Commandos vs aircraft
Discussion
Tony1963 said:
Taking out an engine doesn’t disable an aircraft for very long really, and a decent battle damage repair team would make good the intakes quite swiftly.
An incendiary round into the fuselage and fuel tank/s will only result in holes and a fuel leak. The tanks will be full and possibly self-sealing, so a Hollywood explosion is unlikely.
If you hit the fuel tanks with something like a .50 anti-materiel rifle and they were full it would probably cause more damage than hitting an empty tank, that said an incendiary round in an empty tank might ignite any residual vapour.An incendiary round into the fuselage and fuel tank/s will only result in holes and a fuel leak. The tanks will be full and possibly self-sealing, so a Hollywood explosion is unlikely.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG1NQ3V1okE
See how the shockwave of the full metal jacket round ruptures the water butt @4m
Hit an airframe with half a dozen .50 rounds in and around the engines/cockpit area and I doubt it will be flying anytime soon.
Tango13 said:
If you hit the fuel tanks with something like a .50 anti-materiel rifle and they were full it would probably cause more damage than hitting an empty tank, that said an incendiary round in an empty tank might ignite any residual vapour.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG1NQ3V1okE
See how the shockwave of the full metal jacket round ruptures the water butt @4m
Hit an airframe with half a dozen .50 rounds in and around the engines/cockpit area and I doubt it will be flying anytime soon.
As I said in my first post, there are just too many variables. Lots of ifs. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NG1NQ3V1okE
See how the shockwave of the full metal jacket round ruptures the water butt @4m
Hit an airframe with half a dozen .50 rounds in and around the engines/cockpit area and I doubt it will be flying anytime soon.
Almost everywhere I’ve worked on fixed wing military aircraft, they’ve been protected by hardened aircraft shelters, and during exercises only left when they could trundle straight to the runway. The airfield was fairly well defended too, but this was mainly in the 80s and 90s. Letting off a volley of .50 cal and causing the necessary damage to more than one aircraft wouldn’t be easy.
I’ve seen the lack of damage caused by .50 cal rounds to Apaches. Passes straight through, and always leaves the aircraft flyable, although it might be relying on system redundancy.
Many years ago I have served at a foreign airforce. The airbase that i was based in was a WWII field with WWII infrastructure. One side of the airfield was civil while the other was military. One morning we found all aircraft marked with very large and fat X painted around the under carriages, we were raided by a commando unit under training. The top brass were unhappy but we were a very soft target and everyone knew it.
If you take a look at Mt Pleasant RAF base (google earth) you will see that the Typhoon hangars are a long way apart. Would be difficult to take them all out from a distance.
The air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
The air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
If you're actually talking about getting up close and personal then something like a bag of thermite over the main wing spar would be a half nod to subtlety but unquestionably put it out of action.
From afar well the world's your oyster if you can be down at the end/edge of the runway...
From afar well the world's your oyster if you can be down at the end/edge of the runway...
Ayahuasca said:
If you take a look at Mt Pleasant RAF base (google earth) you will see that the Typhoon hangars are a long way apart. Would be difficult to take them all out from a distance.
The air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
FFSThe air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
Even exploring MPA via Google Earth is a depressing experience.
TheFungle said:
Ayahuasca said:
If you take a look at Mt Pleasant RAF base (google earth) you will see that the Typhoon hangars are a long way apart. Would be difficult to take them all out from a distance.
The air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
FFSThe air to air refuelling Voyager however is sitting there out in the open. Without her the Typhoons have vastly limited capabilities.
You could always scatter some drawing pins on the runway.
Even exploring MPA via Google Earth is a depressing experience.
When I arrived on my last Sqn before leaving the RAF the WO had a chat with me and asked if I had any preferences for work. At this point I only had a few years left in so I asked for nice quiet Hangar job and to be kept away from deploying to the desert yet again if possible whilst I started the process of leaving. "No problem" he says, then 4 months later he called me back into his office - "You know I said I'd keep you away from the desert?" - "Yes Sir you did make the promise" (with a sinking feeling in my chest) - "Well I've kept my promise (yay!), you're off to the Falklands instead for 3 months, enjoy! (son of a........!)" - "LOL fair play Sir!
", had to laugh at that.During my tour there in 2013 it was a well known issue that there was no hardened facility for the tanker/transport side of the airfield. I think it was a lack of cash that caused the lack of any added to the original design followed by various sized aircraft moving in/out of MPA every few years which meant no-one could ever design a hardened facility to be "the right size" because as soon as they did, a new plane even bigger than the last would arrive etc and by now there's definitely no money left!
Edited by IanH755 on Wednesday 8th July 13:13
Handful of coins in the intake "for luck"?
