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Discussion
Leftfootwonder said:
Is the GRY really a competitor for the CTR, Megane, Golf R etc? I don't think so. It's a class-size below, so to my mind it's a Fiesta, Mini etc rival. Clearly it is leading that class by some margin and punches above it's weight, but so it should given that it is priced a class-above.
It can’t be compared with any of the cars you have mentioned....It is in a class of its own. It should be priced around £100,000 if you take into account the R and D that has been spent on it and the supercar rivalling performance. There hasn’t been a car like it for many years!greenarrow said:
Found a link on you tube to some lap times around Tsukuba https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb4T2br9m28
Yaris GR lapped 1:06.946. Compares with 1:05.97 for FK8 Civic Type R and interestingly 1:06.88 for the old E46 M3 CSL.......
However, Fastest laps.com has a different entry for Tsukuba (Nobuteru Taniguchi which is two seconds faster at 1:04.81, putting it almost level with the F80 M4.....
Not sure if you've old copies of Evo but the opening paragraph of their issue 241 (December 2017) group test on the CTR v Leon Cupra 300 V Focus RS kinds of answers your question; they're in the North York Moors, rivers are streaming across the road and there's a cattle grid and sharp crested left hander directly afterwards, the type R hardly registers it, it just grips and goes. Later on they reference its wet weather traction again, calling it borderline absurd for a two wheel drive car.Yaris GR lapped 1:06.946. Compares with 1:05.97 for FK8 Civic Type R and interestingly 1:06.88 for the old E46 M3 CSL.......
However, Fastest laps.com has a different entry for Tsukuba (Nobuteru Taniguchi which is two seconds faster at 1:04.81, putting it almost level with the F80 M4.....
Round Millbrook it did 1:26.2 v 1:26.9 FRS v 1:27.8 Leon. Pictures imply it was dry though.
The actual article I was thinking about was their Track COTY 2018; where the GT3 won, except it didn't because it wasn't available, the CTR did. One comment which again alludes to your question; In the wet its pace was incredible (not much here was quicker), it's ability to find grip bordering on witchcraft. They conclude by calling it the performance bargain of the decade. I guess you could ask will the GR Yaris be this decades equivalent?
acme said:
Not sure if you've old copies of Evo but the opening paragraph of their issue 241 (December 2017) group test on the CTR v Leon Cupra 300 V Focus RS kinds of answers your question; they're in the North York Moors, rivers are streaming across the road and there's a cattle grid and sharp crested left hander directly afterwards, the type R hardly registers it, it just grips and goes. Later on they reference its wet weather traction again, calling it borderline absurd for a two wheel drive car.
Round Millbrook it did 1:26.2 v 1:26.9 FRS v 1:27.8 Leon. Pictures imply it was dry though.
The actual article I was thinking about was their Track COTY 2018; where the GT3 won, except it didn't because it wasn't available, the CTR did. One comment which again alludes to your question; In the wet its pace was incredible (not much here was quicker), it's ability to find grip bordering on witchcraft. They conclude by calling it the performance bargain of the decade. I guess you could ask will the GR Yaris be this decades equivalent?
I used to have that group test you refer to but chucked out that issue some time ago! Yes I remember the track COTY. Have you seen Steve Sutcliffe's lap from that day? He lapped the CTR against the Hyundai i30N and its something like 5 seconds quicker, which is remarkable on one lap of a race track between similar cars (even allowing for the CTRs power advantage). I just wasn't sure if the CTR was as quick on bumpy wet roads. Round Millbrook it did 1:26.2 v 1:26.9 FRS v 1:27.8 Leon. Pictures imply it was dry though.
The actual article I was thinking about was their Track COTY 2018; where the GT3 won, except it didn't because it wasn't available, the CTR did. One comment which again alludes to your question; In the wet its pace was incredible (not much here was quicker), it's ability to find grip bordering on witchcraft. They conclude by calling it the performance bargain of the decade. I guess you could ask will the GR Yaris be this decades equivalent?
Mind you Honda do have a history of producing remarkable front drivers. Some years ago, I was taken out in an Accord Type R along a favourite local backroad (admittedly not in the rain). The composure of that car was pretty remarkable and I remember EVO saying in Issue 2 (way back in 1998) that the ATR could keep up (just about) with the more powerful Impreza Turbo in the rain on winding roads...... Saw one for sale recently - £2795. Now THAT really is the bargain of the decade!!
Lordbenny said:
It can’t be compared with any of the cars you have mentioned....It is in a class of its own. It should be priced around £100,000 if you take into account the R and D that has been spent on it and the supercar rivalling performance. There hasn’t been a car like it for many years!
I’d struggle to justify spending what they charge now with the interior it has. Not sure it’s worrying supercars. I don’t think it would see which way a 992 4S went let alone a Turbo S. But I get the wet, narrow road type scenario.
greenarrow said:
Mind you Honda do have a history of producing remarkable front drivers. Some years ago, I was taken out in an Accord Type R along a favourite local backroad (admittedly not in the rain). The composure of that car was pretty remarkable and I remember EVO saying in Issue 2 (way back in 1998) that the ATR could keep up (just about) with the more powerful Impreza Turbo in the rain on winding roads...... Saw one for sale recently - £2795. Now THAT really is the bargain of the decade!!
