Boats...money pits???

[Badda]

Simpo Two said:

NITO said:

I'd want to lift annually anyway. A chance to review everything, the props, rudders, trim tabs, seacocks, bow thruster and as you say all the anodes. According to my survey, it's good practice to lift the boats out and let the hull dry for a few weeks a year and shed some moisture, I have insufficient experience on that so can't comment.

Traditionally boats are 'laid up' over winter - ie sitting on the bank on trestles with all the water drained out so it can't freeze and crack anything.

I did that in the first year - then realised I was wasting 5 months of the year! So when speccing my second boat I went for Coppercoat. The boat has been lifted out a few times, either for weed blockages or other work such as refurbing the bathing platform - and the anodes are still fine after 10 years. But generally it stays in the water all year, and in winter it's plugged into shore power with heaters to stop it from freezing.

There is probably no 'right' answer, it will depend where your boat is and what you like doing with it.

The survey report for my boat suggested that the hull had a higher moisture content than you'd expect (not osmosis) and he put it down to not being lifted for years and suggested a few weeks a year would rectify it.

TBH, like NITO it's quite nice having it out and checking it all over each year and my anodes last 1 year exactly (probably a result of a busy marina with lots of people on shore power) so it must come out anyway. It's the worst part of ownership though, missing days like this on the water. But the launch day (late feb this year) will be lovely as the boat is fit for another season.

[Simpo Two]

Badda said:

my anodes last 1 year exactly (probably a result of a busy marina with lots of people on shore power)

I didn't realise shore power wore out anodes. Is that because you're in salt water, or have a steel hull, or both?

[Badda]

I don't fully understand it but all the boats being on shore power effectively makes a circuit of all of you and if other boats have poor galvanic protection, you take on the burden by being part of that circuit. I think!

[WCZ]

your sunseeker looks nice!

how far can you go with these, could you go to spain or something with them? what's the range

[Simpo Two]

Badda said:

I don't fully understand it but all the boats being on shore power effectively makes a circuit of all of you and if other boats have poor galvanic protection, you take on the burden by being part of that circuit. I think!

I have an idea. To save the need for cables (trip hazard), just connect the water in the marina to the mains, then each boat can use its bathing ladder as a pick-up...

[dhutch]

Badda said:

I don't fully understand it but all the boats being on shore power effectively makes a circuit of all of you and if other boats have poor galvanic protection, you take on the burden by being part of that circuit. I think!

Yes, depending on the setup, you can end up with the situation that all the big metal bits the boats are bonded together, and via the earth pin of the shoreline, to each other and often also the jetty itself.

There are various devices, from a 'galvanic isolator' (box of diodes) to a full spec isolation transformer, which be used to isolated the power on boat from that of another.

[NITO]

WCZ said:

your sunseeker looks nice!

how far can you go with these, could you go to spain or something with them? what's the range

Thank you. The brochure range is 325 nautical miles out of its 990L fuel tanks. In reality we are filling up at around 160-170miles with about a third of a tank left in there. We did an 8 hour trip around the UK south coast covering around 140 miles at cruising speed.

The previous owners took her as far as La Rochelle, so there is plenty of scope to take it to Spain, it would involve an amount of Marina hopping though!

[WCZ]

would be such a fun trip going to spain!

[AlexIT]

WCZ said:

would be such a fun trip going to spain!

Well with 300ish miles out of a 900 litres tank, that would make an interesting journey

Moreover you'd be crossing some of the best sailing areas, should I do it, I'd do it with a sailing boat.
You just have to calculate correctly the tides to enter harbours though... for us used to the Med is not so straightforward

[NNK]

Well done OP, as someone who started looking at 10m sailboats and ended up with a 15m power catamaran I think I know the thought process and justifications.
We have spent the last year learning (previous boat was a 20' ski/wabeboard Mastercraft) and improving/modifying her as we leave NZ in May to spend 3-5 years floating around the South Pacific islands.

[Simpo Two]

NNK said:

we leave NZ in May to spend 3-5 years floating around the South Pacific islands.

New Zealand - South Pacific... I think I hate you

[AlexIT]

Simpo Two said:

NNK said:

we leave NZ in May to spend 3-5 years floating around the South Pacific islands.

New Zealand - South Pacific... I think I hate you

Nah.... just too many volcanoes down there, I mean who'd really want to go?


NNK, I think I've got similar feelings as ST

[B3Svert]

Lovely boat there Nito, congratulations and enjoy her!

Chiming in with my own experience over the last few years.

In 2014 I bought a year 2000 Four Winns 268 Vista cabin cruiser. Very exciting times and absolutely loved getting out to sea (and out of the city of Singapore) for some space and fresh air.
In relative terms it was a cheap buy, at least compared to buying a car here. Spent $45k on the boat, around $1k per month on berthing, $5k on marina club membership, maybe $100 per month on fuel for 2-3 trips out per month to local islands, anchorages etc.



However, maintenance was higher than I expected (first boat, bit ropey, previous owner was less than honest about works and quality of works done).
Had a significant breakdown after a couple of months which resulted in around 2 months (over Chinese New Year) of downtime, engine out, top end overhaul.
Opened my eyes a lot to the maintenance side of things which was a useful and interesting process. Got stuck into proactive maintenance but being an aging, sea-water cooled engine it really was a ticking timebomb.
Had a full rebuild in 2016 which clearly was not done well as 6 months later it was out of action again. This time decided to replace the engine and sell on.
Overall cost of ownership was worthwhile, but did put me off the idea of running a raw water cooled sterndrive power boat again.

I then bought a sailing yacht (yes I love spending money on maintenance). 2005 Bavaria 39 Cruiser which suits my needs perfectly, though of course not to everyone's tastes/preferences.
Went into this with wide open eyes after 2 years of research, many viewings of other yachts including 2 other pre-purchase surveys on deals that fell through.
Bought this at the right mix of emotion/price/condition/equipment/jobs to be done. Selectively chose the right people to work on the boat and had all the works done in Langkawi for a significant saving over doing it locally in Singapore.



Given market conditions I could sell her today for more than she owes me now, but I plan to keep her for another couple of years so expect to lose a decent amount over that time. However, all the time I spend on board is well worth it. She's berthed in arguably the nicest marina in Southeast Asia. It's like having your shed/workshop/sportscar/holiday home/caravan/mistress in a posh resort. Even if I'm not sailing her, I'll be on board over a weekend "doing jobs" which invariably means catching up with friends there, having a few beers, tinkering a bit etc. The miles under sail, at anchor, sleeping on the deck under the stars, getting soaking wet in a squall are all priceless. Boating and sailing is a lifestyle hobby and a massive learning curve which has become an important and enjoyable part of my life with new friends, new experiences and new places visited.

Money pit? Depends on your choice and experience. For me, even the bad experience can have positives so well worth it.

But yeah, I personally wouldn't buy another older stern drive power boat!

[WCZ]

NNK said:

Well done OP, as someone who started looking at 10m sailboats and ended up with a 15m power catamaran I think I know the thought process and justifications.
We have spent the last year learning (previous boat was a 20' ski/wabeboard Mastercraft) and improving/modifying her as we leave NZ in May to spend 3-5 years floating around the South Pacific islands.

the dream!

[AndrewCrown]

Great post B3Svert..

Its all about Costs vs Value

We're a year or so behind Nito in getting a serious boat...
Going into it with eyes wide open, it is going to cost between a lot and an awful lot. It can be offset with brilliant and memorable experiences..

I had to laugh at a sailing Vlog I've been following, the couple had sold everything to sail round the world and were comparing their new life with their stressed office based old life. The guy outlined that life was not without worries... Like how to stave off an attack by a pod of Orcas!

[SpeckledJim]

Badda said:

The trouble is, boats need lifting annually anyway to replace anodes so the saving that copper coat gives is only the cost of AF (+labour if you’re not willing to do it yourself). My AF this year cost £120….copper coat doesn’t make economic sense to me although the thought of not needing to AF each year is attractive.

I guess anodes could be replaced by a diver to reduce the lift out cost..

Genuine question - if the anode was twice as big, would it only need replacing half as often?

[Jaguar steve]

SpeckledJim said:

Genuine question - if the anode was twice as big, would it only need replacing half as often?

If you could keep the exposed surface clean and the electrial bonding good then, yes.

But no marina or boatyard is going to sell you anything that compromises an opportunity for them to open your wallet again in the future.

[NNK]

AlexIT said:

Simpo Two said:

NNK said:

we leave NZ in May to spend 3-5 years floating around the South Pacific islands.

New Zealand - South Pacific... I think I hate you

Nah.... just too many volcanoes down there, I mean who'd really want to go?


NNK, I think I've got similar feelings as ST

The last couple of big jobs are being done in March when Lazy Sunday comes out of the water, watermaker fitted and all new through hulls.
We are going to Fiji with a group of up to 30 boats, we will stay with/near them for 6 months then they head back to NZ and we do our own thing until the $ run out

[Badda]

SpeckledJim said:

Badda said:

The trouble is, boats need lifting annually anyway to replace anodes so the saving that copper coat gives is only the cost of AF (+labour if you’re not willing to do it yourself). My AF this year cost £120….copper coat doesn’t make economic sense to me although the thought of not needing to AF each year is attractive.

I guess anodes could be replaced by a diver to reduce the lift out cost..

Genuine question - if the anode was twice as big, would it only need replacing half as often?

It’s a good question and the answer i think is yes! However some of the anodes are very much limited by their position (thruster, prop, shaft) and others would also create ++drag if made enormous. Some do hang a large anode over the edge on an earthing wire to try and take the strain off the others.

Saying that, all my anodes (regardless of size) have eroded at the same %age which makes me question the above.