A .50cal rifle with a bag full of these would probably do the trick:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raufoss_Mk_211
A .50cal rifle with a bag full of these would probably do the trick:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raufoss_Mk_211
IanH755 said:
LOL, I enjoyed my time there, made a change from spending 12+ years looking at nothing but desert
When I arrived on my last Sqn before leaving the RAF the WO had a chat with me and asked if I had any preferences for work. At this point I only had a few years left in so I asked for nice quiet Hangar job and to be kept away from deploying to the desert yet again if possible whilst I started the process of leaving. "No problem" he says, then 4 months later he called me back into his office - "You know I said I'd keep you away from the desert?" - "Yes Sir you did make the promise" (with a sinking feeling in my chest) - "Well I've kept my promise (yay!), you're off to the Falklands instead for 3 months, enjoy! (son of a........!)" - "LOL fair play Sir!", had to laugh at that.
During my tour there in 2013 it was a well known issue that there was no hardened facility for the tanker/transport side of the airfield. I think it was a lack of cash that caused the lack of any added to the original design followed by various sized aircraft moving in/out of MPA every few years which meant no-one could ever design a hardened facility to be "the right size" because as soon as they did, a new plane even bigger than the last would arrive etc and by now there's definitely no money left!
I suppose there's an argument that if someone's going around sabotaging flying things, a fast jet is very problematic to repair or replace especially at short notice, wheras if they knock out a voyager in a time of critical need, the backup plan would be to rock up at Heathrow or wherever, "borrow" a couple of A330s, and swap some bits over...When I arrived on my last Sqn before leaving the RAF the WO had a chat with me and asked if I had any preferences for work. At this point I only had a few years left in so I asked for nice quiet Hangar job and to be kept away from deploying to the desert yet again if possible whilst I started the process of leaving. "No problem" he says, then 4 months later he called me back into his office - "You know I said I'd keep you away from the desert?" - "Yes Sir you did make the promise" (with a sinking feeling in my chest) - "Well I've kept my promise (yay!), you're off to the Falklands instead for 3 months, enjoy! (son of a........!)" - "LOL fair play Sir!
", had to laugh at that.During my tour there in 2013 it was a well known issue that there was no hardened facility for the tanker/transport side of the airfield. I think it was a lack of cash that caused the lack of any added to the original design followed by various sized aircraft moving in/out of MPA every few years which meant no-one could ever design a hardened facility to be "the right size" because as soon as they did, a new plane even bigger than the last would arrive etc and by now there's definitely no money left!
Edited by IanH755 on Wednesday 8th July 13:13
Teddy Lop said:
I suppose there's an argument that if someone's going around sabotaging flying things, a fast jet is very problematic to repair or replace especially at short notice, wheras if they knock out a voyager in a time of critical need, the backup plan would be to rock up at Heathrow or wherever, "borrow" a couple of A330s, and swap some bits over...
1. Disable the tanker2. Fly attack a/c towards the Falklands to scramble the Typhoons
3. Run back to the mainland
4. Play until the Typhoons run out of fuel
5. Send in the real attack.
Too late to get the spare Voyager from UK.
Quite easy.
Have 7 Commandos write noise complaints about the aircraft and have another post them. Then they could start a local Facebook group whining about the aircraft noise over their village. The enemy would then be scared to fly and eventually have the airfield closed down by the council.
Job done
Have 7 Commandos write noise complaints about the aircraft and have another post them. Then they could start a local Facebook group whining about the aircraft noise over their village. The enemy would then be scared to fly and eventually have the airfield closed down by the council.
Job done
Sophisticated Sarah said:
Quite easy.
Have 7 Commandos write noise complaints about the aircraft and have another post them. Then they could start a local Facebook group whining about the aircraft noise over their village. The enemy would then be scared to fly and eventually have the airfield closed down by the council.
Job done
That was my favourite thing when they moved the Hercs to Brize. The local villages, filled with people who moved next the UK's busiest Military airfield and then complained about the noise, had already had double glazing fitted but because Hercs made a "different" noise they all wrote brand new letters of complaint until we were forced into "no engine runs past midnight" type stuff.Have 7 Commandos write noise complaints about the aircraft and have another post them. Then they could start a local Facebook group whining about the aircraft noise over their village. The enemy would then be scared to fly and eventually have the airfield closed down by the council.
Job done
Oh and David Cameron, who was still PM then, was the Local MP. Guess who started to get Triple Glazing installed for free soon afterwards.
Personally I think anyone who lives in an area before the noise exists should be helped out as much as possible, but anyone who moves after the noise should be told to jog on, regardless of whether its an airfield, motor racing circuit etc - You move into the area after the source of any noise been built, tough!
kING AWESOME AT ABSOLUTELY EVERYTHING they are.IanH755 said:
Personally I think anyone who lives in an area before the noise exists should be helped out as much as possible, but anyone who moves after the noise should be told to jog on, regardless of whether its an airfield, motor racing circuit etc - You move into the area after the source of any noise been built, tough!
Yep, 100%. It should be the default that nose complaints for pre existing sources should immediately be ignored.Gassing Station | Boats, Planes & Trains | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff