The Expanse

[chris watton]

glazbagun said:

chris watton said:

Have enjoyed the season, but I do feel that after a very strong first couple of episodes, it kind of fizzled out into soap opera territory. I think part of the problem is the guy who plays Marco Inaros, who hams up the character to pantomime villain territory.

And only one episode left, dammit.

I think some character types are just difficult to maintain for long periods of exposure. Holden suffered from this a bit while he played "reluctant leader" for so long. Everyone suffered it in S3 of Killing Eve!

Marco has done monstrous things and I thought some of the conversations with his son were wonderfully manipulative, but the plot dictates that he spends entire episodes on the bridge of his ship doing nothing. Malevolently.

That's hard to keep up and becomes harder the more you see him, especially when he has no foil, wheras Karal on Drummers ship has lots of interactions with an established family to demonstrate her nastiness. I fking hate her.

Naomi fixing a problem or Alex doing what he's told are easier roles to play because they don't need to convey a greater meaning.

Evil Philippa Georgiou suffered from this in Star Trek Discovery, too. She started off believably evil, but after two seasons you'd never be convinced the was a genocidal despot.

I thought his responses to loss and his private conversation with Naomi dehammed him a lot. I also liked the way his son wasn't hugging him back when he heard Naomi had escaped, lots of believable conflict going on there. The actor who plays her son has done a good job of a tough role IMO.

I think some scenes of Marco enjoying downtime with his loyalists would bolster his realism, plus give an opportunity to demonstrate leadership, but that would rob time from elsewhere. I would expect him to be more filled in in the books.

And I could live with all of that, but then Marco goes a step too far by dressing like a band member from the '80's pop combo Debarge!

[glazbagun]

chris watton said:

And I could live with all of that, but then Marco goes a step too far by dressing like a band member from the '80's pop combo Debarge!

Maybe that's just how really, really sinister people dress and we just never knew.

[SpudLink]

glazbagun said:

chris watton said:

And I could live with all of that, but then Marco goes a step too far by dressing like a band member from the '80's pop combo Debarge!

Maybe that's just how really, really sinister people dress and we just never knew.

I’ve thought for a while that he stands on the bridge like someone posing in a mid ‘80 pop video.
I don’t think he’s supposed to come across as downright nasty. He’s supposed to be someone his followers believe in and accept that whatever he asks them to do is for the good of their people. He does act like a moustache twirling villain on occasion, but I think that’s personal animosity towards Naomi.

[AlexS]

There's more than a hint of the Arthur C Clarke story Earthlight about the Expanse.

Earthlight features the Martian colony wanting to breakaway from Earth rule. Mars features a ship with superior technology, Earth has the benefit of having a moonbase with some fancy weaponry.

A key part of the story also features a spacewalk without suits, and a compelling description on how this would be successful

This book was published in 1955.

[rider73]

I've yet to catchup on a few eps so been avoiding anything about this thread - but i feel a question about i book i once read, or perhaps it was my imagination, i'm sure someone on here would know the storyline

.....earthman / astronaut /american gets to see the "great galactic reset" on the bridge of a far far advanced species - the great reset where some event sweeps through the galaxy killing all life?

if its not a book i herby patent the storyline.....

[SpudLink]

rider73 said:

I've yet to catchup on a few eps so been avoiding anything about this thread - but i feel a question about i book i once read, or perhaps it was my imagination, i'm sure someone on here would know the storyline

.....earthman / astronaut /american gets to see the "great galactic reset" on the bridge of a far far advanced species - the great reset where some event sweeps through the galaxy killing all life?

if its not a book i herby patent the storyline.....

I don’t know, but sounds good.
Actually, not unlike the origin of Galctus in Marvel comics. Survivor of the universe that existed before the Big Bang.
The film Quiet Earth also has a protagonist who survives a similar Great Reset event.

[motorizer]

Brilliant final episode... is it just me or do the space battles in this make star wars look a bit pedestrian? at least the ones with inside ship scenes and involving main characters.....even though they are usually over pretty quickly...

They managed to deal with the Cas Anvar issue about as well as they could have done, presumably a few minor reshoots needed with other cast members afterwwards

Edited by motorizer on Wednesday 3rd February 12:22

[glazbagun]

rider73 said:

I've yet to catchup on a few eps so been avoiding anything about this thread - but i feel a question about i book i once read, or perhaps it was my imagination, i'm sure someone on here would know the storyline

.....earthman / astronaut /american gets to see the "great galactic reset" on the bridge of a far far advanced species - the great reset where some event sweeps through the galaxy killing all life?

if its not a book i herby patent the storyline.....

Possibly the very first Revelation Space by Alasdair Reynolds?

Archaeologist finally finds ancient proof of another civilisation on a distant planet just in time to discover the reason why there's no other intelligent life in the galaxy. Dry compared to his later books, but also a unique feel when I discovered it- all sublight, beliavable phisics, etc.

[Catatafish]

motorizer said:

Brilliant final episode... is it just me or do the space battles in this make star wars look a bit pedestrian? at least the ones with inside ship scenes and involving main characters.....even though they are usually over pretty quickly...

They managed to deal with the Cas Anvar issue about as well as they could have done, presumably a few minor reshoots needed with other cast members afterwwards

Edited by motorizer on Wednesday 3rd February 12:22

Usually have to watch the battles a couple of times to take in all the details. Doesn't help that the free navy craft look quite similar to the rocinante.

The finale was intense. Overall the season was great but had about twice as much Naomi stuff as needed IMO.

I think it would have been nicer for Alex to 'retire' and go look after his son on Mars rather than stroke out

[rider73]

glazbagun said:

rider73 said:

I've yet to catchup on a few eps so been avoiding anything about this thread - but i feel a question about i book i once read, or perhaps it was my imagination, i'm sure someone on here would know the storyline

.....earthman / astronaut /american gets to see the "great galactic reset" on the bridge of a far far advanced species - the great reset where some event sweeps through the galaxy killing all life?

if its not a book i herby patent the storyline.....

Possibly the very first Revelation Space by Alasdair Reynolds?

Archaeologist finally finds ancient proof of another civilisation on a distant planet just in time to discover the reason why there's no other intelligent life in the galaxy. Dry compared to his later books, but also a unique feel when I discovered it- all sublight, beliavable phisics, etc.

yeah maybe - the author rings a bell - thanks for that, i'll google and see if its the one.



all caught up now on Expanse - excellent as alwats - 12 month to wait for "final" season.

[Catatafish]

rider73 said:

glazbagun said:

rider73 said:

I've yet to catchup on a few eps so been avoiding anything about this thread - but i feel a question about i book i once read, or perhaps it was my imagination, i'm sure someone on here would know the storyline

.....earthman / astronaut /american gets to see the "great galactic reset" on the bridge of a far far advanced species - the great reset where some event sweeps through the galaxy killing all life?

if its not a book i herby patent the storyline.....

Possibly the very first Revelation Space by Alasdair Reynolds?

Archaeologist finally finds ancient proof of another civilisation on a distant planet just in time to discover the reason why there's no other intelligent life in the galaxy. Dry compared to his later books, but also a unique feel when I discovered it- all sublight, beliavable phisics, etc.

yeah maybe - the author rings a bell - thanks for that, i'll google and see if its the one.



all caught up now on Expanse - excellent as alwats - 12 month to wait for "final" season.

Reynold's reveleation space series has machines that exterminate intelligent life. This is quite a common plot in scifi. Holden also sees an extermination event of some kind

Reynolds was also the first author that I discovered writing about the configuration of ships now used in the expanse i.e. ship like a tower with the 'conjoiner' engines at the bottom, constant 1G acceleration during flight, flip at mid point etc.

[glazbagun]

Question about the last episode of season 5.

At the end when the Martian ship goes through the ring everything pauses and a black/red energy sweeps through everything. Where have we seen that before? Holden experienced a blue light a few times, but he definitely also experienced the black/red thing. Was it in his vision of the destruction of the ring builders?

[AlexS]

glazbagun said:

Question about the last episode of season 5.

At the end when the Martian ship goes through the ring everything pauses and a black/red energy sweeps through everything. Where have we seen that before? Holden experienced a blue light a few times, but he definitely also experienced the black/red thing. Was it in his vision of the destruction of the ring builders?

The ship is being destroyed on its passage through the ring (hence the red surrounding the vessel as it disappears). The books do make it clearer that there are odd random unexplained disappearances of ships that fail to make it through the rings.

The swirling creatures are the ones that Holden saw at the end of Season 4, and were the ones feared by the creators of the rings.

[fuzzymonkey]

AlexS said:

glazbagun said:

Question about the last episode of season 5.

At the end when the Martian ship goes through the ring everything pauses and a black/red energy sweeps through everything. Where have we seen that before? Holden experienced a blue light a few times, but he definitely also experienced the black/red thing. Was it in his vision of the destruction of the ring builders?

The ship is being destroyed on its passage through the ring (hence the red surrounding the vessel as it disappears). The books do make it clearer that there are odd random unexplained disappearances of ships that fail to make it through the rings.

The swirling creatures are the ones that Holden saw at the end of Season 4, and were the ones feared by the creators of the rings.

Are they getting destroyed because they are up to no good and the gate knows or was it just random?

[glazbagun]

fuzzymonkey said:

AlexS said:

glazbagun said:

Question about the last episode of season 5.

At the end when the Martian ship goes through the ring everything pauses and a black/red energy sweeps through everything. Where have we seen that before? Holden experienced a blue light a few times, but he definitely also experienced the black/red thing. Was it in his vision of the destruction of the ring builders?

The ship is being destroyed on its passage through the ring (hence the red surrounding the vessel as it disappears). The books do make it clearer that there are odd random unexplained disappearances of ships that fail to make it through the rings.

The swirling creatures are the ones that Holden saw at the end of Season 4, and were the ones feared by the creators of the rings.

Are they getting destroyed because they are up to no good and the gate knows or was it just random?

I've been having a dig. In S5 E1 Holden tries to persuade Fred Johnson to destroy the protomolecule, showing him a siimulation of what the scientist from S4 saw when she came into contact with the artefact. Holden says that he's sensed them when traversing the gates and that he thinks it's making them angrier.

[Du1point8]

Was a bit of a weird they ain't following the books moment...

Killing off Alex, even though he doesn't die in any of the books... was a bit WTF...

Then I saw the reason...

Cas has had a series of sexual misconduct allegations raised against him and it all began in summer 2020 after season five wrapped production. This then prompted Alcon Entertainment to launch an investigation through an independent company, which the conclusion being Cas being fired

[motorizer]

Du1point8 said:

Was a bit of a weird they ain't following the books moment...

Killing off Alex, even though he doesn't die in any of the books... was a bit WTF...

Then I saw the reason...

Cas has had a series of sexual misconduct allegations raised against him and it all began in summer 2020 after season five wrapped production. This then prompted Alcon Entertainment to launch an investigation through an independent company, which the conclusion being Cas being fired

Yeah, I'd read about it at the time and had been wondering what they would do all year... better to kill him off than recast him at this stage IMO, the way they did it mean't they didn't need him in for the reshoots.

[DonkeyApple]

chris watton said:

And I could live with all of that, but then Marco goes a step too far by dressing like a band member from the '80's pop combo Debarge!

All the make up and moody faces does give the impression that he is building up to a dance off with Tony Manero.

Still hugely enjoying this but an hour of watching Naomi doing the same thing over and over as well as Marco doing likewise does weigh a bit heavy over the last couple of shows.

Holden still looks like a kid who's had his pushbike confiscated for not doing his homework on time rather than an interstellar saviour.

[nebpor]

It was the dullest season so far, unfortunately. All the earth-based stuff felt like filler - I don't see where it fits in the story except to give Amos something to do. Not saying I didn't enjoy it, but plodded along at times and just gets going in time for it to end!

[parabolica]

nebpor said:

It was the dullest season so far, unfortunately. All the earth-based stuff felt like filler - I don't see where it fits in the story except to give Amos something to do. Not saying I didn't enjoy it, but plodded along at times and just gets going in time for it to end!

I think the decision to make us wait week on week for new episodes is what has caused it to seem dull; every episode seemed to be 50% Naomi wallowing in pity, with 10% drummer, 10% Amos, 10% Bobbie and Alex etc. I'm planning to watch the entire series back to back over the weekend like I did with S1-4 and I expect it'll seem a lot more cohesive.

Edited by parabolica on Friday 5th February 16:04