Illyria Raid - anyone done it?
Discussion
Mate of mine has signed up for the 2021 Illyria Raid - http://www.illyriaraid.com - and I'm on the verge of jumping in.
I've done a reasonable amount of foreign offloading before, couple of 4-day tours in Morocco on KTM450s, another Morocco tour on a 1200GS, and several Spanish trips. Not done seven days though! I'm also without a suitable steed at present. He's got a 350 EXC and a newish Tenere 700, he's planning to use that. I'm tempted to buy one too, I can man-math my way through a new bike and the Tenere looks like quite a decent bit of kit. Obvious competitor would be the 790 Adventure (but someone on here said those were a bit low-rent?) or one of the smaller GS range.
Anyway just looking to see whether anyone has any experience and what it was like? Looks pretty impressive so far!
I've done a reasonable amount of foreign offloading before, couple of 4-day tours in Morocco on KTM450s, another Morocco tour on a 1200GS, and several Spanish trips. Not done seven days though! I'm also without a suitable steed at present. He's got a 350 EXC and a newish Tenere 700, he's planning to use that. I'm tempted to buy one too, I can man-math my way through a new bike and the Tenere looks like quite a decent bit of kit. Obvious competitor would be the 790 Adventure (but someone on here said those were a bit low-rent?) or one of the smaller GS range.
Anyway just looking to see whether anyone has any experience and what it was like? Looks pretty impressive so far!
Not done it but just commenting on the bike choice. KTM 690 or Husqvarna 701 maybe a better choice than the Tenere?
For the £9000 a Tenere would cost new you could probably build something really special. Either of those with a rally fairing and full soft luggage and protection parts. There’s a few people that do them, the Nomad, Aurora and Kit690 are the ones that spring to mind.
You mentioned the smaller BMWs. I’m lucky enough to own an 850GS and a G310GS Rally Raid. The 850 is a great bike but probably a bit big and top heavy for proper, serious off road like what you’re suggesting! The suspension is good for OEM but not exceptional. The 310 Rally Raid would be a much better choice for it. Very light, manoeuvrable and with top quality suspension but a bit limiting on the faster stuff.
For the £9000 a Tenere would cost new you could probably build something really special. Either of those with a rally fairing and full soft luggage and protection parts. There’s a few people that do them, the Nomad, Aurora and Kit690 are the ones that spring to mind.
You mentioned the smaller BMWs. I’m lucky enough to own an 850GS and a G310GS Rally Raid. The 850 is a great bike but probably a bit big and top heavy for proper, serious off road like what you’re suggesting! The suspension is good for OEM but not exceptional. The 310 Rally Raid would be a much better choice for it. Very light, manoeuvrable and with top quality suspension but a bit limiting on the faster stuff.
Thanks for the input there, much appreciated.
I have a real quandary over what to do with my stable of bikes. Some are keepers, no question, some can go, no question, some I'm not sure about! Prior to this event being mentioned I was seriously looking at chopping my 1200RT out for an 1190 Adventure; the RT was a tool to commute on which I don't need any more and the Adventure is more "me". But I suspect, and particularly given what you wrote above, that the 1190 Adv would be too chunky for this event. If I bought the Tenere then I'm not sure where it would fit in to regular use once back home. On the other hand, I have time now to do what I like and maybe something like that would be good for doing TET trips etc?
I could get rid of my old WR450F, which to be honest is a bit past it, and go for something like a 450EXC or a 525EXC and use that on the Illyria. Seems like a lot of people do, and as per my OP, I've done plenty of off-road miles in Morocco on an EXC. But I can't help feeling that might be a little too basic for a 2k ride. We don't have to carry luggage, only what we need during the day, the rest is transported. But still, do I want to ride a full-on enduro bike that far?
All input gratefully received!
I have a real quandary over what to do with my stable of bikes. Some are keepers, no question, some can go, no question, some I'm not sure about! Prior to this event being mentioned I was seriously looking at chopping my 1200RT out for an 1190 Adventure; the RT was a tool to commute on which I don't need any more and the Adventure is more "me". But I suspect, and particularly given what you wrote above, that the 1190 Adv would be too chunky for this event. If I bought the Tenere then I'm not sure where it would fit in to regular use once back home. On the other hand, I have time now to do what I like and maybe something like that would be good for doing TET trips etc?
