Star Wars: The Last Jedi (CONTAINS SPOILERS)
Discussion
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The Fempire Stikes Back
http://fortune.com/2015/10/13/kathleen-kennedy-sta...
“People in powerful positions are not trying hard enough [to bring women into the industry] and there are an alarming number of women who are not able to get those jobs,” she explained.
One exception to that rule is the Walt Disney Company (DIS, -1.47%), which has been focusing on helping its female executives grow. It also helps that the company bought the Lucasfilm—half of its executive team is made up of women—in 2012.
The kicker? Two-thirds of the executive story team on the upcoming Star Wars movie is female. “I’m confident we will eventually hire a woman who directs a Stars Wars movie,” Kennedy added.”
satans worm said:
I’m still hoping the opening credits of the next film will do a ‘Dallas’ and we find out it was all just a dream and we can ignore the story of the last one 
Joking and 'feminist, virtue signalling, left-wing agenda' stuff aside, it does seem that the film leaves the story in a very strange place indeed. The themes of good, evil and redemption that underpinned the whole saga have been totally dispensed with. Johnson was so determined to "let the past die, kill it if you have to" that he left precious little behind to incentivise a returning audience, except perhaps to see if the writers/producers/directors will attempt to dig the franchise out of the hole he dumped it in or plough on regardless with what is now an aimless storyline.Seriously, what is left to answer and does anyone care? The only thing signposted was the slave kids who like Rey seemed to be full of the force with no effort on their part.
Star Wars Episode XI (sponsored by the X-Factor) - The Force is Strong with Everyone - you just gotta want it!
Any retcon now is going to appear clumsy (Rey - I was only kidding and you are the illegitimate grand-daughter of Obi-Wan Kenobi and Beru Lars
).Edited by r11co on Tuesday 9th January 11:43
southendpier said:
Maybe, Yes, No, Yes.
Guvernator said:
Why are the media still trying so hard to justify this film?
Why Disney’s Acquisitions Matter: Vertical Integration & Monopoly
https://youtu.be/u3LysuiOcL8Georg Rockall-Schmidt
Halb said:
Guvernator said:
Why are the media still trying so hard to justify this film?
Why Disney’s Acquisitions Matter: Vertical Integration & Monopoly
https://youtu.be/u3LysuiOcL8Georg Rockall-Schmidt
if they'd allowed leia to die it would have made quiet nice way to go, and at first thats how i thought it was going to go.
that notwithstanding i don't have much issue with her 'flying' towards the ship. So luke is powerful enough to lift an x-wing in the gravity of a planet, rey can lift tens or hundreds of large boulders, but we struggle to believe that leia could pull a body through space with no air resistance or gravity to worry about?
that notwithstanding i don't have much issue with her 'flying' towards the ship. So luke is powerful enough to lift an x-wing in the gravity of a planet, rey can lift tens or hundreds of large boulders, but we struggle to believe that leia could pull a body through space with no air resistance or gravity to worry about?
FredAstaire said:
if they'd allowed leia to die it would have made quiet nice way to go, and at first thats how i thought it was going to go.
that notwithstanding i don't have much issue with her 'flying' towards the ship. So luke is powerful enough to lift an x-wing in the gravity of a planet, rey can lift tens or hundreds of large boulders, but we struggle to believe that leia could pull a body through space with no air resistance or gravity to worry about?
In a nutshell, yes!that notwithstanding i don't have much issue with her 'flying' towards the ship. So luke is powerful enough to lift an x-wing in the gravity of a planet, rey can lift tens or hundreds of large boulders, but we struggle to believe that leia could pull a body through space with no air resistance or gravity to worry about?
FredAstaire said:
So luke is powerful enough to lift an x-wing in the gravity of a planet, rey can lift tens or hundreds of large boulders, but we struggle to believe that leia could pull a body through space with no air resistance or gravity to worry about?
Luke - trained in the force (oh and he failed to raise the X-wing as he was still in training).Rey - Mary Sue.
Leia - potentially force strong but never trained.
Seems that empowered females can just use the force while guys need to learn to use it.
Spotting the pattern yet?
ETA: When I read the wikipedia entry about the origins of the Mary Sue term it suddenly all makes sense.
wikipedia said:
A Mary Sue is an idealized and seemingly perfect fictional character. They can usually perform better at tasks than should be possible given the amount of training or experience. Often, this character is recognized as an author insert or wish fulfillment.
Rey is Kathleen Kennedy's (head of Disney's Lucasfilm division and lead Star Wars producer) author insert. Kennedy has a massive chip on her shoulder not necessarily linked to gender.So, why does it makes sense? Think about it - in TFA Rey subsumed the Han Solo character (pilot of Millennium Falcon with Chewbacca as sidekick). In TLJ she subsumed the Luke Skywalker character (most powerful living Jedi - despite never having trained as one). Next movie in the series I'm willing to predict she will subsume the Princess Leia character, taking over as leader of what's left once the First Order are defeated by the Rebellion or vice versa.
It's not about empowering women - it is about how one woman took over an empire (emotionally, figuratively and literally).
Edited by r11co on Wednesday 10th January 14:18
well leia has always felt disturbances in the force, so for me its not too much of a reach for her to force-pull herself towards the ship, even at the first time of trying as the force (in mass x acceleration sense) required would be negligible. It doesn't even need a continuous application of force, one small impulse would do it.
i liked the film, i reckon its one of the best.
i liked the film, i reckon its one of the best.
FredAstaire said:
well leia has always felt disturbances in the force, so for me its not too much of a reach for her to force-pull herself towards the ship, even at the first time of trying as the force (in mass x acceleration sense) required would be negligible. It doesn't even need a continuous application of force, one small impulse would do it.
i liked the film, i reckon its one of the best.
Leila did have the force and i understand that in the cannon she was part trained by Luke. If anyone is bothered about the books etc. i liked the film, i reckon its one of the best.
BUT She didn't just force pull into the ship. She also avoided being blown up, burnt and all the shrapnel tearing her to bits. Woke up, floated, then knocked on the door to get let back in - wouldnt fancy opening that door - ...then went into a coma, then was able to recover in a few moments pick up a gun and blast Poe to recover control of the ship.
Shame old Akbar didn't get the same treatment. Another male character kicked into touch.
If experience force users can "bubble float" then the Emperor wouldn't have died in ROTJ after being chucked over the walkway by Vadar. I expect some realism in a film about space wizards.
southendpier said:
Leila did have the force and i understand that in the cannon she was part trained by Luke. If anyone is bothered about the books etc.
BUT She didn't just force pull into the ship. She also avoided being blown up, burnt and all the shrapnel tearing her to bits. Woke up, floated, then knocked on the door to get let back in - wouldnt fancy opening that door - ...then went into a coma, then was able to recover in a few moments pick up a gun and blast Poe to recover control of the ship.
Shame old Akbar didn't get the same treatment. Another male character kicked into touch.
If experience force users can "bubble float" then the Emperor wouldn't have died in ROTJ after being chucked over the walkway by Vadar. I expect some realism in a film about space wizards.
All of the old books have been made non canon now, only the films are officially canon now, everything else is branded Legends.BUT She didn't just force pull into the ship. She also avoided being blown up, burnt and all the shrapnel tearing her to bits. Woke up, floated, then knocked on the door to get let back in - wouldnt fancy opening that door - ...then went into a coma, then was able to recover in a few moments pick up a gun and blast Poe to recover control of the ship.
Shame old Akbar didn't get the same treatment. Another male character kicked into touch.
If experience force users can "bubble float" then the Emperor wouldn't have died in ROTJ after being chucked over the walkway by Vadar. I expect some realism in a film about space wizards.
In the old comics I seem to remember Vader using a force bubble to survive when his ship blew up. http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Protection_bubble
The problem is that Leia doesn't appear to have had any training in the new universe (all the old stuff is not canon so didn't happen unless they say it did) yet can use an advanced force skill. The approach Disney are taking is that training isn't needed, and is actually harmful, hence why Rey is so good. Seems a bit arse backwards to me.
Im a huge Starwars fanboy, always have been, loved Rouge One, loved the Prequels, hated The last Jedi.
Its awful, from the 'Mum' joke at the start, to the stupid 'chase until they run out of fuel plot' to the god awful Canto Bright sub plot.
Killing off the only decent character (Snoke)? - They have pulled a Darth Maul again.
Its an extremely poor film.
I wish we had been able to see George Lucas original vision.
Its awful, from the 'Mum' joke at the start, to the stupid 'chase until they run out of fuel plot' to the god awful Canto Bright sub plot.
Killing off the only decent character (Snoke)? - They have pulled a Darth Maul again.
Its an extremely poor film.
I wish we had been able to see George Lucas original vision.
The idea that nobody needs training is rather the antithesis of the old films.
Personally I don't mind Leia's doing a POppins, since it's conceivably, it fits in with the internal logic, just that thanks to poor writing, we don't have the set-up. I don't think it's as bad as the many other problems the film has, like setting up something, only to destroy it moments later, and changing characterisation to rubbish the old guard asap, and of course, the bizarre 21st century jokes and references.
Man, if this film had been made by Kurtz and Kasdan alone,
Personally I don't mind Leia's doing a POppins, since it's conceivably, it fits in with the internal logic, just that thanks to poor writing, we don't have the set-up. I don't think it's as bad as the many other problems the film has, like setting up something, only to destroy it moments later, and changing characterisation to rubbish the old guard asap, and of course, the bizarre 21st century jokes and references.
Man, if this film had been made by Kurtz and Kasdan alone,
Princess Leia in isolation isn't too bad. OK it is because it's totally out of context BUT you could have possibly given it some leeway and accepted Luke might have given her some training before he went into exile or something, if the rest of the film was up to scratch or made sense. Unfortunately it doesn't so the Leia in space scene just becomes one more nail in the coffin.
Oh look another extra powerful female character doing the impossible. I really have no issue with strong female leads, a lot of my favourite cinema characters are female, Rippley, Sarah Connor, Clarice Starling, the Bride etc. However when a film goes out of it's way to make a gender statement as is obviously the case with this, we even have articles online stating this was one of Kennedys goals, to the point that it effects the cohesiveness of the film and the political statement overpowers good story telling, then I have an issue with it.
Oh look another extra powerful female character doing the impossible. I really have no issue with strong female leads, a lot of my favourite cinema characters are female, Rippley, Sarah Connor, Clarice Starling, the Bride etc. However when a film goes out of it's way to make a gender statement as is obviously the case with this, we even have articles online stating this was one of Kennedys goals, to the point that it effects the cohesiveness of the film and the political statement overpowers good story telling, then I have an issue with it.
Halb said:
The new films rip up all the books from the 90s, though it does make sense that Leia would have received some guidance from Luke.
Exactly, so they needed to at least acknowledge it in the films, just a one liner when she sends Rey off to find Luke, saying that Luke gave her training in the ways of the force, so Leia's confident he'll be able to train Rey. Anything would have been better than to just have her suddenly able to do it IMHO.Gassing Station | TV, Film, Video Streaming & Radio | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff