Use your race car on the road?
Discussion
Henry Fiddleton said:
I raced that Clio last year (my old car) - not sure if it was yours before hand.
Great car; but still compromised.
It was, yes. Great car; but still compromised.
For production classes i don't find them particularly comprimised, i would generally run the same spec on road and track apart from some quick changes to suspension damping for that car.
One competitor who has been club racing and hillclimbing now for 40 years, is a true enthusiast for still driving on the road to every event. His trophy cabinet is full too. These days of course, you cannot be as competitive as in the past, but there is still fun to be had.
The Classic Touring Car Racing Club series is good for road cars, although nearly all are now trailered.
I did a few seasons of the slick50 road saloons series back in the early 90s and the rule dictated that you had to drive too and hopefully from the circuit.
My car was a mk1 Gti which had a a very lumpy Cam and the suspension very hard even adjusted down off the track. Noisy too of course. The other problem was that it really didn't like sitting in traffic and got hot quite quickly causing the fuel to vapour and on a couple of occasions it just cut out without actually overheating. We drilled a couple of extra hols in the thermostat to keep flow and added a switch to the dash to enable the fan in traffic.
An earlier car got totalled at Mallory and another stripped its Cambelt at Donnington but in both cases the RAC picked it up from the circuit. Don't know if they still do that these days?
My car was a mk1 Gti which had a a very lumpy Cam and the suspension very hard even adjusted down off the track. Noisy too of course. The other problem was that it really didn't like sitting in traffic and got hot quite quickly causing the fuel to vapour and on a couple of occasions it just cut out without actually overheating. We drilled a couple of extra hols in the thermostat to keep flow and added a switch to the dash to enable the fan in traffic.
An earlier car got totalled at Mallory and another stripped its Cambelt at Donnington but in both cases the RAC picked it up from the circuit. Don't know if they still do that these days?
Each to their own but I really couldn't be bothered with the hassle and stress. It's rare to read a report on a club meeting these days without cars being damaged especially as the more popular series are running massive grids with big differences in lap times.
Trailering to and fro puts you in control rather than having to rely on 3rd parties to get you home in time for other commitments etc.
Trailering to and fro puts you in control rather than having to rely on 3rd parties to get you home in time for other commitments etc.
languagetimothy said:
I did a few seasons of the slick50 road saloons series back in the early 90s and the rule dictated that you had to drive to and hopefully from the circuit.
A coincidence that you should mention the Road Saloons series following my post.
The original idea of that series, was of course to try to limit engine modifications to a road going level, and therefore provide fairly low cost motor racing for competitors. It became very popular with full grids, but what worked then, is not what many competitors want today.
The founder of that series, is the competitor I was referring to.
Probably fairly unique now, to be still driving his two race cars to circuits.
The Mini Cooper is still racing, having been bought new in 1966. Must by now have done hundreds of races, and only on a very few occasions, has it needed help to get home.
It is due to be racing next at Donnington in September, and Brands Hatch in October.
Edited by Dewi 1 on Sunday 19th August 22:21
Dewi 1 said:
languagetimothy said:
I did a few seasons of the slick50 road saloons series back in the early 90s and the rule dictated that you had to drive to and hopefully from the circuit.
A coincidence that you should mention the Road Saloons series following my post.
The original idea of that series, was of course to try to limit engine modifications to a road going level, and therefore provide fairly low cost motor racing for competitors. It became very popular with full grids, but what worked then, is not what many competitors want today.
The founder of that series, is the competitor I was referring to.
Probably fairly unique now, to be still driving his two race cars to circuits.
The Mini Cooper is still racing, having been bought new in 1966. Must by now have done hundreds of races, and only on a very few occasions, has it needed help to get home.
It is due to be racing next at Donnington in September, and Brands Hatch in October.
Edited by Dewi 1 on Sunday 19th August 22:21
Yes, there are lots of championships that have road legality as a requirement. I’ve raced in one and know lots of people who race in others. Very few people drive to the circuit though, in fact I’ve only ever known it done as a one off just to prove a point, rather than a regular thing. The issues, as others have pointed out, are as follows:
- A track suspension setup is usually pretty awful on the road and vice versa.
- This one is purely a matter of opinion, but personally I find that racing cars or cars close to racing spec aren’t much fun on the road due to the high limits of grip, noise, lack of feedback, driving position, mirrors etc.
- There’s nowhere to lock your tools and stuff whilst you’re out on track. This was a major issue when I owned a 2-Eleven for track days for a few years. I currently tow my racing car to circuits with my road car and so I just lock valuables in my road car and keep my car keys in my racesuit pocket.
- If you have an accident on track that renders the car undriveable or unsafe, then you’re stuck. More subtley, a list 1A tyre doesn’t have much tread and you might find after a race weekend that your tyres are illegal or unsafe.