I could get rid of my old WR450F, which to be honest is a bit past it, and go for something like a 450EXC or a 525EXC and use that on the Illyria. Seems like a lot of people do, and as per my OP, I've done plenty of off-road miles in Morocco on an EXC. But I can't help feeling that might be a little too basic for a 2k ride. We don't have to carry luggage, only what we need during the day, the rest is transported. But still, do I want to ride a full-on enduro bike that far?
All input gratefully received!
That looks an awesome event. I'm tempted. I like the idea of non-competitive because there's no way I could do Hellas Rally or similar at my level of experience.
Bike-wise I think the 690s look like a good compromise. 75% off-road it says, so up to 80km per day on street which would get a bit tiresome on an enduro. Teneres seem to be well received but it's still 190kg. Though if in doubt I would edge towards a smaller rather than larger machine and just put up with it on the road sections.
Bike-wise I think the 690s look like a good compromise. 75% off-road it says, so up to 80km per day on street which would get a bit tiresome on an enduro. Teneres seem to be well received but it's still 190kg. Though if in doubt I would edge towards a smaller rather than larger machine and just put up with it on the road sections.
Thanks chaps. I'm going to take my mate's Tenere out one day soon (when it stops persisting down) and then go and have a look at some of the alternatives mentioned above.
I did also ask for opinions on the event's FB page and the organisers said this:
I did also ask for opinions on the event's FB page and the organisers said this:
Illyria said:
"We make the Roadbooks with motorcycles.
Me on KTM Adventure 990S (40 years of off-road experience)
Edvin on a Husqvarna 701 (20 years off-road experience)
I want to say that you can do this on different bikes, but everything depends on your experience and ability!"
I need to decide what I want and then how to rationalise the inhabitants of the shed!Me on KTM Adventure 990S (40 years of off-road experience)
Edvin on a Husqvarna 701 (20 years off-road experience)
I want to say that you can do this on different bikes, but everything depends on your experience and ability!"
Andrew Dalton (of the solicitors and 44teeth fame) has a Husqvarna 701 Nomad and has written a few articles on it, worth a read. It comes as a bolt on kit pre-made, and can be customised to your requirements. Plenty of info on Advrider forum.
Certainly the 701 I rode (the Vitpilen I think) had ample shove for the road sections you’ll be doing. That said, the Tenere 700 looks like a good bike.
Certainly the 701 I rode (the Vitpilen I think) had ample shove for the road sections you’ll be doing. That said, the Tenere 700 looks like a good bike.
We regularly discuss this stuff on my TRF group chat
The vast majority agree that if any serious off roading is involved then the smallest / lightest bike is best - IF it can carry the gear / fuel required - so KTM 525, CRF 450 etc
A few opt for the old school KTM 640 Adventure, DR600 etc and a few for 690/701
Obviously the odd nutter points out a twin is more comfortable and opts for a 950/990
I can only say that having owned a 690 and a 950 I wouldn't want to do much more than gravel / mud tracks, it's true really good riders can do anything on them but 99.9% of us aren't that good.
I've never needed more power / speed than my 525 has - with knobblies and mousses I can't run over 60mph for long anyway - I would add a comfier seat though.
The vast majority agree that if any serious off roading is involved then the smallest / lightest bike is best - IF it can carry the gear / fuel required - so KTM 525, CRF 450 etc
A few opt for the old school KTM 640 Adventure, DR600 etc and a few for 690/701
Obviously the odd nutter points out a twin is more comfortable and opts for a 950/990
I can only say that having owned a 690 and a 950 I wouldn't want to do much more than gravel / mud tracks, it's true really good riders can do anything on them but 99.9% of us aren't that good.
I've never needed more power / speed than my 525 has - with knobblies and mousses I can't run over 60mph for long anyway - I would add a comfier seat though.
Just adding my views to this. I’ll be doing the September 2021 version having had to miss the last two spring editions. I’ll be doing it on either a 350exc or a 500exc - as people have said, while doable on a big bike a bit of bad weather could make the terrain a lot harder. And while Martyn and Edwin set the route on larger bikes, they are not under any time pressure due to getting lost or siteseeing.
