The employee mentality
Discussion
I thought of posting this in the Jobs section but decided not to for fear of giving offence.
I read the jobs section from time to time and I sympathise with the people who are struggling to get jobs. But I'm bound to say that I never notice the same people in the Business section talking or asking about how they can start their own business. It would seem that the employee mentality is a real thing and those people who have it are for the most part stuck with it. Which is fine if they have jobs, of course.
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
I read the jobs section from time to time and I sympathise with the people who are struggling to get jobs. But I'm bound to say that I never notice the same people in the Business section talking or asking about how they can start their own business. It would seem that the employee mentality is a real thing and those people who have it are for the most part stuck with it. Which is fine if they have jobs, of course.
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
For a lot of people, they just don't think about it or if they do then it is too hard and they aren't 'cut out' for running their own business. Where as a lot of people who run their own businesses, the thought of working for someone else for x amount of hours a day x amount of days a week fills them with dread!
I have got quite frustrated with friends and family in the past, especially ones who have trades like being a sparky or mechanic that they moan when they have been out of work but don't use their skills to make money, even if it just enough to keep going between jobs.
I have got quite frustrated with friends and family in the past, especially ones who have trades like being a sparky or mechanic that they moan when they have been out of work but don't use their skills to make money, even if it just enough to keep going between jobs.
singlecoil said:
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
Lots of people dont want to work for themselves, nothing wrong with that.DoubleD said:
singlecoil said:
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
Lots of people dont want to work for themselves, nothing wrong with that.singlecoil said:
DoubleD said:
singlecoil said:
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
Lots of people dont want to work for themselves, nothing wrong with that.There are different personality types with this. As distinct as introvert vs extrovert. It's not a trait that can be easily changed.
Some people have very little risk tolerance for business and would go to great lengths to avoid and kind of entrepreneurial element in their day to day lives, regardless of the reward.
And there are the opposite types.
In my experience, it's largely fixed by adulthood and rarely shifts.
Some people have very little risk tolerance for business and would go to great lengths to avoid and kind of entrepreneurial element in their day to day lives, regardless of the reward.
And there are the opposite types.
In my experience, it's largely fixed by adulthood and rarely shifts.
I don't think it's as clear as leaders and followers.
I'd struggle with a suggestion that the CEO of a global business is a "follower" whilst some poor sod working all hours to run a small business all by themselves because there isn't the money or trust in it to pay someone else is a "leader".
I suspect it's as simple as circumstances vary, skills vary, and different skills and circumstances lend themselves to different approaches.
I'd struggle with a suggestion that the CEO of a global business is a "follower" whilst some poor sod working all hours to run a small business all by themselves because there isn't the money or trust in it to pay someone else is a "leader".
I suspect it's as simple as circumstances vary, skills vary, and different skills and circumstances lend themselves to different approaches.
Many people cannot afford to take a risk, or have enough credit rating to raise the money to start with.
A lot of people harbour dreams of being self employed but accept the constraints, and regular income, of working for somebody else, especially while keeping a roof overhead and the kids fed.
More people now who go self employed later in life for those type reasons.
Nothing wrong with working for somebody else if you accept the risk/reward choices.
As for the unemployed, generally not in a position to raise the money/support needed.
A lot of people harbour dreams of being self employed but accept the constraints, and regular income, of working for somebody else, especially while keeping a roof overhead and the kids fed.
More people now who go self employed later in life for those type reasons.
Nothing wrong with working for somebody else if you accept the risk/reward choices.
As for the unemployed, generally not in a position to raise the money/support needed.
singlecoil said:
I I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
As an employee it crosses my mind occasionally, and is always followed by “but I can’t be arsed”. Everyone I see running a business seems to have a far more stressful life than I. I’m quite content earning a decent wage and letting someone else worry about the business stuff.
A lot of people are happy to turn up at work, do a job, get a regular wage, and pay tax via PAYE.
