Berlin Airlift
Discussion
Gents, if I don't get a response here, I'll start a new thread.
Radio beacons. How do/did they work? It would seem that Jig Willie crashed at Conholt because it was following the wrong beacon which was at Netheravon instead or Tarrant Rushton. They were apparently close together in frequency, but obviously in dense fog and poor visibility, they were 35 miles off course and flew into the North Downs that obviously weren't supposed to be there. They thought they were much further South over flat ground.
Radio beacons. How do/did they work? It would seem that Jig Willie crashed at Conholt because it was following the wrong beacon which was at Netheravon instead or Tarrant Rushton. They were apparently close together in frequency, but obviously in dense fog and poor visibility, they were 35 miles off course and flew into the North Downs that obviously weren't supposed to be there. They thought they were much further South over flat ground.
The type of beacons used back then (and are still around now) are NDBs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-directional_beac...
They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
Only just spotted this thread. Dad (McNab) was a 2nd Lt in the Gordon Highlanders doing his National Service when he found himself being flown into Berlin. He told us various stories of his misadventures there, the treatment of the Germans by the Russians, being based next to Spandau where Hess was etc. I think it was a pretty grim eye-opener for a 19 year old and I suspect affected him deeply.
uncinqsix said:
The type of beacons used back then (and are still around now) are NDBs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-directional_beac...
They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
I think they broadcast in AM so the signal was prone to distortion due to atmospherics etc. NDB means "Non-Directional Beacon" by the way and ADF means "Automatic Direction Finder".They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
uncinqsix said:
The type of beacons used back then (and are still around now) are NDBs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-directional_beac...
They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
So, sorry for being a bit slow, and please correct me if I'm wrong, but would this scenario be correct...?They provide more of a vague indication of direction than an accurate means of navigation, especially with the relatively primitive ADFs used back then.
Plane flying to Tarrant Rushton is scanning the airwaves for their NDB broadcasting on say 204Mhz (no idea if the frequency is correct, bear with me) and locates a broadcast on 204.3Mhz and wrongly homes in on that beacon thinking it's Tarrant Rushton, but it's actually Netheravon? Do the beacons broadcast a morse letter or something? Like for instance TR broadcasting a N (dash dot) and Netheravon broadcasting R (dot dash dot) or how are the beacons differentiated?
Hi Tyre Smoke, just came upon your posts the other day searching for Berlin Airlift info and the plane crash in Andover as I sometimes do- I’m proud to say Cyril Taylor was my Grandad - so I'm very moved to see the discussion on the feed. I've visited the grave twice, the first was for an organised anniversary, and the last time was for a personal visit, it was in a sorry state, bit it looks brand new in the photo and a fitting tribute to fine men so thank you so much for yours and those involved in this. I would love to find out more about your Grandad too and share any info we have about them and the others. I don't know if you and a few others on the feed managed the meet up at Tarrant, but would love to join if not happened already - I'm in Dorset at least once a month. As a personal journey, I'm thinking of going to Tempelhof this year as my birthday is 18th Nov so I often think of 22nd November - also as my Grandma and aunty - Cyril's eldest daughter - both passed in the month of November. I've always wanted to visit there and the arboretum and this thread has inspired me not to wait any longer. I’d also like to visit the crash area and try to find out more there. I think I'm right in saying Cyril was not meant to be on the flight originally but he'd given his seat up on another for someone else.. though I don't know the details. My mum has a few of Cyril's flight log books and the range of planes he flew was unbelievable, I'm in awe of his skill at such a young age, though I know they all were so very young- ironically he was called Pop Taylor as he was the oldest in his crew etc. He was also known as Tak Taylor as he had a connection to Takoradi. I think he met my Grandma either there or in Zimbabwe, then Rhodesia, and their first child, my aunty mentioned above was definitely born in Zimbabwe, as she had dual citizenship. My Grandma travelled to Africa as a young maternity nurse - I always thought this was very intrepid of her, but sadly I never spoke to her about her life, I always got the impression talking about it would be too painful, plus she was a formidable woman who didn't openly show emotion- I understood this an adult on reflecting that when Cyril was killed at 34, my Grandma, Elfreda, was 6 months pregnant with a girl, and had 3 girls under the age of five – she had immense reserve and strength to carry on and raise them and she never remarried or had a relationship with another man. I've always written and been interested in poetry but it wasn't until I was into my 30's I found out Cyril collected and wrote poems too - I have copies of some of them - very moving, a lot of flying references and images of loss as you would expect - that's another reason I feel so connected to a man I never met and who gives me immense pride when I dare to think about his and the sacrifice of all involved in WW2 and the Airlift. Thank you and everyone who has contributed to this feed, I too am interested in people’s lives and found all the comments very informative with information I would not have known if I hadn’t clicked on and now become a member of PH, randomly, to piece together the details of that day and the lives of those connected. Coincidentally, and sorry if I'm wrong but if I've remembered correctly from the feed your Grandad has Cornwall connections, and Cyril's family is from there too - I think they still run a garage there, that can be my PH connection – plus I’m doing an R8 driving experience at Thruxton so a perfect opportunity to visit the grave. Your journey in life may have taken a different turn from this now but hope to hear from you if you feel comfortable and happy to do so, best wishes
Hello!
I don't know if your profile accepts direct messages, but I'll try in a moment or two.
It would be great to meet up either at the grave or somewhere else. Or both actually, a beer and swapping of stories and stuff would be fantastic.
I pay a man in Andover to maintain the grave, he keeps it looking brand new and places flowers on it four times a year, 25th April (Anzac day) 9th July (Donny's birthday) 11th November (Remembrance Day) and 22 November of course.
