Speaker system a little pricey?
Discussion
gottans said:
There will always be people with money so there will be marketing departments making up all sorts of promises to bolster the bottom line.
Difficult bit is working the sweet spot of price v performance.
I recenttly upgraded to some Focal 936 speakers, big improvement over the existing ones and at a price I was happy with i.e. ex-demo.
I agree about the sweet spot, my friend who went to the lengths of getting a separate mains spur put in for his h-ifi system which comprises of the very top of the range Chord amps and cd plus the Ear speakers drives a Yaris and is happy with it. Difficult bit is working the sweet spot of price v performance.
I recenttly upgraded to some Focal 936 speakers, big improvement over the existing ones and at a price I was happy with i.e. ex-demo.
Me on the other hand can appreciate his h-ifi system but would rather spend the money on cars.
I really cannot see the point of putting in a separate spur to power the hi-fi. Every bit of the hi-fi is generating electrical noise and injecting it straight into the mains wiring and into every component connected. Not to mention all the other electrical devices in the rest of the building producing electrical noise.
Still I am very impressed with the Focal 936's.
Still I am very impressed with the Focal 936's.
Biker 1 said:
I had a look at these mega-expensive mains cables, like the Nordost £25 k jobby. Assuming the quality will be only as good as the weakest link, why not just replace the mains socket with a junction box, then wire a piece of 2.5mm T & E from this, directly into your amplifier/stereo power supply? Honestly, I just can't believe someone would fall for this snake-oil s
t!
You could do quite a few stereos with this: https://www.screwfix.com/p/prysmian-6242y-twin-ear...
Or just install your own power pole https://youtu.be/XJJy6VJvSCkt!You could do quite a few stereos with this: https://www.screwfix.com/p/prysmian-6242y-twin-ear...
B17NNS said:
I'm sorry, but you just about lost all credibility there 
If you sold it, recommended it or didn't politely advise your client against the perceived benefit then sadly you're part of the problem.
By all means buy an attractive looking USB cable if it's on show. But the £5 Maplin cable will do EXACTLY the same job.
Ha! If you are spending £100k plus on a headphone system then you need to be 100% sure the system is going to perform as well as it possibly can. We sat down with the client and talked through the options. He decided to go ahead. It's his money, all we do is present options.If you sold it, recommended it or didn't politely advise your client against the perceived benefit then sadly you're part of the problem.
By all means buy an attractive looking USB cable if it's on show. But the £5 Maplin cable will do EXACTLY the same job.
Its about the whole package not individual prices of kit at this level.
gottans said:
I really cannot see the point of putting in a separate spur to power the hi-fi. Every bit of the hi-fi is generating electrical noise and injecting it straight into the mains wiring and into every component connected. Not to mention all the other electrical devices in the rest of the building producing electrical noise.
Still I am very impressed with the Focal 936's.
I had a separate circuit put in for my home cinema, not because I thought it would affect noise (I don't believe it can because it goes back to the same consumer unit), but because my house wiring has a single circuit for all the sockets upstairs and downstairs. Therefore I wanted a separate circuit to spread the load. I have two 1500 watt PA type amps driving my subwoofers, plus the more typical AV receiver/power amps so in theory it could draw something like 10Kw at full chat, so I feel much happier it's all been done properly...it's handy having an electrician in the family though. Still I am very impressed with the Focal 936's.
hyphen said:
JBL seem very underrated for some reason in domestic circles.
I gather their home cinema professional lines are rather good, and their sub's also seem to be gaining some traction (The UK M&K distributor recently tried to stop one installer/dealer selling JBL subs alongside M&K subs, he refused and chose to drop M&K)
JBL Pro stuff is very very good, installed their first EU Digital Pro Amps into a £100k+ cinema room two years ago and the first into stunning Atmos system.I gather their home cinema professional lines are rather good, and their sub's also seem to be gaining some traction (The UK M&K distributor recently tried to stop one installer/dealer selling JBL subs alongside M&K subs, he refused and chose to drop M&K)
The M&K distributor trying to control a dealer does not suprise me at all. They have a very arrogant approach to sales and mainly deal with dealers / clients who have to so much money to not bother asking how, why or how much. I visited his demo site with a client who has the money, but needs to feel its worth it and didn’t like the approach at all.
V.
NorthDave said:
Ha! If you are spending £100k plus on a headphone system then you need to be 100% sure the system is going to perform as well as it possibly can. We sat down with the client and talked through the options. He decided to go ahead. It's his money, all we do is present options.
Its about the whole package not individual prices of kit at this level.
Or your client could have compared a bog standard cable vs. the expensive cable with his / her ears.Its about the whole package not individual prices of kit at this level.
However when people have this much money to spend, common sense is optional, often non existent.
Not forgetting bragging rights of course.
It's always said that a fool and their money are easily parted, and stories like this are proof that even fools have money...
TonyRPH said:
Or your client could have compared a bog standard cable vs. the expensive cable with his / her ears.
However when people have this much money to spend, common sense is optional, often non existent.
Not forgetting bragging rights of course.
It's always said that a fool and their money are easily parted, and stories like this are proof that even fools have money...
Nice. I wouldn't call this guy a fool by any stretch of the imagination - he is a self made billionaire and is one of the cleverest guys I have met.However when people have this much money to spend, common sense is optional, often non existent.
Not forgetting bragging rights of course.
It's always said that a fool and their money are easily parted, and stories like this are proof that even fools have money...
If you are supplying interconnects etc from one manufacturer it makes sense to keep them all consistent across the system.
Anyway - I dont have anything else to contribute so I'll leave this thread alone now.
NorthDave said:
TonyRPH said:
Or your client could have compared a bog standard cable vs. the expensive cable with his / her ears.
However when people have this much money to spend, common sense is optional, often non existent.
Not forgetting bragging rights of course.
It's always said that a fool and their money are easily parted, and stories like this are proof that even fools have money...
Nice. I wouldn't call this guy a fool by any stretch of the imagination - he is a self made billionaire and is one of the cleverest guys I have met.However when people have this much money to spend, common sense is optional, often non existent.
Not forgetting bragging rights of course.
It's always said that a fool and their money are easily parted, and stories like this are proof that even fools have money...
If you are supplying interconnects etc from one manufacturer it makes sense to keep them all consistent across the system.
Anyway - I dont have anything else to contribute so I'll leave this thread alone now.
Try saying that over on hydrogen audio forums
VEX said:
The M&K distributor trying to control a dealer does not suprise me at all. They have a very arrogant approach to sales and mainly deal with dealers / clients who have to so much money to not bother asking how, why or how much. I visited his demo site with a client who has the money, but needs to feel its worth it and didn’t like the approach at all.
Whatever I’m selling (this week) is the best in the world! Everything else is rubbish and you’re a short sighted idiot, if you even consider other options.
Always the same story there.......
VEX said:
JBL Pro stuff is very very good, installed their first EU Digital Pro Amps into a £100k+ cinema room two years ago and the first into stunning Atmos system.
The M&K distributor trying to control a dealer does not suprise me at all. They have a very arrogant approach to sales and mainly deal with dealers / clients who have to so much money to not bother asking how, why or how much. I visited his demo site with a client who has the money, but needs to feel its worth it and didn’t like the approach at all.
V.
I find the whole m&k thing a bit puzzling. They trade on the back of some high profile films, notably star wars, using the s150's in their studios.The M&K distributor trying to control a dealer does not suprise me at all. They have a very arrogant approach to sales and mainly deal with dealers / clients who have to so much money to not bother asking how, why or how much. I visited his demo site with a client who has the money, but needs to feel its worth it and didn’t like the approach at all.
V.
However I'm puzzled as to if this is just because they have become the default goto speakers since their first release, or if they are indeed the best still - seeing as M&K have since launched the s300's, why don't the studio's use these instead
Also they don't seem to be sought after on the used market- currently 3 pairs for sale over on AVForums classifieds and no offers. In your experience, how do the s150's compare to other speakers you are familiar with at same price point or cheaper.
Edited by hyphen on Sunday 17th December 22:19
hyphen said:
I find the whole m&k thing a bit puzzling. They trade on the back of some high profile films, notably star wars, using the s150's in their studios.
However I'm puzzled as to if this is just because they have become the default goto speakers since their first release, or if they are indeed the best still - seeing as M&K have since launched the s300's, why don't the studio's use these instead Also they don't seem to be sought after on the used market- currently 3 pairs for sale over on AVForums classifieds and no offers.
In your experience, how do the s150's compare to other speakers you are familiar with at same price point or cheaper.
I’ll try a brief version......However I'm puzzled as to if this is just because they have become the default goto speakers since their first release, or if they are indeed the best still - seeing as M&K have since launched the s300's, why don't the studio's use these instead
Also they don't seem to be sought after on the used market- currently 3 pairs for sale over on AVForums classifieds and no offers. In your experience, how do the s150's compare to other speakers you are familiar with at same price point or cheaper.
Edited by hyphen on Sunday 17th December 22:19
Miller & Kriesel were a partnership and made some good speakers.
They met the spec for THX with some models and were mentioned with regard to Lucas Film pretty often. There were some other tie ups, but I don’t really know all of them.
The company was run into debt, until they owed their 3rd party factory more money than they were worth. The company (M&K) ceased to be, at this point and shirts / rights were lost.
The far east factory, that made some (not all) of the speakers, then owned a lot, but not all the rights. A name change and split was on the cards.
‘MK Sound’ was born with the help of said UK distributor.
After agreed terms / time had lapsed, Ken Kriesel was allowed to use his name for speakers again, so launched his own named brand.
