Coffee. Grinder and Cafetiere or Pods in a machine
Discussion
I have a knock aergrind (about £100), then either pair it with an aeropress or a v60 1 or 3 cup filter. The 3 cup fills a small thermos jug.
Thinking about a flare neo for espresso and maybe an upgrade to a better grinder, the aergrind however fits neatly in the aeropress when travelling - so will continue (one day) to be useful.
S.
Thinking about a flare neo for espresso and maybe an upgrade to a better grinder, the aergrind however fits neatly in the aeropress when travelling - so will continue (one day) to be useful.
S.
RobbieTheTruth said:
You'll get equally bad coffee spraying water at 15 bar pressure into a pressurized portafilter using a Delonghi, at an unstable temperature.
Well I don't know how many times I have to tell you, there's nothing wrong with the coffee that the Delonghi machine makes. It's not speciality coffee standards, but neither is coffee from a B2C machine. You keep getting caught up on temperatures and pressures - it makes no difference at this level of expectation. Its like using super unleaded in a 2 stroke chainsaw.There's certainly a range of possible outcomes from home equipment, and I think most people could tell the difference between pod coffee and a grinder/espresso setup. Whether they would care is another matter.
I have a friend who now describes herself as a "coffee w
ker", all aeropress and hand grinder, and that's great, I'm sure she's getting a more sophisticated experience than I am. I've tried using the lighter roasted beans from a local roaster where I used to live (Rave coffee in Cirencester) and they are interesting, but they're not what I want in my regular coffee. For that I'm perfectly happy with a traditional roast (currently grinding Lavazza red, which is about as generic as it gets and fine for my purposes).
I have a friend who now describes herself as a "coffee w
ker", all aeropress and hand grinder, and that's great, I'm sure she's getting a more sophisticated experience than I am. I've tried using the lighter roasted beans from a local roaster where I used to live (Rave coffee in Cirencester) and they are interesting, but they're not what I want in my regular coffee. For that I'm perfectly happy with a traditional roast (currently grinding Lavazza red, which is about as generic as it gets and fine for my purposes). Interesting topic that can easily turn into a new hobby.
As others have alluded to, I think the starting point and where people often go wrong is what sort of coffee they’re after, and accordingly the method/equipment needed for that.
Some people’s idea of ‘proper’ coffee is bitter supermarket preground in a cafetière bought out at Christmas, others a cappuccino/latte etc, some a long black topped up with milk.
And I think frustration can come from people trying to use the wrong method for their preferred type of coffee, especially if the average persons exposure to coffee is predominantly instant which is generally made one way.
People may buy an Aeropress on recommendation but really want something that creates an espresso like shot to bung in some frothed milk, whereby in lieu of a machine perhaps a Mokka Pot would suit them better.
Or buy a hugely expensive machine and not realise the missing piece of the puzzle is freshly roasted beans kept properly, rather than stale supermarket stuff.
I sometimes make a concentrate of coffee in an Aeropress to make a milky drink but it’s nothing like espresso really and requires double the coffee with the lack of pressure.
Not to thread high jack, but can anyone recommend a decent Mokka Pot that can be used on an induction hob? As finding one with good reviews is proving a challenge.
As others have alluded to, I think the starting point and where people often go wrong is what sort of coffee they’re after, and accordingly the method/equipment needed for that.
Some people’s idea of ‘proper’ coffee is bitter supermarket preground in a cafetière bought out at Christmas, others a cappuccino/latte etc, some a long black topped up with milk.
And I think frustration can come from people trying to use the wrong method for their preferred type of coffee, especially if the average persons exposure to coffee is predominantly instant which is generally made one way.
People may buy an Aeropress on recommendation but really want something that creates an espresso like shot to bung in some frothed milk, whereby in lieu of a machine perhaps a Mokka Pot would suit them better.
Or buy a hugely expensive machine and not realise the missing piece of the puzzle is freshly roasted beans kept properly, rather than stale supermarket stuff.
I sometimes make a concentrate of coffee in an Aeropress to make a milky drink but it’s nothing like espresso really and requires double the coffee with the lack of pressure.
Not to thread high jack, but can anyone recommend a decent Mokka Pot that can be used on an induction hob? As finding one with good reviews is proving a challenge.
I can hear the eyes rolling !rwdaspirations said:
Not to thread high jack, but can anyone recommend a decent Mokka Pot that can be used on an induction hob? As finding one with good reviews is proving a challenge.