They don't have to sell their skills/business, keep books, run payroll, do VAT returns, pay all the variety of business taxes as well as personal taxes.
I've owned businesses, worked as a contractor, and been an employee at different stages of my life. Being an employee is certainly the easiest option.
They don't have to sell their skills/business, keep books, run payroll, do VAT returns, pay all the variety of business taxes as well as personal taxes.
I've owned businesses, worked as a contractor, and been an employee at different stages of my life. Being an employee is certainly the easiest option.
I think about it a lot,my problem is that a start up in the field where I have most knowledge is very expensive and would be a massive risk.
I have considered things with smaller start up costs like window cleaning as the thought of working for myself appeals,but I would struggle to make what I make now.
My weekends are completely free, so finding something sat/sun that I could try while still performing my normal role will probably be the way forward,it is 3 years till i am 50 and hope that by then I will have started something.
I have considered things with smaller start up costs like window cleaning as the thought of working for myself appeals,but I would struggle to make what I make now.
My weekends are completely free, so finding something sat/sun that I could try while still performing my normal role will probably be the way forward,it is 3 years till i am 50 and hope that by then I will have started something.
Problem for some, like me, is that the 'entry fee' to get into what I know and I know I'm good at is now too high as a few large groups have driven the price beyond most individuals.
I could probably still raise the finance - but I'd have to put 2 houses on the line as security. That risk is too big for me.
I know a couple of people who have expanded in the business very quickly - but they're borrowing millions at interest rates in excess of 10%. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night.
I could probably still raise the finance - but I'd have to put 2 houses on the line as security. That risk is too big for me.
I know a couple of people who have expanded in the business very quickly - but they're borrowing millions at interest rates in excess of 10%. I wouldn't be able to sleep at night.
I never get the people that suddently become a director overnight and they have suddenly made it at life. Going on your own doesnt guarantee success, only 44% of new buinesses survive 10 years.
People can earn good money and security working for the man, some people can't cope with it and work for themselves. I don't think either route is a negative it just suits the individuals values and goals. They can be used interchangable at different points in their lives as well. At the end of the day you do what suits you best.
People can earn good money and security working for the man, some people can't cope with it and work for themselves. I don't think either route is a negative it just suits the individuals values and goals. They can be used interchangable at different points in their lives as well. At the end of the day you do what suits you best.
DoubleD said:
singlecoil said:
DoubleD said:
singlecoil said:
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
Lots of people dont want to work for themselves, nothing wrong with that.Thesprucegoose said:
I never get the people that suddently become a director overnight and they have suddenly made it at life. Going on your own doesnt guarantee success, only 44% of new buinesses survive 10 years.
People can earn good money and security working for the man, some people can't cope with it and work for themselves. I don't think either route is a negative it just suits the individuals values and goals. They can be used interchangable at different points in their lives as well. At the end of the day you do what suits you best.
Yup. A high percentage of businesses fail within 2 years. Quite a few struggle to break even.People can earn good money and security working for the man, some people can't cope with it and work for themselves. I don't think either route is a negative it just suits the individuals values and goals. They can be used interchangable at different points in their lives as well. At the end of the day you do what suits you best.
Going self employed is by no means a guarantee of success. And for a lot of people it would mean giving up benefits etc, that would keep them ticking over in the meantime.
I've run my own business for 15 years. I wouldn't be able to work for anyone now.
Yes there's stress, yes the work/life balance sometimes doesn't work, but mostly it does.
I get to go on holiday when I want, buy nice things, have nobody to answer to, can make business decisions by myself. I don't have endless pointless meetings, don't have targets, and decide which direction the business is going in.
Yes there's stress, yes the work/life balance sometimes doesn't work, but mostly it does.
I get to go on holiday when I want, buy nice things, have nobody to answer to, can make business decisions by myself. I don't have endless pointless meetings, don't have targets, and decide which direction the business is going in.
Tyre Smoke said:
I've run my own business for 15 years. I wouldn't be able to work for anyone now.
Yes there's stress, yes the work/life balance sometimes doesn't work, but mostly it does.
I get to go on holiday when I want, buy nice things, have nobody to answer to, can make business decisions by myself. I don't have endless pointless meetings, don't have targets, and decide which direction the business is going in.
You're a long way down the road compared to someone whos maybe no particular skills, cant get a job for one or more of a variety of reasons, and then them starting their own business, hitting the ground running (as most in that position wont have savings to fall back on) and making it work from the get go. Not undoable, not significant risk and daunting for many.Yes there's stress, yes the work/life balance sometimes doesn't work, but mostly it does.
I get to go on holiday when I want, buy nice things, have nobody to answer to, can make business decisions by myself. I don't have endless pointless meetings, don't have targets, and decide which direction the business is going in.
If I was a consultant or something similar with actual sellable skills, then I might well take the plunge, but I'm in sales. That's fine when I'm working for a company that already has software developers, consultants, support engineers, etc, etc, etc, but for me to start a business of my own, I'd actually have to get all of that in place before I could actually start making any money!
In theory, I could of course end up earning a lot more money, but trading a six figure salary for the complete unknown is a huge risk, especially when I'm planning to retire within the next decade or so.
It also doesn't help that I've always had the mentality of work to live rather than live to work! I do envy the people out there who actually manage to make a living out of something they're really passionate about, but for me, it is and always will be just a way to pay the bills and fund my retirement.
In one of my first jobs after I graduated, we got an email from the MD one day - OK, not self-employed, but still running the company and taking all the day to day decisions - to say that he was leaving. The reason he was leaving was that his doctors had told him if he didn't stop within 3 months, he was very unlikely to make it to his 50th, which was about 6 years away, such was the stress it was putting on him. Despite having enough money not to ever have to work again, a wife and a couple of young-ish kids, it took him every single day of that 3 months to reach his decision, because he just couldn't imagine what he'd do with his life without work! That's not a challenge I'll ever face!
In theory, I could of course end up earning a lot more money, but trading a six figure salary for the complete unknown is a huge risk, especially when I'm planning to retire within the next decade or so.
It also doesn't help that I've always had the mentality of work to live rather than live to work! I do envy the people out there who actually manage to make a living out of something they're really passionate about, but for me, it is and always will be just a way to pay the bills and fund my retirement.
In one of my first jobs after I graduated, we got an email from the MD one day - OK, not self-employed, but still running the company and taking all the day to day decisions - to say that he was leaving. The reason he was leaving was that his doctors had told him if he didn't stop within 3 months, he was very unlikely to make it to his 50th, which was about 6 years away, such was the stress it was putting on him. Despite having enough money not to ever have to work again, a wife and a couple of young-ish kids, it took him every single day of that 3 months to reach his decision, because he just couldn't imagine what he'd do with his life without work! That's not a challenge I'll ever face!
singlecoil said:
I thought of posting this in the Jobs section but decided not to for fear of giving offence.
I read the jobs section from time to time and I sympathise with the people who are struggling to get jobs. But I'm bound to say that I never notice the same people in the Business section talking or asking about how they can start their own business. It would seem that the employee mentality is a real thing and those people who have it are for the most part stuck with it. Which is fine if they have jobs, of course.
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
For me, as an employee there’s 3 fundamental things; more money, less stress, more office to try.I read the jobs section from time to time and I sympathise with the people who are struggling to get jobs. But I'm bound to say that I never notice the same people in the Business section talking or asking about how they can start their own business. It would seem that the employee mentality is a real thing and those people who have it are for the most part stuck with it. Which is fine if they have jobs, of course.
I guess the reasons for it vary from one individual to another. Fear of the unknown, maybe, fear of not being able to cope with the admin side of things, fear of not being able to find customers. Or could it be that they've just never thought about it? That it never even crosses their minds that there could be another way of making a living than finding a job?
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