- To be competitive on track you’ll want to keep components fresh: engines, tyres etc. To be competitive, those parts of your car will need to be fresh and as good as they can be (soft tyres, good brake pads, even a blueprinted engine), and driving on the road is a waste of these expensive parts. If you turn up at a championship for ‘standard cars’ in an actual standard car off the street with 80,000 miles on the clock then you’d probably be several seconds off the pace, regardless of driving ability.
RobM77 said:
- There’s nowhere to lock your tools and stuff whilst you’re out on track. This was a major issue when I owned a 2-Eleven for track days for a few years. I currently tow my racing car to circuits with my road car and so I just lock valuables in my road car and keep my car keys in my racesuit pocket.
cbmotorsport said:
RobM77 said:
- There’s nowhere to lock your tools and stuff whilst you’re out on track. This was a major issue when I owned a 2-Eleven for track days for a few years. I currently tow my racing car to circuits with my road car and so I just lock valuables in my road car and keep my car keys in my racesuit pocket.
I agree with everything else Rob says about competitiveness etc. if you've chosen the wrong kind of car or championship, but you can solve almost all of it by driving a saloon car that carries spare brakes and tyres, and running in power to weight classes so your engine needn't be on the limit. I turn up on 205-section Rainsports that can also serve as my extreme wets, and race on 225 Nankang AR-1s. My brakes will never get hot enough on the road to be going through needless heat cycles when travelling, so you just need to pick a compound that has decent cold bite. I prefer that anyway.
I don't really take the car out on the road for fun, you can't approach its limits on the road and it wouldn't be appropriate to try. It is pretty damn noisy in there. But that isn't a negative aspect in the decision to trailer or drive to events.. if the car wasn't road legal you wouldn't be taking it out on a Sunday morning either..
McSam said:
regularly leave many hundreds of pounds' worth of kit, parts and tools unattended when racing. Never has any of it walked.. Everyone does the same, and my kit wouldn't be the most expensive choice so I don't worry about it! In any case, most of the paddock knows who you are and where your car's been parked, the community is its own security. Even on track days I wouldn't lose sleep over it.
.
Good to hear things haven't changed. :-) .
BertBert said:
languagetimothy said:
in both cases the RAC picked it up from the circuit. Don't know if they still do that these days?
Not really. They exclude it in the terms I believe. You may get away with blagging it if you are lucky.Bert
I needed their services 3 or 4 times I think, no problem coming into the circuit to collect, whereas the AA wouldn't.
Obviously driving to and from the event in that championship wasn't a handicap as everyone had to do it, remember doing Knockhill twice, driving from the south east, although I would offload some of the driving if I could
, also did Zandvoort in 1989.cbmotorsport said:
McSam said:
regularly leave many hundreds of pounds' worth of kit, parts and tools unattended when racing. Never has any of it walked.. Everyone does the same, and my kit wouldn't be the most expensive choice so I don't worry about it! In any case, most of the paddock knows who you are and where your car's been parked, the community is its own security. Even on track days I wouldn't lose sleep over it.
.
Good to hear things haven't changed. :-) .
RobM77 said:
cbmotorsport said:
McSam said:
regularly leave many hundreds of pounds' worth of kit, parts and tools unattended when racing. Never has any of it walked.. Everyone does the same, and my kit wouldn't be the most expensive choice so I don't worry about it! In any case, most of the paddock knows who you are and where your car's been parked, the community is its own security. Even on track days I wouldn't lose sleep over it.
.
Good to hear things haven't changed. :-) .
Those of us of more mature years will remember when the majority of club events were made upo of road legal cars .
One guy , John Oxborough, had a home built road legal Formula Ford single seater . Another was the unique Wally Pratt , for years he competed in a Fiat 500 Abarth that was his only mode of transport. He frequently had to be towed home and then would do an engine swap so he could get to work the next morning . At 83 he was still doing hill climbs and sprints in an MG Metro .
There was also an old boy that raced an Aunty Rover in classic saloons and he towed his caravan to the circuits with his race car .
One guy , John Oxborough, had a home built road legal Formula Ford single seater . Another was the unique Wally Pratt , for years he competed in a Fiat 500 Abarth that was his only mode of transport. He frequently had to be towed home and then would do an engine swap so he could get to work the next morning . At 83 he was still doing hill climbs and sprints in an MG Metro .
There was also an old boy that raced an Aunty Rover in classic saloons and he towed his caravan to the circuits with his race car .
Track days might be OK for 'run what ya brung' but in racing you are, or should be, stressing the car to the utmost. Even if you don't come off, a mechanical failure is so much more likely, and hitching a lift back home from a passing truck is not something to rely on. RAC/AA? It used to be that your friends would tow you out onto the public highway, from where you could appeal to the rescue service of your choice, but they are wise to that now. Anything tarted up, within miles of a venue, will have to make a very good case to be taken home. I drive my classic race car to non-competitive events, Classic Le Mans, the occaisional show, but always trailer it when I'm racing - peace of mine as much as anything.
Car trailers can be hired, if you are an occasional racer.
John
Car trailers can be hired, if you are an occasional racer.
John
Gassing Station | UK Club Motorsport | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff