What’s your Hi-Fi set up? spec and pictures please
Discussion
Funk said:
I really didn't get on with the Bluesound Node - and the comments on PFM were to run it into my D90SE DAC anyway. That, combined with the interface being an utter pain in the arse was what led me to flog it. I'm thinking about setting up something cheap as a Roon endpoint and going that route instead.
I've got a Raspberry Pi4 running moOde OS and that's capable of acting as a Roon endpoint (as are some of the other OS's) I actually looked at getting Roon a few weeks but there's no value in it for my needs as my digital library is only a couple of hundred albums/100gb - I know yours is much bigger so Roon would probably be a worthwhile investment. stevoknevo said:
Funk said:
I really didn't get on with the Bluesound Node - and the comments on PFM were to run it into my D90SE DAC anyway. That, combined with the interface being an utter pain in the arse was what led me to flog it. I'm thinking about setting up something cheap as a Roon endpoint and going that route instead.
I've got a Raspberry Pi4 running moOde OS and that's capable of acting as a Roon endpoint (as are some of the other OS's) I actually looked at getting Roon a few weeks but there's no value in it for my needs as my digital library is only a couple of hundred albums/100gb - I know yours is much bigger so Roon would probably be a worthwhile investment. I built a Roon Rock server on an Intel NUC, this sits next to my router and is connected by ethernet to other endpoints.
1st endpoint is Raspberry Pi based running Ropieee, really cheap and easy to set up. This is my main system (Cyrus, Spendor). Sounds great and
2nd endpoint is a bit of a nerd experiment. Its another Raspberry Pi, but I also put a IQAudio DAC/AMP HAT, essentially creating a streamer, DAC and 35w x2 AMP in one very small cheap unit. The idea being these can utilise some of the spare pairs of speakers I have kicking about and installed in the man cave, garage, bedroom etc where i'm not performing critical listening. So far, i'm actually pretty impressed with how good it sounds I have to say, way better than using a Sonos type of unit.
I love that yiu chaps can do this. For me, my interest in hifi wanes when I need the tech skills to DIY like this. Even Minidsp's science project-esque user interface put me off.
The NAD C658 is expensive. But Dirac functionality on a phone app rather than having to plug a laptop in, and BluOS over Volumio was enough for me to choose it over the Minidsp SHD.
The NAD C658 is expensive. But Dirac functionality on a phone app rather than having to plug a laptop in, and BluOS over Volumio was enough for me to choose it over the Minidsp SHD.
beanoir said:
stevoknevo said:
Funk said:
I really didn't get on with the Bluesound Node - and the comments on PFM were to run it into my D90SE DAC anyway. That, combined with the interface being an utter pain in the arse was what led me to flog it. I'm thinking about setting up something cheap as a Roon endpoint and going that route instead.
I've got a Raspberry Pi4 running moOde OS and that's capable of acting as a Roon endpoint (as are some of the other OS's) I actually looked at getting Roon a few weeks but there's no value in it for my needs as my digital library is only a couple of hundred albums/100gb - I know yours is much bigger so Roon would probably be a worthwhile investment. I've been running Roon for about 5 years now and it's really changed the way I listen to my music, for the better. Combining my entire CD library and Tidal library.
I built a Roon Rock server on an Intel NUC, this sits next to my router and is connected by ethernet to other endpoints.
1st endpoint is Raspberry Pi based running Ropieee, really cheap and easy to set up. This is my main system (Cyrus, Spendor). Sounds great and
2nd endpoint is a bit of a nerd experiment. Its another Raspberry Pi, but I also put a IQAudio DAC/AMP HAT, essentially creating a streamer, DAC and 35w x2 AMP in one very small cheap unit. The idea being these can utilise some of the spare pairs of speakers I have kicking about and installed in the man cave, garage, bedroom etc where i'm not performing critical listening. So far, i'm actually pretty impressed with how good it sounds I have to say, way better than using a Sonos type of unit.
Funk said:
The only issue with Pis at the mo is availability; they're in short supply and people are scalping.
Yes, quite frustrating. I managed to pick up a new Pi4 4gb on eBay for 65, which is 10 over RRP...I felt I could live with that for the sake of getting my little project done, and i'm incredibly impatient.
Smallest Hi-Fi I’ve ever had…
Edited by beanoir on Wednesday 18th May 13:46
Things are taking shape. Except I reckon the ugly bugger NAD has to go on the bottom shelf...it is a singularly uninspired and boring piece of design.
I was going to get a Cambridge AZUR 851N, whose thick aluminium fascia would have matched the Musical Fidelity bits nicely. But the aesthetically challenged NAD has a lot more functionality and was the same price in the end, so here we are.
I was going to get a Cambridge AZUR 851N, whose thick aluminium fascia would have matched the Musical Fidelity bits nicely. But the aesthetically challenged NAD has a lot more functionality and was the same price in the end, so here we are.
Edited by Harry Flashman on Thursday 19th May 11:59
The ROM drive in my Meridian 596 has finally died...
So my system is now:
Meridian 502 Pre-amp (awaiting repair)
Meridian 557 Power-amp (awaiting repair)
Meridian 551 Integrated - pressed back into service whilst I try to find someone who can do a proper repair of the other two!
Martin Logan Clarity Speakers
Raspberry PI / HiFiBerry DAC as source
Rega Planar 25 into Lehmann Audio Phono Stage.
Now I just need to find a decent matching CD (or ideally SACD) player. Apparently there are ROM drives available that can be fitted to the 596, but the reviews are pretty grim in terms of life expectancy...
So my system is now:
Meridian 502 Pre-amp (awaiting repair)
Meridian 557 Power-amp (awaiting repair)
Meridian 551 Integrated - pressed back into service whilst I try to find someone who can do a proper repair of the other two!
Martin Logan Clarity Speakers
Raspberry PI / HiFiBerry DAC as source
Rega Planar 25 into Lehmann Audio Phono Stage.
Now I just need to find a decent matching CD (or ideally SACD) player. Apparently there are ROM drives available that can be fitted to the 596, but the reviews are pretty grim in terms of life expectancy...
Well, what a massive disappointment. NAD, Musical Fidelity and Sonus Faber setup streaming Spotify sounds no better than the well set up Sonos Play 1 pair with Sonos sub. In fact, the Sonos absolutely murders the so-called hifi at lower frequencies. But even absent that, the rest of the midrange and treble is not noticeably better than the Sonos at civilised listening frequencies.
Going to cart in one of my SVS subs from the TV room to see if this improves things.
Things to do:
Run the NAD streamer for a while to see if the current thin sound is remedied. But as the unit was second hand, I doubt it.
Run Dirac to see if room correction matters. But frankly, if the Sonos manages this with its own room optimisation software, and several thousand pounds worth of hifi equipment can't manage similar results unless DSP'd to the eyeballs, my ears clearly don't need Hifi at all.
I suspect some very pretty speakers, a nice Musical Fidelity amp and a NAD preamp/streamer/DAC will be up for sale soon and this expensive and pointless experiment ended!
Step one. Hook up an SVS SB1000 Pro and see if we get anywhere.
Going to cart in one of my SVS subs from the TV room to see if this improves things.
Things to do:
Run the NAD streamer for a while to see if the current thin sound is remedied. But as the unit was second hand, I doubt it.
Run Dirac to see if room correction matters. But frankly, if the Sonos manages this with its own room optimisation software, and several thousand pounds worth of hifi equipment can't manage similar results unless DSP'd to the eyeballs, my ears clearly don't need Hifi at all.
I suspect some very pretty speakers, a nice Musical Fidelity amp and a NAD preamp/streamer/DAC will be up for sale soon and this expensive and pointless experiment ended!
Step one. Hook up an SVS SB1000 Pro and see if we get anywhere.
Very strange.
Do t take this as me having a go but is there a slim chance that the bass you’ve become accustomed to is nowhere near the accuracy a well driven pair of quality floorstanders provide?
Basically, one-note boom and drone masquerading as ‘bass’ and masking texture and tone?
I ask based on the experience of others with ‘lifestyle’ systems swapping fake bass for quality and taking a while to get used to it.
Before you sell it all, try not using the NAD as a pre-amp. Use fixed analogue outputs into the MF amp. Don’t use any DSP yet. Spend time on speaker placement - room/speaker interaction is, IMHO, 95% of the battle.
I have no experience with your NAD. However, I can thoroughly recommend the 851N I think you mentioned earlier. If you’re going to sell/exchange I’d try that first.
It would be a travesty to dump the lot for the sake of a couple of days spent really gettting it setup.
Do t take this as me having a go but is there a slim chance that the bass you’ve become accustomed to is nowhere near the accuracy a well driven pair of quality floorstanders provide?
Basically, one-note boom and drone masquerading as ‘bass’ and masking texture and tone?
I ask based on the experience of others with ‘lifestyle’ systems swapping fake bass for quality and taking a while to get used to it.
Before you sell it all, try not using the NAD as a pre-amp. Use fixed analogue outputs into the MF amp. Don’t use any DSP yet. Spend time on speaker placement - room/speaker interaction is, IMHO, 95% of the battle.
I have no experience with your NAD. However, I can thoroughly recommend the 851N I think you mentioned earlier. If you’re going to sell/exchange I’d try that first.
It would be a travesty to dump the lot for the sake of a couple of days spent really gettting it setup.
Good advice!
The bass I am used to is pretty decent, and nicely set up, but of course comes from an AV receiver playing music.
The killer here is that the Sonos in the mid and treble is almost as good as the main hifi, and that's unforgivable to me given the cost differential and the fact I did no room placement at all. The Sonos sub really is very good too, mind.
Boosting the bass in the NAD BluOS app allows the Sonus Faber floorstanders to deliver better bass at low volume to be fair, and I am sure some DIRAC playing will get me curves I would like. But the sub outs on the NAD still won't drive a sub, and that is bad. And after some googling, a well known issue.
The bass I am used to is pretty decent, and nicely set up, but of course comes from an AV receiver playing music.
The killer here is that the Sonos in the mid and treble is almost as good as the main hifi, and that's unforgivable to me given the cost differential and the fact I did no room placement at all. The Sonos sub really is very good too, mind.
Boosting the bass in the NAD BluOS app allows the Sonus Faber floorstanders to deliver better bass at low volume to be fair, and I am sure some DIRAC playing will get me curves I would like. But the sub outs on the NAD still won't drive a sub, and that is bad. And after some googling, a well known issue.
Edited by Harry Flashman on Friday 20th May 17:51
Buy my Celestion A3s - I guarantee that'll solve the bass issue.... 
legzr is right though; also try feeding it something better than Spotify to see what changes that brings. You're also probably used to sitting far closer to the Sonos by the looks of things so the presentation of a pair of speakers 10ft+ away will naturally sound different. A hifi will also provide things that Sonos typically won't or can't such as soundstaging and imaging etc. Definitely worth playing about with positioning and source quality.
Also depending on the age of the MF amp, it might benefit from recapping if not done recently (or at all) as over time the capacitors degrade.
legzr is right though; also try feeding it something better than Spotify to see what changes that brings. You're also probably used to sitting far closer to the Sonos by the looks of things so the presentation of a pair of speakers 10ft+ away will naturally sound different. A hifi will also provide things that Sonos typically won't or can't such as soundstaging and imaging etc. Definitely worth playing about with positioning and source quality.
Also depending on the age of the MF amp, it might benefit from recapping if not done recently (or at all) as over time the capacitors degrade.
Edited by Funk on Friday 20th May 18:25
I am glad I am listening to you guys.
I am using Spotify connect so I can switch directly between the Sonos and the hifi.
And you were right. I was mistaking the attack and bass of the Sonos for quality but an hour or two in, the difference is stark. The NAD/MF/Sonus Faber setup delivers detail and clarity to an extraordinary level.
And then, I discovered that you can turn the bass up in the BluOS app, and it does so cleanly.
And then I used the dirac, and that was a game changer. All the muddiness in the midbass that made me think it was only a bit better than the Sonos is gone. And what is left is a spacious, warm, rich, detailed sound, and I am in love.
OK, I can't drive a sub. But frankly, I don't need one and would rather have the dirac DSP.
Just listened to Springsteen's Philadelphia as that is a track that needs enough clarity to hear the reverb on the drumbeat, unmuddied by the bass. Where the Sonos tripped, the Sonus Fabers absolutely soared.
Sold. Now to start the log burner, open a bottle of red, and really enjoy myself!
SVS sub going back to the TV room, whilst I enjoy the Italian insanity that uses black leather for the speaker baffles in the floorstanders.
I am using Spotify connect so I can switch directly between the Sonos and the hifi.
And you were right. I was mistaking the attack and bass of the Sonos for quality but an hour or two in, the difference is stark. The NAD/MF/Sonus Faber setup delivers detail and clarity to an extraordinary level.
And then, I discovered that you can turn the bass up in the BluOS app, and it does so cleanly.
And then I used the dirac, and that was a game changer. All the muddiness in the midbass that made me think it was only a bit better than the Sonos is gone. And what is left is a spacious, warm, rich, detailed sound, and I am in love.
OK, I can't drive a sub. But frankly, I don't need one and would rather have the dirac DSP.
Just listened to Springsteen's Philadelphia as that is a track that needs enough clarity to hear the reverb on the drumbeat, unmuddied by the bass. Where the Sonos tripped, the Sonus Fabers absolutely soared.
Sold. Now to start the log burner, open a bottle of red, and really enjoy myself!
SVS sub going back to the TV room, whilst I enjoy the Italian insanity that uses black leather for the speaker baffles in the floorstanders.
Edited by Harry Flashman on Friday 20th May 21:07
Result!
If you ever feel a lack of bass in the future, for stereo use I’d suggest BKelectronics or REL subwoofers - both can use high-level inputs driven from your MF amp.
I followed my own advice recently and spent the time simply moving my speakers around. It wasn’t as easy as it sounds as, like yours, they have leather on parts of the cabinets but weigh in at 125Kg each. That’s the main reason I put it off so long. Now I’ve got bass depth and texture I’ve been searching for. A pair of subs I bought to help out have been sold on.
This is for stereo use only. For AV impact, a good subwoofer (preferably two or four !!) is essential.
Spotify is a great product. Polished user interface, simple to use and a huge catalogue. But, a system like your deserves so much better. Qobuz is worth a free trial. If you’re a Springsteen fan, get a free trial of Qobuz set up and play The Ghost Of Tom Joad album. Stripped down music, excellent sound and production quality and fantastic on a decent hifi.
If you ever feel a lack of bass in the future, for stereo use I’d suggest BKelectronics or REL subwoofers - both can use high-level inputs driven from your MF amp.
I followed my own advice recently and spent the time simply moving my speakers around. It wasn’t as easy as it sounds as, like yours, they have leather on parts of the cabinets but weigh in at 125Kg each. That’s the main reason I put it off so long. Now I’ve got bass depth and texture I’ve been searching for. A pair of subs I bought to help out have been sold on.
This is for stereo use only. For AV impact, a good subwoofer (preferably two or four !!) is essential.
Spotify is a great product. Polished user interface, simple to use and a huge catalogue. But, a system like your deserves so much better. Qobuz is worth a free trial. If you’re a Springsteen fan, get a free trial of Qobuz set up and play The Ghost Of Tom Joad album. Stripped down music, excellent sound and production quality and fantastic on a decent hifi.
What a great subforum this is: thank you for the help and advice, both of you.
I have just subscribed to a Tidal trial. As for subs, I use SVS subs in the AV room, but actually think that I don't need one for the two channel system. The bass last night was lovely and very adjustable from the BluOS app for the NAD.
Also, I have just worked out that I had the BluOS set to subwoofer on at the NAD at first. The system was killing low frequencies to the floorstanders, but neither was it then driving the sub (the latter problem remains). So I had nothing below 80hz.
On subs, mine have speaker level inputs, but the trouble is my amp only has two speaker out channels, with no spare for the sub. I could parallel (I think?) but the cabling starts getting messy.
The dirac dsp really helped as it completely cured some bass muddiness from room and placement issues. The room is a living room, so I can't just place the speakers where they sound best - aesthetics must be considered, sadly.
I am having one issue, which I think may be at the root of the initial problem with the sound I noted yesterday. The sound is very thin initially but as time goes on gets richer. It's not just my ear becoming accustomed to it, wife noticed it too. An hour after turning everything on, things are transformed. I played the same tracks at the beginning and end of the evening and at initial turn-on, low bass notes were simply not there. They were, later. Very noticeable on some drum and bass (Etherwood - both excellent for testing bass response, but also great music).
I think it's my amp - but surely a solid state amp doesn't need warming up? The MF is designed to be left on all the time and back in the day, it's what I used to do. These days, in a more power conscious world, I wish to turn it off. Or could this be that thing Funk mentioned above - the amp needing refurbishment of capacitors?
I have just subscribed to a Tidal trial. As for subs, I use SVS subs in the AV room, but actually think that I don't need one for the two channel system. The bass last night was lovely and very adjustable from the BluOS app for the NAD.
Also, I have just worked out that I had the BluOS set to subwoofer on at the NAD at first. The system was killing low frequencies to the floorstanders, but neither was it then driving the sub (the latter problem remains). So I had nothing below 80hz.
On subs, mine have speaker level inputs, but the trouble is my amp only has two speaker out channels, with no spare for the sub. I could parallel (I think?) but the cabling starts getting messy.
The dirac dsp really helped as it completely cured some bass muddiness from room and placement issues. The room is a living room, so I can't just place the speakers where they sound best - aesthetics must be considered, sadly.
I am having one issue, which I think may be at the root of the initial problem with the sound I noted yesterday. The sound is very thin initially but as time goes on gets richer. It's not just my ear becoming accustomed to it, wife noticed it too. An hour after turning everything on, things are transformed. I played the same tracks at the beginning and end of the evening and at initial turn-on, low bass notes were simply not there. They were, later. Very noticeable on some drum and bass (Etherwood - both excellent for testing bass response, but also great music).
I think it's my amp - but surely a solid state amp doesn't need warming up? The MF is designed to be left on all the time and back in the day, it's what I used to do. These days, in a more power conscious world, I wish to turn it off. Or could this be that thing Funk mentioned above - the amp needing refurbishment of capacitors?
Edited by Harry Flashman on Saturday 21st May 07:44
beanoir said:
Funk said:
The only issue with Pis at the mo is availability; they're in short supply and people are scalping.
Yes, quite frustrating. I managed to pick up a new Pi4 4gb on eBay for 65, which is 10 over RRP...I felt I could live with that for the sake of getting my little project done, and i'm incredibly impatient.
Smallest Hi-Fi I’ve ever had…
Edited by beanoir on Wednesday 18th May 13:46
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