Spire GT3 RGB Racer
Discussion
Little video one of the guys has done of various drivers footage from Brands Race 1
https://youtu.be/nVTdCB7iFHo
I believe that round will also be televised at some point on motorsport.tv (I think that's what it's called now, used to be motors tv)
https://youtu.be/nVTdCB7iFHo
I believe that round will also be televised at some point on motorsport.tv (I think that's what it's called now, used to be motors tv)
SoftwareSorcerer said:
Yazza54 said:
Update - so as can be seen in the pics I'm not really sat low enough in the car
I've pulled the GRP seat out and am going to have a go at making an expanding foam seat to allow me to effectively sit on the floor of the car. I checked yesterday and this has gained me about 40mm which means my helmet is now comfortably below the roll bar for scruitineering.
I'm taking the car to procomp Motorsport for setup/geometry in a couple of weeks so need my new seat in position by then so the car can be cornerweighted.
Other jobs include a new chain as I'm not sure how old it is, and get the car all stickered up... Then generally have a good check through everything. Probably change the oil and filter again too.
Have now entered the round at Croft on 26th & 27th May as well as the test day on the 25th ... So it's all go!
Brilliant mate. If you need a hand with the seat, give me a shout. Do you need the supplier for the foam chemical?I've pulled the GRP seat out and am going to have a go at making an expanding foam seat to allow me to effectively sit on the floor of the car. I checked yesterday and this has gained me about 40mm which means my helmet is now comfortably below the roll bar for scruitineering.
I'm taking the car to procomp Motorsport for setup/geometry in a couple of weeks so need my new seat in position by then so the car can be cornerweighted.
Other jobs include a new chain as I'm not sure how old it is, and get the car all stickered up... Then generally have a good check through everything. Probably change the oil and filter again too.
Have now entered the round at Croft on 26th & 27th May as well as the test day on the 25th ... So it's all go!
SoftwareSorcerer said:
Yazza54 said:
Little video one of the guys has done of various drivers footage from Brands Race 1
https://youtu.be/nVTdCB7iFHo
I believe that round will also be televised at some point on motorsport.tv (I think that's what it's called now, used to be motors tv)
Correct. I stalled on the grid, so missed the fun just after Druids. Arrived to discover cars all over the place!https://youtu.be/nVTdCB7iFHo
I believe that round will also be televised at some point on motorsport.tv (I think that's what it's called now, used to be motors tv)
I was quite jealous of you all racing and you got some cracking weather too. Did you get any good pics of the car on track?Hi all, another little update. Have recently moved the dash to the centre of the car, moved the gear indicator where the dash used to be (and calibrated it), moved my steering column up a touch, re positioned the paddleshift assembly and made a foam seat to ditch the GRP one. All of these mods have made the car much more ergonomically suited to me plus I'm sat quite comfortably under the roll bar now which is nice.
Car has also had a new chain and will get a oil / filter change before Croft at the end of the month.
Took the car to Procomp Motorsport in Birmingham on Saturday and got the car to a nice base setup.
This involved balancing the front and rear dampers in pairs which were found to be out of calibration with each other, particularly the rears which were 30lb out on comp and 60lb on rebound.
Tracking & camber which again were both out, not massively but still.. an improvement was certainly made.
Finally it was corner weighted which I'm hoping will improve the general balance and feel of the car, as the change on the scales was quite significant before and after. Doing this also gave me the vital information I needed on the overall weight. - turns out I'm pretty much bang on the money in terms of the minimum weight. Could never say that when I was karting!!!
Looking forward to getting out in it now
Car has also had a new chain and will get a oil / filter change before Croft at the end of the month.
Took the car to Procomp Motorsport in Birmingham on Saturday and got the car to a nice base setup.
This involved balancing the front and rear dampers in pairs which were found to be out of calibration with each other, particularly the rears which were 30lb out on comp and 60lb on rebound.
Tracking & camber which again were both out, not massively but still.. an improvement was certainly made.
Finally it was corner weighted which I'm hoping will improve the general balance and feel of the car, as the change on the scales was quite significant before and after. Doing this also gave me the vital information I needed on the overall weight. - turns out I'm pretty much bang on the money in terms of the minimum weight. Could never say that when I was karting!!!
Looking forward to getting out in it now
Edited by Yazza54 on Tuesday 8th May 12:52
Suppose it's time to update this...!
I entered the Croft race on the 26th/27th May, and the test day on the 25th.
Having spent countless hours prepping the car as well as a full days shakedown at Oulton I was quite confident that the car would be fine - how wrong was I.
Only a handful of laps into the Friday test day I was just trying to get some heat into the tyres and learn the track when a fellow competitor (Olly Hewitt) came last me waving his arms like a madman. It later transpired that he'd been doing that behind me too but I couldn't see.
The car to me felt fine but what I didn't know was that an oil hose had perished and caught fire. It must have been a light mist at the most at this point as all engine readings looked fine. What olly could see from behind was a fire around my oil cooler.
Pulled over and set the onboard extinguisher off, then waited for the Marshalls to finish the job.
All in all a totally s
t experience for a first time out but as we all know st can and will happen in Motorsport and you can't plan for every eventuality.
On the plus side the guys were all spot on, really decent helpful bunch and I'm looking forward to getting back out. Also very grateful to Olly for making me aware as I had no idea what was happening.
Onto the car - some bodywork damage, oil lines and fairly minor wiring damage. We have moved the oil cooler further away from the exhaust and are making a heat shield around the exhaust and fire sleeves on the new oil cooler hoses. Got another GSXR K8 loom on the way so I can chop the bad bits off and graft the new bits on.
Other bits include new lights, under tray, throttle and clutch cables, rear tyre etc. The suspension all seems fine, luckily it was a fairly localised fire but it was certainly going to spread.
Vince whom I bought the car from has been a great help and located some bodywork for me that he's had stored away so I've got a replacement side pod and rear clam. Might not have time to paint these before the next race but at this point I'm not so bothered about what the car looks like..!
Realistically it could've been a lot worse, and I thought I would share here rather than just posting up tales of highs and none of the lows! It should be back up and running again soon.
I entered the Croft race on the 26th/27th May, and the test day on the 25th.
Having spent countless hours prepping the car as well as a full days shakedown at Oulton I was quite confident that the car would be fine - how wrong was I.
Only a handful of laps into the Friday test day I was just trying to get some heat into the tyres and learn the track when a fellow competitor (Olly Hewitt) came last me waving his arms like a madman. It later transpired that he'd been doing that behind me too but I couldn't see.
The car to me felt fine but what I didn't know was that an oil hose had perished and caught fire. It must have been a light mist at the most at this point as all engine readings looked fine. What olly could see from behind was a fire around my oil cooler.
Pulled over and set the onboard extinguisher off, then waited for the Marshalls to finish the job.
All in all a totally s
t experience for a first time out but as we all know st can and will happen in Motorsport and you can't plan for every eventuality. On the plus side the guys were all spot on, really decent helpful bunch and I'm looking forward to getting back out. Also very grateful to Olly for making me aware as I had no idea what was happening.
Onto the car - some bodywork damage, oil lines and fairly minor wiring damage. We have moved the oil cooler further away from the exhaust and are making a heat shield around the exhaust and fire sleeves on the new oil cooler hoses. Got another GSXR K8 loom on the way so I can chop the bad bits off and graft the new bits on.
Other bits include new lights, under tray, throttle and clutch cables, rear tyre etc. The suspension all seems fine, luckily it was a fairly localised fire but it was certainly going to spread.
Vince whom I bought the car from has been a great help and located some bodywork for me that he's had stored away so I've got a replacement side pod and rear clam. Might not have time to paint these before the next race but at this point I'm not so bothered about what the car looks like..!
Realistically it could've been a lot worse, and I thought I would share here rather than just posting up tales of highs and none of the lows! It should be back up and running again soon.
Edited by Yazza54 on Friday 7th December 12:53
Mark Benson said:
Yazza54 said:
I entered the Croft race on the 26th/27th May, and the test day on the 25th.
I was the guy Drew introduced in the paddock when you were looking over the car and trying to work out the cause - I was going to ask if you were the 'PH guy' as I thought I recognised the car but it didn't seem the right time - you don't want to be making smalltalk with strangers as your blackened car sits there reminding you what just happened.Glad you're taking it 'on the chin' and I hope you get sorted and back out soon.
Still aiming for pembrey at the end of the month, wiring is about 50% done that needs another half a day spending on it, and the oil cooler plumbing to finish and it should be running again.
Hi everyone, car is now running... Had a few teething problems as it was running dog rough on 3 cylinders which ended up being a duff injector from the replacement set of throttle bodies I fitted. Luckily I manage to save a few from the other set, now running sweet as a nut.
My old man has moved the oil cooler away from the exhaust and re plumbed it, as well as put heat sheilding around the hoses and exhaust.
I did all the wiring, just need to do some final taping up and tidying but it's an hour's work at the most. Also made new clutch and throttle cables and new brake lines, rear lights etc.
Still plenty to do but mostly just superficial stuff.
My old man has moved the oil cooler away from the exhaust and re plumbed it, as well as put heat sheilding around the hoses and exhaust.
I did all the wiring, just need to do some final taping up and tidying but it's an hour's work at the most. Also made new clutch and throttle cables and new brake lines, rear lights etc.
Still plenty to do but mostly just superficial stuff.
Another update, final jobs are to refit the airbox, new pushrods and reset ride heights, & some minor mods to the fitment of the rear bodywork to make it quick release. Rest is cosmetic.
Side pods are repainted in the new colour which is more of a sky blue & much brighter, looking forward to getting the whole car done. Collected another rear clam on Sat which my dad is busy prepping. Then that and the front will be painted.
Fitted the new diffuser at the weekend and some other bits but was quite ill on Sunday so that was a write off. New extinguisher now all plumbed in as well as a hand held on a fancy quick release mount. Not an awful lot left to do and the car should look smart when done. Can confidently say I'll be out at Cadwell at the end of July with the aim to do a trackday beforehand.
Side pods are repainted in the new colour which is more of a sky blue & much brighter, looking forward to getting the whole car done. Collected another rear clam on Sat which my dad is busy prepping. Then that and the front will be painted.
Fitted the new diffuser at the weekend and some other bits but was quite ill on Sunday so that was a write off. New extinguisher now all plumbed in as well as a hand held on a fancy quick release mount. Not an awful lot left to do and the car should look smart when done. Can confidently say I'll be out at Cadwell at the end of July with the aim to do a trackday beforehand.
Edited by Yazza54 on Monday 2nd July 11:00
Car all back together, replacement rear clip in paint and front painted. Still some bits of bodywork to do on the front to repair old battlescars but was running out of time so had to just get it in the right colour for now. Rear is all quick release now which is much better.
Finished all the final fitting etc yesterday and cornerweighted the car.
I'm out Thursday at Cadwell and all being well should be racing next weekend at Cadwell again.
Finished all the final fitting etc yesterday and cornerweighted the car.
I'm out Thursday at Cadwell and all being well should be racing next weekend at Cadwell again.
First race weekend done!
Arrived at Cadwell Park early Friday morning for the test day, on my own. Got some help getting the car off the trailer and got set up... I.e. got a deck chair out of the car
Fuelled up, gear on and took the car down to assembly area for the first outing. Upon sitting in the assembly area for a few mins waiting to get noise testing I could smell something funky coming from the car. The guy did the noise test and passed me and from the corner of my eye I could see a bit of smoke. Shut the car off and jumped out immediately.
I'd done a trackday with no issues the week previously so was surprised to find a problem so early on. It transpired that the water pump live feed was corroded/brittle and getting warm due to high resistance. Snipped it back and put a new ring terminal on. Job done I thought.
I decided to run the car and hold the wire to verify that it was no longer getting warm, sure enough it was fine... But what I did notice as I was doing this was that the breather for the fuel tank was pissing fuel out!!!
Here we go again I thought.
Took it off and went to see the spire lads who said they had never seen a tank breather like it. Paul managed to knock something up with a little one way valve he had in his tool box to replace it and I got out for session 2.
Car ran faultlessly in sessions 2 and 3 and I felt I was running reasonably well although I couldn't seem to get my GPS working to check lap times. I was chasing a bit of an understeering condition around and quickly figured out that whilst it's great having adjustable everything on the car you really need the knowledge!! I didn't go out in session 4 as I found the front wheel bearings needed adjusting up and by the time I'd done that I'd missed the opportunity to go out.
After that i tried something to get rid of the understeer for Saturday qualifying on the basis that if it worked, great, if not, not much lost.
That night I slept in the car and it was awful but the weather was so bad I didn't think my tent would last. From a mixture of poor conditions and excitement, I didn't get an awful lot of sleep.
Dad turned up before qualifying in his Ultima, which as usual, I heard before I saw
Saturday qualifying came round and I went out to find that the car had more rear end induced oversteer from the change but the front was still pushing. I struggled to get a good lap in. Made a schoolboy error of leaving my front clam light loom loose and it made it's way under my left foot, came in to sort that. Lost precious minutes and went back out to qualify 12th of 17 with a car that felt worse than the day before. I was frustrated with myself but to be fair that was not a bad positioning for a first race. Putting me right on the end of the mid pack with everything to fight for.
So into race 1
Before race 1 we decided to try something different, again on the basis of suck it and see, undid the change we made before qualifying and made a different change to reduce understeer (less bump more rebound on the front)
Olly Hewitt came to help out which was most useful and calmed me a little, it was drummed into me repeatedly to make sure I'm in first gear etc and not to stall as there's little room at Cadwell for people to get around you if you do stall on the grid.
There was no warm up lap so in the back of my mind I was thinking I need to be careful for a lap.
With not wanting to stall in mind I made sure I gave it the beans, start was st as I got a lot of wheelspin and a couple of cars came past, but at least I didn't stall.
First few laps I was over tentative, could have pushed harder but didn't want to come a cropper. Was running comfortably with a group in the mid pack and my car felt good, a little controllable oversteer so it was more positive turning in but not snappy. Great I thought, can push on now. Not long after this the car started to get a bit squirrelly, I was unsure whether this was the tyres going off but it seemed far too soon for that.
I lost a bit of time to the group due to this and tried to regain the time when the car snapped on me going through Chris curve, which can be seen in the clip below
https://youtu.be/nddS6QpZI-8
It was quite sudden and I couldn't really understand why, after this 360 spin all I could really do was just bring it back in one piece in 12th.
When I came in and took the rear clam off I found that the header tank cap had popped off slightly, it was still on but loosely. There were signs of water all over the rear diffuser and panels so this explained the violent snap causing the spin - coolant on tyres. I bent the ears down on the cap so it was more secure for the remainder of the weekend and topped the tank back up (now got a new stant cap to fit) and chalked it down to experience.
Saturday night the RGB gang held the annual Marshalls BBQ which was a great effort, burgers crisps all sorts. With proceeds going to the Marshalls fund. Was good to speak to people in a more relaxed environment and I can genuinely say it's a paddock full of decent people.
After the BBQ they did the trophies for race one, to my surprise I got driver of the day! I think this was more to do with the fact that we got the car turned round so soon and not let the Croft disasters put me off, although some people were also fairly complementary about my driving/pace considering I'm still lacking experience in the car and track.
Sundays race was a funny one. I was convinced it was going to be wet and for some strange reason I love the wet, what I really didn't want was it to be somewhere in between, and guess what? It was exactly that. Colin Chapman gave me a hand doing tyre pressures etc which checking his longacre gauge against mine showed that my crappy draper one is 2psi out. That's going in the bin!!
Weather was awful all morning but it did dry up, there were minor showers but with fairly high winds the track was remaining dry. A very tentative start again to the race as there were numerous damp patches especially around the hall bends section, my second lap was quicker than a few in front and I started to gain confidence in the conditions, from there it started to rain and the A048s are horrible in the wet. It was not what you would class as a full wet race but too wet to go quickly on those tyres.
Looking back now, maybe I should've stayed out, but on lap 6 after seeing numerous cars smashed to bits over the course of the weekend in RGB and other classes I'd had enough. The primary goal for the weekend was to get the first race out of the way and for my mental well being it was imperative to do so and come home with the car and myself in one piece and I was happy that I'd achieved that after the disasters of Croft. It turned out that the race was red flagged not long after I came in anyway.
Next up is Silverstone on the 11th/12th August. I'm really looking forward to it - a fast track with plenty of width and run off, quite the opposite to the unforgiving Cadwell Park. I will go there with a different mentality to push harder and from the off, armed with what I've learned from Cadwell.
Some pics
Arrived at Cadwell Park early Friday morning for the test day, on my own. Got some help getting the car off the trailer and got set up... I.e. got a deck chair out of the car
Fuelled up, gear on and took the car down to assembly area for the first outing. Upon sitting in the assembly area for a few mins waiting to get noise testing I could smell something funky coming from the car. The guy did the noise test and passed me and from the corner of my eye I could see a bit of smoke. Shut the car off and jumped out immediately.
I'd done a trackday with no issues the week previously so was surprised to find a problem so early on. It transpired that the water pump live feed was corroded/brittle and getting warm due to high resistance. Snipped it back and put a new ring terminal on. Job done I thought.
I decided to run the car and hold the wire to verify that it was no longer getting warm, sure enough it was fine... But what I did notice as I was doing this was that the breather for the fuel tank was pissing fuel out!!!
Here we go again I thought.
Took it off and went to see the spire lads who said they had never seen a tank breather like it. Paul managed to knock something up with a little one way valve he had in his tool box to replace it and I got out for session 2.
Car ran faultlessly in sessions 2 and 3 and I felt I was running reasonably well although I couldn't seem to get my GPS working to check lap times. I was chasing a bit of an understeering condition around and quickly figured out that whilst it's great having adjustable everything on the car you really need the knowledge!! I didn't go out in session 4 as I found the front wheel bearings needed adjusting up and by the time I'd done that I'd missed the opportunity to go out.
After that i tried something to get rid of the understeer for Saturday qualifying on the basis that if it worked, great, if not, not much lost.
That night I slept in the car and it was awful but the weather was so bad I didn't think my tent would last. From a mixture of poor conditions and excitement, I didn't get an awful lot of sleep.
Dad turned up before qualifying in his Ultima, which as usual, I heard before I saw
Saturday qualifying came round and I went out to find that the car had more rear end induced oversteer from the change but the front was still pushing. I struggled to get a good lap in. Made a schoolboy error of leaving my front clam light loom loose and it made it's way under my left foot, came in to sort that. Lost precious minutes and went back out to qualify 12th of 17 with a car that felt worse than the day before. I was frustrated with myself but to be fair that was not a bad positioning for a first race. Putting me right on the end of the mid pack with everything to fight for.
So into race 1
Before race 1 we decided to try something different, again on the basis of suck it and see, undid the change we made before qualifying and made a different change to reduce understeer (less bump more rebound on the front)
Olly Hewitt came to help out which was most useful and calmed me a little, it was drummed into me repeatedly to make sure I'm in first gear etc and not to stall as there's little room at Cadwell for people to get around you if you do stall on the grid.
There was no warm up lap so in the back of my mind I was thinking I need to be careful for a lap.
With not wanting to stall in mind I made sure I gave it the beans, start was s
t as I got a lot of wheelspin and a couple of cars came past, but at least I didn't stall. First few laps I was over tentative, could have pushed harder but didn't want to come a cropper. Was running comfortably with a group in the mid pack and my car felt good, a little controllable oversteer so it was more positive turning in but not snappy. Great I thought, can push on now. Not long after this the car started to get a bit squirrelly, I was unsure whether this was the tyres going off but it seemed far too soon for that.
I lost a bit of time to the group due to this and tried to regain the time when the car snapped on me going through Chris curve, which can be seen in the clip below
https://youtu.be/nddS6QpZI-8
It was quite sudden and I couldn't really understand why, after this 360 spin all I could really do was just bring it back in one piece in 12th.
When I came in and took the rear clam off I found that the header tank cap had popped off slightly, it was still on but loosely. There were signs of water all over the rear diffuser and panels so this explained the violent snap causing the spin - coolant on tyres. I bent the ears down on the cap so it was more secure for the remainder of the weekend and topped the tank back up (now got a new stant cap to fit) and chalked it down to experience.
Saturday night the RGB gang held the annual Marshalls BBQ which was a great effort, burgers crisps all sorts. With proceeds going to the Marshalls fund. Was good to speak to people in a more relaxed environment and I can genuinely say it's a paddock full of decent people.
After the BBQ they did the trophies for race one, to my surprise I got driver of the day! I think this was more to do with the fact that we got the car turned round so soon and not let the Croft disasters put me off, although some people were also fairly complementary about my driving/pace considering I'm still lacking experience in the car and track.
Sundays race was a funny one. I was convinced it was going to be wet and for some strange reason I love the wet, what I really didn't want was it to be somewhere in between, and guess what? It was exactly that. Colin Chapman gave me a hand doing tyre pressures etc which checking his longacre gauge against mine showed that my crappy draper one is 2psi out. That's going in the bin!!
Weather was awful all morning but it did dry up, there were minor showers but with fairly high winds the track was remaining dry. A very tentative start again to the race as there were numerous damp patches especially around the hall bends section, my second lap was quicker than a few in front and I started to gain confidence in the conditions, from there it started to rain and the A048s are horrible in the wet. It was not what you would class as a full wet race but too wet to go quickly on those tyres.
Looking back now, maybe I should've stayed out, but on lap 6 after seeing numerous cars smashed to bits over the course of the weekend in RGB and other classes I'd had enough. The primary goal for the weekend was to get the first race out of the way and for my mental well being it was imperative to do so and come home with the car and myself in one piece and I was happy that I'd achieved that after the disasters of Croft. It turned out that the race was red flagged not long after I came in anyway.
Next up is Silverstone on the 11th/12th August. I'm really looking forward to it - a fast track with plenty of width and run off, quite the opposite to the unforgiving Cadwell Park. I will go there with a different mentality to push harder and from the off, armed with what I've learned from Cadwell.
Some pics
Edited by Yazza54 on Friday 3rd August 06:06
I have ordered a new one though..... As I launched old faithful in the bin on sundayHi guys
Second race weekend now under my belt this time at Silverstone on the international circuit.
Completed the Friday test day which saw me get less than half the track time I'd paid for for a couple of reasons, arrived late due to being sat on the M60 for 30 odd mins at 5.30am!! So a short first session. Then it rained heavily and red flags etc made it difficult to get any decent time in, lots of standing water etc so didn't see the point risking ending my weekend before it'd begun.
In the last session the first 15 mins or so were dry and I managed to knock a good half a second off my time in the morning registering a 1.12.6. I'd estimate I'd had about 20 laps of the track at the very most.
Qualifying came around on sat and I did the same trick from Croft... fked about with the car on Friday night after still being disappointed about the setup and in quali went a second slower, putting me 12th.
For race 1 we put the car back to the previous setup which I knew wasn't great but better than the quali set up.
The issues I'd been having were that the car was very inconsistent, it would be loose on cold tyres as expected, then come reasonably good...But not for long..with the tyres going off a cliff edge quite rapidly. Pressures etc always seemed relatively ok but that's after a cool down lap at 70% pace.
So onto race 1, poor start but wanted to keep my nose clean.. dropped a place or two. Once I'd got some heat in the tyres I started working forward, barring a couple who either fell off or had mechanical issues I fought my way up to 7th with a best time of 1.12.18.
Whilst fighting through the car was getting worse lap by lap and it was getting harder and harder to hold a line at speed and the car was getting quite flighty trying to get out of the corners.
As you'll see in the YouTube link at the bottom of this post (cheers Olly) I spun the car on what I later realised was the second to last bloody corner of the race, which totally undid all my hard work. But, it was still a promising showing.
Saturday night was great, we were all in the garages for the presentations & Drew and his new wife Susie put on a spread which was brill. There is a fantastic comeraderie in RGB that isn't seen much elsewhere in the paddock...
Race 2 wasn't great, I got a better start having realised that whilst it's good to be tentative to a degree I was losing touch too much. Managed to make a few places up but then went backwards. I can only assume someone tagged my diffuser, I didn't really feel anything but the handling completely went to cock, then I heard it dragging along the floor. Came in and it was all bent and twisted.
My dad and mate managed to refix it to some degree and I went back out to use the time as testing. I'd spent a few hours on the front suspension on the Saturday night and found there was a load of stiction in the front ARB, plus my shocks we're sticking and not returning to full extension easily. The messing seemed to help as the car handled better but I didn't go any faster than in race 1, but the car felt more consistent, at least in terms of mechanical grip... Definitely didn't feel as stable at speed with the mangled diffuser.
Still waiting on the pics to be uploaded but if you get a minute be sure to watch the YouTube link below of race 1...
https://youtu.be/JU6chISQm48
Second race weekend now under my belt this time at Silverstone on the international circuit.
Completed the Friday test day which saw me get less than half the track time I'd paid for for a couple of reasons, arrived late due to being sat on the M60 for 30 odd mins at 5.30am!! So a short first session. Then it rained heavily and red flags etc made it difficult to get any decent time in, lots of standing water etc so didn't see the point risking ending my weekend before it'd begun.
In the last session the first 15 mins or so were dry and I managed to knock a good half a second off my time in the morning registering a 1.12.6. I'd estimate I'd had about 20 laps of the track at the very most.
Qualifying came around on sat and I did the same trick from Croft... f
ked about with the car on Friday night after still being disappointed about the setup and in quali went a second slower, putting me 12th. For race 1 we put the car back to the previous setup which I knew wasn't great but better than the quali set up.
The issues I'd been having were that the car was very inconsistent, it would be loose on cold tyres as expected, then come reasonably good...But not for long..with the tyres going off a cliff edge quite rapidly. Pressures etc always seemed relatively ok but that's after a cool down lap at 70% pace.
So onto race 1, poor start but wanted to keep my nose clean.. dropped a place or two. Once I'd got some heat in the tyres I started working forward, barring a couple who either fell off or had mechanical issues I fought my way up to 7th with a best time of 1.12.18.
Whilst fighting through the car was getting worse lap by lap and it was getting harder and harder to hold a line at speed and the car was getting quite flighty trying to get out of the corners.
As you'll see in the YouTube link at the bottom of this post (cheers Olly) I spun the car on what I later realised was the second to last bloody corner of the race, which totally undid all my hard work. But, it was still a promising showing.
Saturday night was great, we were all in the garages for the presentations & Drew and his new wife Susie put on a spread which was brill. There is a fantastic comeraderie in RGB that isn't seen much elsewhere in the paddock...
Race 2 wasn't great, I got a better start having realised that whilst it's good to be tentative to a degree I was losing touch too much. Managed to make a few places up but then went backwards. I can only assume someone tagged my diffuser, I didn't really feel anything but the handling completely went to cock, then I heard it dragging along the floor. Came in and it was all bent and twisted.
My dad and mate managed to refix it to some degree and I went back out to use the time as testing. I'd spent a few hours on the front suspension on the Saturday night and found there was a load of stiction in the front ARB, plus my shocks we're sticking and not returning to full extension easily. The messing seemed to help as the car handled better but I didn't go any faster than in race 1, but the car felt more consistent, at least in terms of mechanical grip... Definitely didn't feel as stable at speed with the mangled diffuser.
Still waiting on the pics to be uploaded but if you get a minute be sure to watch the YouTube link below of race 1...
https://youtu.be/JU6chISQm48
Edited by Yazza54 on Thursday 16th August 16:24
Hi mate, well the ARB mounts were over tight with bolts only just long enough so they had to be nipped for the nut to stay on. We fitted longer bolts with nyloc nuts and greased everything, nipped all 4 bolts them went round all 4 evenly backing them off a quarter of a turn until it would fall with ease under it's own weight.
The other issue is the shocks themselves which I've sent to protech this morning. I'd been running way more preload than I should've been to overcome these stiction issues which made the front way too stiff, basically compounding the problem. With the shocks off everything is moving lovely and freely so that's at least a positive.
Another issue with regard to the high speed stability is that my diffuser is not fixed securely enough, it's actually just hung on cables - everyone else's is fixed solidly. Plus my whole front splitter / mounting needs a good look at as it just flexes under the slightest bit of weight meaning I can't be getting much downforce out of it. The chaps from Mittell can stand on theirs no bother at all, mine would surely break. Lots to do and we're already on with it... Pop up sometime if you're in the area Rog.
The other issue is the shocks themselves which I've sent to protech this morning. I'd been running way more preload than I should've been to overcome these stiction issues which made the front way too stiff, basically compounding the problem. With the shocks off everything is moving lovely and freely so that's at least a positive.
Another issue with regard to the high speed stability is that my diffuser is not fixed securely enough, it's actually just hung on cables - everyone else's is fixed solidly. Plus my whole front splitter / mounting needs a good look at as it just flexes under the slightest bit of weight meaning I can't be getting much downforce out of it. The chaps from Mittell can stand on theirs no bother at all, mine would surely break. Lots to do and we're already on with it... Pop up sometime if you're in the area Rog.
The frame itself off the crash box is just too flimsy, we've got some new board to make a new splitter from but the main advantage will be from the supports/fixings. The brackets that come down are bolted through probably the weakest part of the crash box and the rest of the crash box is strong as anything and double skinned, so we'll probably rework what's already there and add to it somewhat. If I stood on it I reckon it'd just rip out of the crash box as it is at the moment.
I agree on the diffuser but it's a quick job and at least then it should withstand a knock better. The cables didn't take the bump well at all, granted they have give in them but they ended up dropping it to the floor. I will keep the cables for edge supports but use rods near the centre.
I agree on the diffuser but it's a quick job and at least then it should withstand a knock better. The cables didn't take the bump well at all, granted they have give in them but they ended up dropping it to the floor. I will keep the cables for edge supports but use rods near the centre.
Update from Anglesey
It was an odd weekend, there were barely any cars on the test day and not many more there for race day which left a bit of a hollow feel to it, there was only RGB and club Enduro in attendance. I called the track and they confirmed there would be lots of testing time available on the Friday so I decided to get there a little later and get a decent sleep for once.
We arrived around 11 still with plenty of testing time left in the day, got out for about 8 mins or so of the last session of the morning and got to see which way the track went. After lunch I got out again and managed maybe another 10 mins before my quaife diff st itself. At this point all I can say was that I knew the general layout of the track and felt fairly quick although I was struggling with understeer.
The diff has an in built reverse and it later transpired that it had some how managed to try and jump to reverse as I was driving forwards. Cue a big clatter and loss of drive.
We found on inspection that an inner CV joint had failed but when we fixed that there was still no drive... So the diff going caused the CV to fail... Causing us to inspect the diff...
We removed it and Tim Gray managed to fix it for us which was a massive help especially when he had enough going on with the guys he was running! Tim finished the diff probably around 9.30pm and I finished refitting it to the car around 11pm or so. I had a wander round and Tim was still under another competitors car which had an off previously, you can't fault the man's work ethic..!
So Saturday came around and I was still totally green to the track and to add to that it was absolutely soaking. Luckily with the meeting being quite scarce we benefitted from a practice session before quali.
I went out with pretty much a dry setup with the wet tyres on and registered the 4th quickest time in the practice.
Qualifying came around and I basically did the same time more or less, but a couple went quicker, putting me in 6th.
The first race was the same conditions wise, very wet. Had horrendous understeer in/oversteer out again which is typical of the wet anyway but not helped by my suspension not working properly - more on that later.
We softened the car up and it actually felt worse than before on what would be classed as a dry setup. There seem to be 2 schools of thought, soften the car off to make it more compliant, or leave it alone and just fit the wets on the basis that you want to work the tyres and softening the car too much won't do that and subsequently won't built heat into them..... Ended 7th, was a fairly uneventful race. I was a bit too tentative on the first lap, there wasn't even a warm up lap, straight out of assembly area onto a sodden track. The others we simply much more committed than me but it is my first wet race after all. A few people mentioned that vision would be somewhat impaired, but it was much worse than that... Going down the back straight on the first lap behind 6 other cars meant I was completely blinded.
Second race was completely dry after the 3 hour club Enduro race did a good job of clearing the damp. Back to the full dry setup, got a decent start but had to back out of it before the first corner as James walker in front of me had a pretty big tank slapper into another car in front which actually straightened him back out. I tried to push after that, got tagged on the rear on the first lap and lost touch with Mark betts in front and was pushing just enough to keep Jonathan McGill behind. Was a very lonely race.
I was finding that the more I pushed the front would just wash out, I had massive understeer in and oversteer out, trying to get on the power with far too much lock still on that needed getting rid of. The only way I managed to get it round in a respectable manner and time was to trail brake right to the Apex. Hard work, especially when so much of the track is slow and non flowing. Ended in 7th again with a best time well in the 1.11s, the race was sadly red flagged as Jonathan McGill who was running behind me had a fire.
Since leaving Anglesey I've been trying to figure out why the hell I had so much understeer and then it hit me - I've had my shocks modified. The only way I could tighten the car mid turn was to let off the throttle to throw weight forward/stop pushing the front. I had the shocks modified to reduce stiction and give a more usable window of adjustment as they are over damped as standard for this cars weight on the front .... but they went too far with the mod and I've effectively lost all my rebound damping, meaning as soon as I release the brakes the nose just jumps straight up, unloading the front tyres, even at full rebound.
Shocks are coming off tomorrow and going back for the issue to be rectified... Bit miffed as this was a major hindrance, but at least it can be sorted before snetterton on the 13th October.
It wasn't all doom and gloom, though - the modifications we've done to the splitter, diffuser and bodywork have certainly worked, the car was much more stable at speed... But there aren't many places to make the most of that at Anglesey.
Unfortunately no videos this time, my camera was playing up all weekend, I doubt there would be anything too interesting on there either!
It was an odd weekend, there were barely any cars on the test day and not many more there for race day which left a bit of a hollow feel to it, there was only RGB and club Enduro in attendance. I called the track and they confirmed there would be lots of testing time available on the Friday so I decided to get there a little later and get a decent sleep for once.
We arrived around 11 still with plenty of testing time left in the day, got out for about 8 mins or so of the last session of the morning and got to see which way the track went. After lunch I got out again and managed maybe another 10 mins before my quaife diff s
t itself. At this point all I can say was that I knew the general layout of the track and felt fairly quick although I was struggling with understeer.The diff has an in built reverse and it later transpired that it had some how managed to try and jump to reverse as I was driving forwards. Cue a big clatter and loss of drive.
We found on inspection that an inner CV joint had failed but when we fixed that there was still no drive... So the diff going caused the CV to fail... Causing us to inspect the diff...
We removed it and Tim Gray managed to fix it for us which was a massive help especially when he had enough going on with the guys he was running! Tim finished the diff probably around 9.30pm and I finished refitting it to the car around 11pm or so. I had a wander round and Tim was still under another competitors car which had an off previously, you can't fault the man's work ethic..!
So Saturday came around and I was still totally green to the track and to add to that it was absolutely soaking. Luckily with the meeting being quite scarce we benefitted from a practice session before quali.
I went out with pretty much a dry setup with the wet tyres on and registered the 4th quickest time in the practice.
Qualifying came around and I basically did the same time more or less, but a couple went quicker, putting me in 6th.
The first race was the same conditions wise, very wet. Had horrendous understeer in/oversteer out again which is typical of the wet anyway but not helped by my suspension not working properly - more on that later.
We softened the car up and it actually felt worse than before on what would be classed as a dry setup. There seem to be 2 schools of thought, soften the car off to make it more compliant, or leave it alone and just fit the wets on the basis that you want to work the tyres and softening the car too much won't do that and subsequently won't built heat into them..... Ended 7th, was a fairly uneventful race. I was a bit too tentative on the first lap, there wasn't even a warm up lap, straight out of assembly area onto a sodden track. The others we simply much more committed than me but it is my first wet race after all. A few people mentioned that vision would be somewhat impaired, but it was much worse than that... Going down the back straight on the first lap behind 6 other cars meant I was completely blinded.
Second race was completely dry after the 3 hour club Enduro race did a good job of clearing the damp. Back to the full dry setup, got a decent start but had to back out of it before the first corner as James walker in front of me had a pretty big tank slapper into another car in front which actually straightened him back out. I tried to push after that, got tagged on the rear on the first lap and lost touch with Mark betts in front and was pushing just enough to keep Jonathan McGill behind. Was a very lonely race.
I was finding that the more I pushed the front would just wash out, I had massive understeer in and oversteer out, trying to get on the power with far too much lock still on that needed getting rid of. The only way I managed to get it round in a respectable manner and time was to trail brake right to the Apex. Hard work, especially when so much of the track is slow and non flowing. Ended in 7th again with a best time well in the 1.11s, the race was sadly red flagged as Jonathan McGill who was running behind me had a fire.
Since leaving Anglesey I've been trying to figure out why the hell I had so much understeer and then it hit me - I've had my shocks modified. The only way I could tighten the car mid turn was to let off the throttle to throw weight forward/stop pushing the front. I had the shocks modified to reduce stiction and give a more usable window of adjustment as they are over damped as standard for this cars weight on the front .... but they went too far with the mod and I've effectively lost all my rebound damping, meaning as soon as I release the brakes the nose just jumps straight up, unloading the front tyres, even at full rebound.
Shocks are coming off tomorrow and going back for the issue to be rectified... Bit miffed as this was a major hindrance, but at least it can be sorted before snetterton on the 13th October.
It wasn't all doom and gloom, though - the modifications we've done to the splitter, diffuser and bodywork have certainly worked, the car was much more stable at speed... But there aren't many places to make the most of that at Anglesey.
Unfortunately no videos this time, my camera was playing up all weekend, I doubt there would be anything too interesting on there either!
Edited by Yazza54 on Thursday 13th September 06:31
Edited by Yazza54 on Thursday 13th September 08:57
This weekend closed out the racing season for us at Snetterton, on the 200 circuit.
We arrived Friday morning for testing and set up for the day. Straight away we had noise issues, turned out the exhaust had lost a lot of its wadding. It has always been a loud car so in all honesty it's hard to notice it getting incrementally louder..! There was also a degree of confusion between some of us drivers about what the noise limits should be.
As it's a proper MSA test day and our cars are sports racing cars we should've been tested under normal race limits and it was stated there was no particular drive by noise limit in the test day instructions... but it seems this went out of the window and they made up their own rules. Arguing gets you nowhere so we just got on with repacking it and stuck the baffle in for good measure to shut it up some more, at the expense of some performance, but it was only a test day after all.
So finally got all that out of the way and got out for some fun, never driven the track before apart from on the playstation and a handful of laps on a bike, so needed the track time. This is where the next annoyance of the day came abundantly clear, we had been grouped together with locosts, which are a X flow powered 7 type kit car... it's not their fault but they are a hell of a lot slower than us and it just completely ruined the test day, no doubt for us and them. It was impossible to get a clear lap in without traffic, I've had less traffic and more value for money out of a track day for non licence holders.
We made a few tweaks to the car and was generally quite happy with how it felt, especially now the dampers are working properly. It's still a bit understeery at low speed, albeit no where near as bad, but much better in the faster stuff. Had a play around with my new Aim Solo 2, cracking bit of kit. Dead easy to use and the information is invaluable knowing in real time what I was gaining or losing against my best lap was an instant edge especially for learning a new track as you see straight away what works and what doesn't.
So onto qualifying, left the car alone from testing for once and into quali.. managed to get 6th for race 1 and 5th for race 2, race 1 is off your best lap and race 2 is off your second best. Luckily I'd done a string of laps very close to each other whereas some of the guys only did one good one. The car felt good in the bends but I was struggling for top speed, the best I was seeing was generally 128-129mph which is rather poor for Snetterton and it hurts a fair bit, a lot of the guys were in the realms of 132-133 mph.
First race - had an absolute shocker. Each time out I lose too much time at the start being tentative on cold tyres, so I was determined to stick with the front pack as best as I could. I managed to do this but coming out of Coram braking for the last corner on the first lap I suffered a lock up on the front brakes, I was a passenger at this point and it fired me across the last corner where I subsequently tagged John Cutmore as he was exiting the corner.
Luckily there was not a great deal of damage to either car, actually none to mine .. (sorry John!) and both got back out for race 2. I was mortified and still am, regardless of how much people tell you that these things happen, I felt terrible and it really knocked my confidence on the cold tyres. It was completely my fault but I couldn't help wonder who made the decision to give the Clios and Formula Vee's warm up laps, but thought letting the fastest cars there go straight out of the garages and onto the grid was a good idea...
For race 2 I started 4th, so there I am, still with the novice cross on the back, starting on the outside of row 2... Got an absolutely great start and lead into the first corner but as I was on the outside I knew that I was going to get stuffed up the inside, and I did. I was also a bit knocked for confidence on the stone cold tyres after what happened earlier in the day and ended up back in 5th rather quickly. From there it was a rather lonely race, I was managing a gap back to John Whatley in 6th for a while until his ECU fuse blew and put him out and then it was just a case of running round at a decent pace without tripping myself up. The gap to John Cutmore in 4th wasn't really growing but I couldn't make in-roads either, and eventually I just decided that I should be happy where I was... and that was that!
Came in and got weighed - 10kg over the limit at 590KG. Car needs to go on a serious diet over winter. Yeah, the car. We also have some ideas how to reduce drag, plus I later found out I was a way out on my gearing and was basically revving the car considerably past peak where it's tailing off and you can see the accelleration curve almost flatline on the GPS info from the Aim solo. To be 3-4mph down on a track like Snetterton, or anywhere for that matter, just kills you. The corners are still where most time is lost on any circuit but you obviously want as much outright speed as you can get, after all it requires absolutely no skill to drive fast in a straight line..!
All in all 5th place was very respectable and all the cars ahead were the new breed of RGB car, at probably 3x the cost of mine. I also picked up 1st in the sporting cup which is for the highest placed person who hasn't finished in the top 3 that season, I'd already had a 2nd and 3rd so it was nice to complete the set!
Here is a onboard of my fastest lap from race 2, not as quick as my qualifying lap but I only ever fit the camera for the races
https://youtu.be/WPvO96eu2Q0
We arrived Friday morning for testing and set up for the day. Straight away we had noise issues, turned out the exhaust had lost a lot of its wadding. It has always been a loud car so in all honesty it's hard to notice it getting incrementally louder..! There was also a degree of confusion between some of us drivers about what the noise limits should be.
As it's a proper MSA test day and our cars are sports racing cars we should've been tested under normal race limits and it was stated there was no particular drive by noise limit in the test day instructions... but it seems this went out of the window and they made up their own rules. Arguing gets you nowhere so we just got on with repacking it and stuck the baffle in for good measure to shut it up some more, at the expense of some performance, but it was only a test day after all.
So finally got all that out of the way and got out for some fun, never driven the track before apart from on the playstation and a handful of laps on a bike, so needed the track time. This is where the next annoyance of the day came abundantly clear, we had been grouped together with locosts, which are a X flow powered 7 type kit car... it's not their fault but they are a hell of a lot slower than us and it just completely ruined the test day, no doubt for us and them. It was impossible to get a clear lap in without traffic, I've had less traffic and more value for money out of a track day for non licence holders.
We made a few tweaks to the car and was generally quite happy with how it felt, especially now the dampers are working properly. It's still a bit understeery at low speed, albeit no where near as bad, but much better in the faster stuff. Had a play around with my new Aim Solo 2, cracking bit of kit. Dead easy to use and the information is invaluable knowing in real time what I was gaining or losing against my best lap was an instant edge especially for learning a new track as you see straight away what works and what doesn't.
So onto qualifying, left the car alone from testing for once and into quali.. managed to get 6th for race 1 and 5th for race 2, race 1 is off your best lap and race 2 is off your second best. Luckily I'd done a string of laps very close to each other whereas some of the guys only did one good one. The car felt good in the bends but I was struggling for top speed, the best I was seeing was generally 128-129mph which is rather poor for Snetterton and it hurts a fair bit, a lot of the guys were in the realms of 132-133 mph.
First race - had an absolute shocker. Each time out I lose too much time at the start being tentative on cold tyres, so I was determined to stick with the front pack as best as I could. I managed to do this but coming out of Coram braking for the last corner on the first lap I suffered a lock up on the front brakes, I was a passenger at this point and it fired me across the last corner where I subsequently tagged John Cutmore as he was exiting the corner.
Luckily there was not a great deal of damage to either car, actually none to mine .. (sorry John!) and both got back out for race 2. I was mortified and still am, regardless of how much people tell you that these things happen, I felt terrible and it really knocked my confidence on the cold tyres. It was completely my fault but I couldn't help wonder who made the decision to give the Clios and Formula Vee's warm up laps, but thought letting the fastest cars there go straight out of the garages and onto the grid was a good idea...
For race 2 I started 4th, so there I am, still with the novice cross on the back, starting on the outside of row 2... Got an absolutely great start and lead into the first corner but as I was on the outside I knew that I was going to get stuffed up the inside, and I did. I was also a bit knocked for confidence on the stone cold tyres after what happened earlier in the day and ended up back in 5th rather quickly. From there it was a rather lonely race, I was managing a gap back to John Whatley in 6th for a while until his ECU fuse blew and put him out and then it was just a case of running round at a decent pace without tripping myself up. The gap to John Cutmore in 4th wasn't really growing but I couldn't make in-roads either, and eventually I just decided that I should be happy where I was... and that was that!
Came in and got weighed - 10kg over the limit at 590KG. Car needs to go on a serious diet over winter. Yeah, the car. We also have some ideas how to reduce drag, plus I later found out I was a way out on my gearing and was basically revving the car considerably past peak where it's tailing off and you can see the accelleration curve almost flatline on the GPS info from the Aim solo. To be 3-4mph down on a track like Snetterton, or anywhere for that matter, just kills you. The corners are still where most time is lost on any circuit but you obviously want as much outright speed as you can get, after all it requires absolutely no skill to drive fast in a straight line..!
All in all 5th place was very respectable and all the cars ahead were the new breed of RGB car, at probably 3x the cost of mine. I also picked up 1st in the sporting cup which is for the highest placed person who hasn't finished in the top 3 that season, I'd already had a 2nd and 3rd so it was nice to complete the set!
Here is a onboard of my fastest lap from race 2, not as quick as my qualifying lap but I only ever fit the camera for the races
https://youtu.be/WPvO96eu2Q0
Edited by Yazza54 on Friday 7th December 13:06
Some footage through bomb hole in quali. Most of us start pushing on after a few laps.
https://youtu.be/3Md0gfQyHqs
https://youtu.be/3Md0gfQyHqs
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