These Kriesel speakers actually have more credence than MK sound, but much momentum was lost.
The UK market has never embraced either Kreisel Speakers, or MK Sound though.
That’s broad strokes, from what I remember. I did have the inside track here, so I’m not just guessing.
hyphen said:
I find the whole m&k thing a bit puzzling. They trade on the back of some high profile films, notably star wars, using the s150's in their studios.
However I'm puzzled as to if this is just because they have become the default goto speakers since their first release, or if they are indeed the best still - seeing as M&K have since launched the s300's, why don't the studio's use these instead Also they don't seem to be sought after on the used market- currently 3 pairs for sale over on AVForums classifieds and no offers.
In your experience, how do the s150's compare to other speakers you are familiar with at same price point or cheaper.
I couldnt comment as I have never used them or worked with them. Thanks for the input Red5. However I'm puzzled as to if this is just because they have become the default goto speakers since their first release, or if they are indeed the best still - seeing as M&K have since launched the s300's, why don't the studio's use these instead
Also they don't seem to be sought after on the used market- currently 3 pairs for sale over on AVForums classifieds and no offers. In your experience, how do the s150's compare to other speakers you are familiar with at same price point or cheaper.
Edited by hyphen on Sunday 17th December 22:19
I have my current fav's, which I like so much I have them in at home, but would only ever suggest, never force people to use.
We have a product agnostic approach to selling, yes we have our favs, but if there is something out there that fits better we will go hunting for it. We have enough contacts to get what we need in the industry.
V.
hyphen said:
crankedup said:
Whilst waiting for my new tyres to be fitted I was browsing a current ‘What Hi-Fi’ magazine. Not being one of the hi fi officinado, but do enjoy my home system, I was astonished to read up on a pair of floor standing speakers. Looked very nice and the report was of a near faultless performance ‘as expected of the price’ of £44,000. By eck that is a woden of cash me thinks.
Then further browsing brought another eye opener speaker system, reported as perfect and a very unusual look about them. Price tag £700,000 seven hundred thousand pounds!!!
Sorry I cannot recall manufacturers of either speaker systems due to the shock of the price tags. Can any speakers be worth this money?
Mainstream manufacturers will release one set of products between 1-5 years cycle, av amps may be every year speakers may be longer, so seeing as they publish every month, these mags have to find stuff to fill their pages, they can't drip feed reviews as the reader won't wait for them to review todays released amp in 6 months time.Then further browsing brought another eye opener speaker system, reported as perfect and a very unusual look about them. Price tag £700,000 seven hundred thousand pounds!!!
Sorry I cannot recall manufacturers of either speaker systems due to the shock of the price tags. Can any speakers be worth this money?
Also by featuring very expensive speakers, they will be aspirational,glossy and upmarket enough for the premium mainstream hifi makes such as b&W to spend good money on adverts.
They will probably be made to order, and very few people will ever buy those speakers, and even less at RRP. Large manufacturers often make these 'statement' products for show use too, lots of free press coverage, don't take it seriously.
No different to a car mag which may feature some obscure sports car over a double page spread, but the reader will be more interested in the ads for the lease special Golf R's.
Edited by hyphen on Thursday 14th December 13:16
BIRMA said:
Yes there was the wand and I didn’t bother buying one and spent the money on interconnects and speaker cable. Yes the Krell was the 300 series fantastic sound but the Bow gear is noticeably a step up
Nice gear from Bow, don't see too much of it nowadays yet Naim and Linn are everywhere...I had the Krell 300 combo, at used prices they were excellent for the money - they're now going for more than I bought and sold for around 15 years ago!
There are lots of smoother, 'nicer' sounding amps out there now but still difficult to match the bass prowess. Recently got a Krell pre as I missed the 'impact' and it's helped.
legzr1 said:
BIRMA said:
Yes there was the wand and I didn’t bother buying one and spent the money on interconnects and speaker cable. Yes the Krell was the 300 series fantastic sound but the Bow gear is noticeably a step up
Nice gear from Bow, don't see too much of it nowadays yet Naim and Linn are everywhere...I had the Krell 300 combo, at used prices they were excellent for the money - they're now going for more than I bought and sold for around 15 years ago!
There are lots of smoother, 'nicer' sounding amps out there now but still difficult to match the bass prowess. Recently got a Krell pre as I missed the 'impact' and it's helped.
The combination of the JBL's and the Bow produces an incredible bass reproduction. So much so that when I invited the members of my band to come around to have a listen I played Texas Flood by SRV and the guitarist was gobsmacked by the sound. I can only conclude that none of them had ever heard a really good hi-fi before because comments like 'it sounds like the band are in the room' proved what an excellent soundstage the combo produces plus you can make out every note in the bass line (which I try to play) and they even said it was obvious by the reproduction heard that it was in E flat. That just about made my day and justified the obscene amount of money I'd spent on my hi-fi.
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