engines are so rare, were they just used in a few applications? Seems a waste of R & D time and money if they were.
https://hawkertyphoon.com/new-year-round-up/#more-...
I'm intending to go the open day on either the 25th Feb or 25th March
Eric, that's an awesome model you have there. I've just purchased the Airfix starter kit. Hopefully it'll turn out better than the awful Revell Corsair I made, whch believe it or not was a modern kit.
texaxile said:
There's a great update on the typhoon restoration, they have managed to source a Napier engine!.
I'd ask why the Napier Engines are so rare, were they just used in a few applications? Seems a waste of R & D time and money if they were.
https://hawkertyphoon.com/new-year-round-up/#more-...
I'm intending to go the open day on either the 25th Feb or 25th March
Eric, that's an awesome model you have there. I've just purchased the Airfix starter kit. Hopefully it'll turn out better than the awful Revell Corsair I made, whch believe it or not was a modern kit.
More information on applications of the Sabre engine:I'd ask why the Napier Engines are so rare, were they just used in a few applications? Seems a waste of R & D time and money if they were.
https://hawkertyphoon.com/new-year-round-up/#more-...
I'm intending to go the open day on either the 25th Feb or 25th March
Eric, that's an awesome model you have there. I've just purchased the Airfix starter kit. Hopefully it'll turn out better than the awful Revell Corsair I made, whch believe it or not was a modern kit.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Napier_Sabre
Comparatively few compared with the Merlin and Griffon, and far more complex, so not surprising not too many survived.
By coincidence, today a friend of the missus gave her a cardboard box containing two models with the instructions to chuck them in the bin if the kids don’t want them. To my amazement there was a 1:72 Airfix Typhoon 1b (same as the project aircraft), and a Do.17. Both beautifully built and finished, and both thick with dust despite them not being more than 5 years old (both new tools) Weird.
I’ve carefully cleaned them up and repaired some minor damage - someone put a lot of effort into them; they won’t be going in the bin.
Btw are you sure the Revell Corsair was really the new version?
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