No idea. What’s wrong with getting a diffuser and using any old moka pot you want?A (not so) random example.. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bialetti-Adaptor-Inductio...
wisbech said:
Saves washing up a french press...
That's one of the big advantages of an Aeropress in my opinion. They're a bit more faff than some others coffee making methods, but it compresses the grounds in the bottom so you just knock it out in to the bin.However we tend to use the filter machine if making more than one cup at home these days as they do make a decent cup so long as you don't leave it to stew too long.
An advantage of Mokka pots is their portability, I have a small one for use on my camping stove
Edited by RizzoTheRat on Tuesday 3rd November 10:34
bigandclever said:
No idea. What’s wrong with getting a diffuser and using any old moka pot you want?
A (not so) random example.. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bialetti-Adaptor-Inductio...
That looks good cheers. Not sure how I hadn’t come across something like that. A (not so) random example.. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bialetti-Adaptor-Inductio...
I’d read traditional Mokka Pots didn’t work on induction hobs, and those made specially for them had poor reviews so I gave up looking. I may be overthinking it though, as most stuff has bad reviews if you look hard enough.
I manage to make some rather good espresso at home using a 12 year old DeLonghi EC700 machine and a Bodum Bistro burr grinder. Using decent quality, fresh beans and thoroughly tamping the coffee in the portafilter makes all the difference.
Certainly beats the pants off your Starbucks/Nero/Costa (although TBF it's not hard to beat Costa; warm muddy water will come close to their offerings...). Unsurprisingly it won't match the quality of espresso that you'll get from a good specialist coffee house, but it's close enough for my purposes.
I'd certainly like to experiment with a grands' worth of boutique gear, undoubtedly this would produce a better result, however you don't need to invest that much to make an enjoyable espresso!
Certainly beats the pants off your Starbucks/Nero/Costa (although TBF it's not hard to beat Costa; warm muddy water will come close to their offerings...). Unsurprisingly it won't match the quality of espresso that you'll get from a good specialist coffee house, but it's close enough for my purposes.
I'd certainly like to experiment with a grands' worth of boutique gear, undoubtedly this would produce a better result, however you don't need to invest that much to make an enjoyable espresso!
rwdaspirations said:
bigandclever said:
No idea. What’s wrong with getting a diffuser and using any old moka pot you want?
A (not so) random example.. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bialetti-Adaptor-Inductio...
That looks good cheers. Not sure how I hadn’t come across something like that. A (not so) random example.. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bialetti-Adaptor-Inductio...
I’d read traditional Mokka Pots didn’t work on induction hobs, and those made specially for them had poor reviews so I gave up looking. I may be overthinking it though, as most stuff has bad reviews if you look hard enough.
cqueen said:
Well I don't know how many times I have to tell you, there's nothing wrong with the coffee that the Delonghi machine makes. It's not speciality coffee standards, but neither is coffee from a B2C machine. You keep getting caught up on temperatures and pressures - it makes no difference at this level of expectation. Its like using super unleaded in a 2 stroke chainsaw.
No, I do agree with you - 'at that level of expectation' is the key phrase.Temperatures and pressures are absolutely critical in coffee extraction. That machine is poorly configured on both so poor extraction is guaranteed.
Are you using a grinder with it or supermarket coffee?
After travelling lots of South America and all the Air BnBs having moka pots, we got one for home and use it a the weekends.
6 cup pot, split between two mugs and then filled up with hot water.
Tend to use pre-ground beans from Coffeelink, one flavour on the go at once.
Suits us fine.
6 cup pot, split between two mugs and then filled up with hot water.
Tend to use pre-ground beans from Coffeelink, one flavour on the go at once.
Suits us fine.
bigandclever said:
I’d still do a bit of digging in case, you want a solid plate (which I think this is), not a sandwich. And they do get hot, unsurprisingly, so some designs are better at not melting your fingers off than others.
I’ll bear that in mind and have a read around. Think a lot of these things are trial and error really so no harm in giving it a go. rwdaspirations said:
Interesting topic that can easily turn into a new hobby.
As others have alluded to, I think the starting point and where people often go wrong is what sort of coffee they’re after, and accordingly the method/equipment needed for that.
Some people’s idea of ‘proper’ coffee is bitter supermarket preground in a cafetière bought out at Christmas, others a cappuccino/latte etc, some a long black topped up with milk.
And I think frustration can come from people trying to use the wrong method for their preferred type of coffee, especially if the average persons exposure to coffee is predominantly instant which is generally made one way.