The spring editions may also encounter snow up high, which could be a real showstopper on a bike that you cannot manhandle easily
The spring editions may also encounter snow up high, which could be a real showstopper on a bike that you cannot manhandle easily
V8RX7 said:
We regularly discuss this stuff on my TRF group chat
The vast majority agree that if any serious off roading is involved then the smallest / lightest bike is best - IF it can carry the gear / fuel required - so KTM 525, CRF 450 etc
A few opt for the old school KTM 640 Adventure, DR600 etc and a few for 690/701
Obviously the odd nutter points out a twin is more comfortable and opts for a 950/990
I can only say that having owned a 690 and a 950 I wouldn't want to do much more than gravel / mud tracks, it's true really good riders can do anything on them but 99.9% of us aren't that good.
I've never needed more power / speed than my 525 has - with knobblies and mousses I can't run over 60mph for long anyway - I would add a comfier seat though.
The vast majority agree that if any serious off roading is involved then the smallest / lightest bike is best - IF it can carry the gear / fuel required - so KTM 525, CRF 450 etc
A few opt for the old school KTM 640 Adventure, DR600 etc and a few for 690/701
Obviously the odd nutter points out a twin is more comfortable and opts for a 950/990
I can only say that having owned a 690 and a 950 I wouldn't want to do much more than gravel / mud tracks, it's true really good riders can do anything on them but 99.9% of us aren't that good.
I've never needed more power / speed than my 525 has - with knobblies and mousses I can't run over 60mph for long anyway - I would add a comfier seat though.
stigthecadman said:
Just adding my views to this. I’ll be doing the September 2021 version having had to miss the last two spring editions. I’ll be doing it on either a 350exc or a 500exc - as people have said, while doable on a big bike a bit of bad weather could make the terrain a lot harder. And while Martyn and Edwin set the route on larger bikes, they are not under any time pressure due to getting lost or siteseeing.
The spring editions may also encounter snow up high, which could be a real showstopper on a bike that you cannot manhandle easily
Those are both really useful posts, thanks. I get what you're saying, completely. As per my OP, I've done long trips around Morocco on EXCs so I know what that's like. I suppose I'm getting soft in my old age, my thinking was, what could I use which won't leave me crippled at the end of the longer days!The spring editions may also encounter snow up high, which could be a real showstopper on a bike that you cannot manhandle easily
My understanding is that you only need to carry on the bike the stuff you need for the day? Also matey has signed up with Desert Rose for backup so I guess I'll do the same, although I thought the Illyria guys provided a certain amount of that anyway.
Good point about the snow, we talked about that the other day.
IMO it's the small seats, tyres and no screen that make enduro bikes crap on the road
My 525 SM with 17" road tyres is so much nicer to ride.
You're stuck with dirt tyres but a less aggressive tread would improve the road sections - but how tough are the off road sections ?
You can add a comfy seat and a screen easily and some folding mirrors - after that what does a 690/701 have that's better ?
You've probably seen these but I like his stuff
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERHH927p_rw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsorI76PBYc
My 525 SM with 17" road tyres is so much nicer to ride.
You're stuck with dirt tyres but a less aggressive tread would improve the road sections - but how tough are the off road sections ?
You can add a comfy seat and a screen easily and some folding mirrors - after that what does a 690/701 have that's better ?
You've probably seen these but I like his stuff
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERHH927p_rw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lsorI76PBYc
Those are interesting videos, thanks. One thing I hadn't considered with the more enduro-orientated kit was oil capacity (and therefore oil change frequency). My ancient old WR450F is, I think, every 10 hours according to the book, although granted that's based on it being used hard, but I'm certainly not up for a daily oil change on that trip! I want something which will eat the 2k KM hopefully without needing much more than a bit of chain love and maybe an air filter clean if it's dusty - am I being realistic?
Still pondering!
Still pondering!
CAPP0 said:
Those are interesting videos, thanks. One thing I hadn't considered with the more enduro-orientated kit was oil capacity (and therefore oil change frequency). My ancient old WR450F is, I think, every 10 hours according to the book, although granted that's based on it being used hard, but I'm certainly not up for a daily oil change on that trip! I want something which will eat the 2k KM hopefully without needing much more than a bit of chain love and maybe an air filter clean if it's dusty - am I being realistic?
Still pondering!
Yes the guys that use them long distance fit an oil cooler - mostly for the extra oil capacityStill pondering!
I suppose the 690/701 is better suited for 2k really
so it's time to go and try some bikes out!Well here's an early update:
I took my mate's Tenere 700 out for a couple of hours today just to try it. Road tyres only so it there was no greenlaning. What a cracking "little" bike; I say little just because a 700 somehow sounds like a smaller bike, but the engine is really punchy, and it handles really well, inspires confidence very quickly. In fact if I'm honest it's a bit of a hooligan! Couldn't find much to fault it. The only thing for me at 6'3" is that I'd have liked a slightly longer measurement between seat and pegs. Speaking of seats, that seemed very comfortable too, I need to check with him whether that's the standard seat or the rally.
I had a good look at the 701 Nomad mentioned further up the thread. It really does look like an interesting option, and it's 50kg lighter than the Ten, which would be useful for the off-road sections. I'm not sure on tank size. The Illyria requires fuel self-sufficiency of (I think) 130 km minimum, 160 preferred, which is 80 miles, so it'll be interesting to see what the Nomad does to a tank and/or whether larger tanks are available. Overall though it might be a bit of a faff to get a Nomad sorted, plus potentially a fair bit more expensive. Also an interesting note on the Husky was that the frame, particularly the headstock, is a lot stronger than the equivalent KTM.
I haven't looked at the other suggestions above yet.
More when there's more
I took my mate's Tenere 700 out for a couple of hours today just to try it. Road tyres only so it there was no greenlaning. What a cracking "little" bike; I say little just because a 700 somehow sounds like a smaller bike, but the engine is really punchy, and it handles really well, inspires confidence very quickly. In fact if I'm honest it's a bit of a hooligan! Couldn't find much to fault it. The only thing for me at 6'3" is that I'd have liked a slightly longer measurement between seat and pegs. Speaking of seats, that seemed very comfortable too, I need to check with him whether that's the standard seat or the rally.
I had a good look at the 701 Nomad mentioned further up the thread. It really does look like an interesting option, and it's 50kg lighter than the Ten, which would be useful for the off-road sections. I'm not sure on tank size. The Illyria requires fuel self-sufficiency of (I think) 130 km minimum, 160 preferred, which is 80 miles, so it'll be interesting to see what the Nomad does to a tank and/or whether larger tanks are available. Overall though it might be a bit of a faff to get a Nomad sorted, plus potentially a fair bit more expensive. Also an interesting note on the Husky was that the frame, particularly the headstock, is a lot stronger than the equivalent KTM.
I haven't looked at the other suggestions above yet.
More when there's more
Bottom line...what are the off road sections like???
Hard enduro for Graham Jarvus et al or "greenlaning" style??
I took a KTM 1190S around Malawi, Mozambique, Tanzania etc for 2 years and fitted with TKC80's it did everything from tight woods to full on sand rivers and dirt roads. Never missed a beat and having too much power is a wonderful thing when you can knock it back to 100bhp and a loooong throttle to allow better control in the dirt.
Doing 2000kms in 10 days sounds like a bit of road and a lot of faster off road stuff.
As you said above, unless you're doing the Ertzberg, a good 1190R might be just the ticket
Decent tank range, lots of go when needed, good luggage capacity..
And.... a centre stand. Don't underestimate the benefits of a centre stand when fixing a puncture in the woods
Loaded up for the trip from Johannesburg to Blantyre....... including the fishing gear
Hard enduro for Graham Jarvus et al or "greenlaning" style??
I took a KTM 1190S around Malawi, Mozambique, Tanzania etc for 2 years and fitted with TKC80's it did everything from tight woods to full on sand rivers and dirt roads. Never missed a beat and having too much power is a wonderful thing when you can knock it back to 100bhp and a loooong throttle to allow better control in the dirt.
Doing 2000kms in 10 days sounds like a bit of road and a lot of faster off road stuff.
As you said above, unless you're doing the Ertzberg, a good 1190R might be just the ticket
Decent tank range, lots of go when needed, good luggage capacity..
And.... a centre stand. Don't underestimate the benefits of a centre stand when fixing a puncture in the woods
Loaded up for the trip from Johannesburg to Blantyre....... including the fishing gear
Edited by Steve Bass on Thursday 5th November 16:37
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