I'm very pleased with mine 
greenarrow said:
I used to have that group test you refer to but chucked out that issue some time ago! Yes I remember the track COTY. Have you seen Steve Sutcliffe's lap from that day? He lapped the CTR against the Hyundai i30N and its something like 5 seconds quicker, which is remarkable on one lap of a race track between similar cars (even allowing for the CTRs power advantage). I just wasn't sure if the CTR was as quick on bumpy wet roads.
Mind you Honda do have a history of producing remarkable front drivers. Some years ago, I was taken out in an Accord Type R along a favourite local backroad (admittedly not in the rain). The composure of that car was pretty remarkable and I remember EVO saying in Issue 2 (way back in 1998) that the ATR could keep up (just about) with the more powerful Impreza Turbo in the rain on winding roads...... Saw one for sale recently - £2795. Now THAT really is the bargain of the decade!!
I did recall it, but have just found it and watched it again, that's quite an incredible result given Rockingham's lap of 1.5 minutes.Mind you Honda do have a history of producing remarkable front drivers. Some years ago, I was taken out in an Accord Type R along a favourite local backroad (admittedly not in the rain). The composure of that car was pretty remarkable and I remember EVO saying in Issue 2 (way back in 1998) that the ATR could keep up (just about) with the more powerful Impreza Turbo in the rain on winding roads...... Saw one for sale recently - £2795. Now THAT really is the bargain of the decade!!
I've never been out in an ATR, and you so rarely if ever see them anymore, in fact I can't even think I've seen one at a show, well when we could go to such things! I do recall a great readers car on here about one, but that was a few years ago.
Apologies and off track, but I've greatly enjoyed your Focus write up, has had me looking in the classifieds!
Leftfootwonder said:
greenarrow said:
Mind you Honda do have a history of producing remarkable front drivers. Some years ago, I was taken out in an Accord Type R along a favourite local backroad (admittedly not in the rain). The composure of that car was pretty remarkable and I remember EVO saying in Issue 2 (way back in 1998) that the ATR could keep up (just about) with the more powerful Impreza Turbo in the rain on winding roads...... Saw one for sale recently - £2795. Now THAT really is the bargain of the decade!!
I'm very pleased with mine 
F20CN16 said:
The hype around this car is ridiculous. Lord Benny should watch the Henry Catchpole review of for a little balance.
I'm going to watch that later as I'm a big Henry fan.I think you're right though, the hype is a little ridiculous, but I think its a sign of the state of the current new car market. After Subaru and Mitsubishi pulled out of rallying no-one expected a homologation 4x4 rally car type special ever again, especially one in 2021 which came with a manual gearbox, compact dimensions, decent kerb weight and reasonable running costs and ticked so many boxes for misty eyed car enthusiasts my age and older. So with that in mind, its understandable that everyone has gone a little crazy. It might be one of the last ICE cars of its type ever to be launched before BEVs take over. To say its worth £100K is a bit overstating things though.
towser44 said:
I loved the Impreza and Evo etc back in the day when rallying was rallying, but I can't excited over this, I think because it is a Yaris. It's a bit like there being a Type-R Honda Jazz!
Short wheelbase, boxed arches, versatile interior space, screaming VTEC...Missed opportunity I’d say!
(Given the relative success of the Yaris, might it be too much to ask for a competitor product from another Japanese manufacturer to relive the Impreza/Lancer days?)
Mezzanine said:
towser44 said:
I loved the Impreza and Evo etc back in the day when rallying was rallying, but I can't excited over this, I think because it is a Yaris. It's a bit like there being a Type-R Honda Jazz!
Short wheelbase, boxed arches, versatile interior space, screaming VTEC...Missed opportunity I’d say!
(Given the relative success of the Yaris, might it be too much to ask for a competitor product from another Japanese manufacturer to relive the Impreza/Lancer days?)
Leftfootwonder said:
I do vaguely remember a Type-R Jazz being mooted some years ago. Despite the granny-spec regular cars, I think the chassis is supposed to be very stiff and lends itself well to tuning. Spoon and Mugen have made a few 'hot' versions over the years.
And to be fair, Honda do have a bit of history with that equivalent model (was City in Japan, Jazz in Europe)
F20CN16 said:
The hype around this car is ridiculous. Lord Benny should watch the Henry Catchpole review of for a little balance.
I’ve spoken personally to Henry about the car!My statement about the fact the car should be £100,000 has been taken out of context. The Research and Development cost, the WRC costs, the fact that the car is completely different from a regular Yaris apart from the lights and there’s only 25,000 being made. How much do you think it costs a manufacturer like Toyota to make a completely new car?
Edited by Lordbenny on Wednesday 3rd February 18:09
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