People may buy an Aeropress on recommendation but really want something that creates an espresso like shot to bung in some frothed milk, whereby in lieu of a machine perhaps a Mokka Pot would suit them better.
Or buy a hugely expensive machine and not realise the missing piece of the puzzle is freshly roasted beans kept properly, rather than stale supermarket stuff.
I sometimes make a concentrate of coffee in an Aeropress to make a milky drink but it’s nothing like espresso really and requires double the coffee with the lack of pressure.
Not to thread high jack, but can anyone recommend a decent Mokka Pot that can be used on an induction hob? As finding one with good reviews is proving a challenge.
Yeah I agree with this - and I've steered the discussion away from the original question (which was about convenience).As others have alluded to, I think the starting point and where people often go wrong is what sort of coffee they’re after, and accordingly the method/equipment needed for that.
Some people’s idea of ‘proper’ coffee is bitter supermarket preground in a cafetière bought out at Christmas, others a cappuccino/latte etc, some a long black topped up with milk.
And I think frustration can come from people trying to use the wrong method for their preferred type of coffee, especially if the average persons exposure to coffee is predominantly instant which is generally made one way.
People may buy an Aeropress on recommendation but really want something that creates an espresso like shot to bung in some frothed milk, whereby in lieu of a machine perhaps a Mokka Pot would suit them better.
Or buy a hugely expensive machine and not realise the missing piece of the puzzle is freshly roasted beans kept properly, rather than stale supermarket stuff.
I sometimes make a concentrate of coffee in an Aeropress to make a milky drink but it’s nothing like espresso really and requires double the coffee with the lack of pressure.
Not to thread high jack, but can anyone recommend a decent Mokka Pot that can be used on an induction hob? As finding one with good reviews is proving a challenge.
My answers have been based on the easiest way to get a really good espresso.
It's a frustrating and expensive hobby to get into. Basically, if you enjoy a lovely espresso based drink from a specialty coffee shop, and wanted to try and recreate that experience, it's really hard without spending a lot of money and doing research.
A good guideline for perfect extraction is as follows:
18g of ground coffee, yielding 36g of liquid, in 30 seconds, at 9bar pressure, at 92 degrees.
It's hard to find a machine for the home market that can do that.
CQueen is right. They have a Delonghi and know their expectations with it, but if you are new to this hobby, some of the marketing around these machines can convince you to go and spend £200 and expect to recreate what you get at a nice coffee shop.
Using that machine, the water would hit the coffee at 15bar, and go through the grinds in about 15 seconds, at an unstable temperature and the coffee is under-extracted. You're always going to get a poor shot out of it, which you can mask with frothed milk and sugar and it will taste similar to a Starbucks or something.
Perhaps we should start a thread on the cheapest and easiest way to extract perfect Espresso. It can be done on budget machines if you're prepared to make some modifications. I've had to go down this route as I can't afford the high end equipment.
As for Moka Pot on induction, I don't know. Can you get little plates that sit over an induction hob and transfer the heat somehow? EDIT - I see others have already confirmed this.
Edited by RobbieTheTruth on Tuesday 3rd November 11:06
I've had one of these for years and not had any problems with it. The one star review is a bit random.
This and a decent milk frotther makes 2 nice cups of coffee.
https://www.johnlewis.com/bialetti-venus-induction...
This and a decent milk frotther makes 2 nice cups of coffee.
https://www.johnlewis.com/bialetti-venus-induction...
My previous machine was a Rancillio Sylvia which is a solid machine built to last but out of the box the temperature stability is lacking. I'm an electrical engineer so I added a PID loop controller to address the temperature stability issue and it gave me 10 years of great coffee before I replaced it with a lever spring machine.
When I searched for a link to share I see Rancillio now do a Sylvia Pro that includes PID temperature control. I can recommend Sylvia's for anyone wanting to get into the craft of making cafe quality coffee at home. There is a huge online community full of helpful information around Sylvia's. It won't break the bank or take up half your kitchen worktop. I couldn't bring myself to part with mine when it's replacement arrived, it's in storage up in the loft.
https://www.ranciliogroup.com/rancilio/silvia-pro/
When I searched for a link to share I see Rancillio now do a Sylvia Pro that includes PID temperature control. I can recommend Sylvia's for anyone wanting to get into the craft of making cafe quality coffee at home. There is a huge online community full of helpful information around Sylvia's. It won't break the bank or take up half your kitchen worktop. I couldn't bring myself to part with mine when it's replacement arrived, it's in storage up in the loft.
https://www.ranciliogroup.com/rancilio/silvia-pro/
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