Whenever I visit I always say good hello to all of them, usually something along the lines of "Afternoon gentlemen, you're looking particularly smart today"
.
I paid for the complete Air Investigation Branch file for the crash last year, makes for sombre reading.
Great to hear from you, I did a little bit of digging on the Internet and discovered something about Cyril's school honouring him back in Rhodesia (as it was).
I don't know if your profile accepts direct messages, but I'll try in a moment or two.
It would be great to meet up either at the grave or somewhere else. Or both actually, a beer and swapping of stories and stuff would be fantastic.
I pay a man in Andover to maintain the grave, he keeps it looking brand new and places flowers on it four times a year, 25th April (Anzac day) 9th July (Donny's birthday) 11th November (Remembrance Day) and 22 November of course.
Whenever I visit I always say good hello to all of them, usually something along the lines of "Afternoon gentlemen, you're looking particularly smart today"
.I paid for the complete Air Investigation Branch file for the crash last year, makes for sombre reading.
Great to hear from you, I did a little bit of digging on the Internet and discovered something about Cyril's school honouring him back in Rhodesia (as it was).
Hi Tyre Smoke,
So good to hear from you - thank you for getting back to me - so sorry, I've been checking my profile and emails regularly to see if anyone had commented or if you'd seen my post - but didn't think to actually check the feed - I've never posted on a forum before, you can probably tell!! I'll send a direct message to you with my details today. It'd be really nice to meet up and find out more about your story too-be good to get some research tips from you - thank you for the info about Cyril, I feel there's so much to learn and places to explore. Thank you so very much for your generosity and kind gesture in tending to their resting place. I'm planning a visit there Sunday 7th August and I've already booked a trip to Templehof in November - your story inspired me to finally go ahead and do it - I'm so grateful to you for the push.
So good to hear from you - thank you for getting back to me - so sorry, I've been checking my profile and emails regularly to see if anyone had commented or if you'd seen my post - but didn't think to actually check the feed - I've never posted on a forum before, you can probably tell!! I'll send a direct message to you with my details today. It'd be really nice to meet up and find out more about your story too-be good to get some research tips from you - thank you for the info about Cyril, I feel there's so much to learn and places to explore. Thank you so very much for your generosity and kind gesture in tending to their resting place. I'm planning a visit there Sunday 7th August and I've already booked a trip to Templehof in November - your story inspired me to finally go ahead and do it - I'm so grateful to you for the push.
Tyre Smoke said:
Hello!
I don't know if your profile accepts direct messages, but I'll try in a moment or two.
It would be great to meet up either at the grave or somewhere else. Or both actually, a beer and swapping of stories and stuff would be fantastic.
I pay a man in Andover to maintain the grave, he keeps it looking brand new and places flowers on it four times a year, 25th April (Anzac day) 9th July (Donny's birthday) 11th November (Remembrance Day) and 22 November of course.
Whenever I visit I always say good hello to all of them, usually something along the lines of "Afternoon gentlemen, you're looking particularly smart today".
I paid for the complete Air Investigation Branch file for the crash last year, makes for sombre reading.
Great to hear from you, I did a little bit of digging on the Internet and discovered something about Cyril's school honouring him back in Rhodesia (as it was).
I don't know if your profile accepts direct messages, but I'll try in a moment or two.
It would be great to meet up either at the grave or somewhere else. Or both actually, a beer and swapping of stories and stuff would be fantastic.
I pay a man in Andover to maintain the grave, he keeps it looking brand new and places flowers on it four times a year, 25th April (Anzac day) 9th July (Donny's birthday) 11th November (Remembrance Day) and 22 November of course.
Whenever I visit I always say good hello to all of them, usually something along the lines of "Afternoon gentlemen, you're looking particularly smart today"
.I paid for the complete Air Investigation Branch file for the crash last year, makes for sombre reading.
Great to hear from you, I did a little bit of digging on the Internet and discovered something about Cyril's school honouring him back in Rhodesia (as it was).
Having finally caught up with one of my brothers, I received a lot of stuff about my grandad. Including this picture of his Halifax (?) from his time in 138Sqn. Note redesign of the nose because it carried no armaments save for a tail gunner. Picture is simply entitled 'kite'. A bit more digging and it was LL290 NF-L "Jive Bomber".
They then transferred to Stirlings, his being NF-J "Kiwi Express" another crew took it up in October '44 and FTR from France. I've got some pics of the the "Kiwi Express" which I'll post up this weekend.
They then transferred to Stirlings, his being NF-J "Kiwi Express" another crew took it up in October '44 and FTR from France. I've got some pics of the the "Kiwi Express" which I'll post up this weekend.
Tyre Smoke said:
Having finally caught up with one of my brothers, I received a lot of stuff about my grandad. Including this picture of his Halifax (?) from his time in 138Sqn. Note redesign of the nose because it carried no armaments save for a tail gunner. Picture is simply entitled 'kite'. A bit more digging and it was LL290 NF-L "Jive Bomber".
They then transferred to Stirlings, his being NF-J "Kiwi Express" another crew took it up in October '44 and FTR from France. I've got some pics of the the "Kiwi Express" which I'll post up this weekend.
Pretty sure that’s a Lancaster/Lancastrian rather than a Halifax.They then transferred to Stirlings, his being NF-J "Kiwi Express" another crew took it up in October '44 and FTR from France. I've got some pics of the the "Kiwi Express" which I'll post up this weekend.
Gassing Station | Boats, Planes & Trains | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff