Three Girls - BBC Drama about Rochdale abuse
Discussion
Gee whizz. That was all a bit emotional. 
Normally I'm fairly easy going about barristers defending people but, whilst I appreciate it was a drama, the questioning of the girls was shameful. Obviously, the whole treatment of the girls was completely appalling.
The acting was fabulous though. Really, really good.
Normally I'm fairly easy going about barristers defending people but, whilst I appreciate it was a drama, the questioning of the girls was shameful. Obviously, the whole treatment of the girls was completely appalling.
The acting was fabulous though. Really, really good.
I found it gripping and disturbing viewing. .
The lead adult female roles were played by the usual exceptional actors along with the guy playing Holly's father .
Having dealt to a minor extent with those supposed to be looking after the vulnerable young in this country I have found within my local county council that they are still unprofessional, disorganized and operating a tick box mentality .
Many of the good people looking after the young and vulnerable leave that world due to frustration with the attitude of middle and senior managment of social services or child welfare services .
As for the Police ,it's a never ending round of failure and cover ups in Yorks,Lancs and GMP.
The lead adult female roles were played by the usual exceptional actors along with the guy playing Holly's father .
Having dealt to a minor extent with those supposed to be looking after the vulnerable young in this country I have found within my local county council that they are still unprofessional, disorganized and operating a tick box mentality .
Many of the good people looking after the young and vulnerable leave that world due to frustration with the attitude of middle and senior managment of social services or child welfare services .
As for the Police ,it's a never ending round of failure and cover ups in Yorks,Lancs and GMP.
"All but two of the Rochdale grooming gang have been released from prison - and four of them are mounting yet another taxpayer-funded legal bid to fight plans to deport them to Pakistan."
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greate...
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greate...
There were some important points raised by the programme that are relevant to many cases. Such as the role of alcohol, whether young people can really "consent" to stuff, the police and barristers bringing up related issues/activities to paint a bad picture of the victim, judgemental attitudes and the feeling that some people deserve more protection/justice than others. The final of those seemed to be key.
BlackLabel said:
"All but two of the Rochdale grooming gang have been released from prison - and four of them are mounting yet another taxpayer-funded legal bid to fight plans to deport them to Pakistan."
http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greate...
Theresa has stated in yesterdays manifesto that Britain will keep the European Human Rights Laws, so a good chance they will stay in the country.http://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greate...
Excellent drama. Tough, but worth it.
Finally worked out who the Mum of the two girls was - that big lass off 'You've Been Framed' a while back. Astonishing (Lisa Riley?).
I'd never realised the legal bit about naming the girl with the defendants as a co-conspirator, quite a shocking thing to happen and not sure how she could reconcile that later on.
The Maxine Peake bit giving evidence to the select committee mentions the need to 'believe' vulnerable young people and accept their testimony...all well and good, but at the other end of that don't you get the sensationalist stories about MP's abusing children/ritual murder etc? Difficult to balance the two.
Finally worked out who the Mum of the two girls was - that big lass off 'You've Been Framed' a while back. Astonishing (Lisa Riley?).
I'd never realised the legal bit about naming the girl with the defendants as a co-conspirator, quite a shocking thing to happen and not sure how she could reconcile that later on.
The Maxine Peake bit giving evidence to the select committee mentions the need to 'believe' vulnerable young people and accept their testimony...all well and good, but at the other end of that don't you get the sensationalist stories about MP's abusing children/ritual murder etc? Difficult to balance the two.
I am really sorry for the many, certainly the majority, of people from the Pakistani community who are as horrified by all this as the rest of us. They probably have reason to be more upset, getting tarnished by mere association. But there really does seem to be a problem specific to this community.
Somebody above says that it may stem from attitudes towards women in general in Pakistan and elsewhere. I would also suggest that the tradition of keeping young males and females so strictly separated, arranged marriages, and lack of sex/relationship education (at home and during education) plays a role too. Pakistani lads are naturally equipped with an equal amount of hormones as young whites, and when things get bottled up something's got to give.
They live in a western world where permissive attitudes to sex have resulted in an environment that must be near on impossible to cope with as a young Pakistani when you are expected yourself to live like a monk. This doesn't excuse the older ones, though. The catholic parallel is obvious. And if you happen to be gay ...
Victorian prudery was associated with staggering accounts of child prostitution. I am a great fan of Dickens, and some of his accounts of what was going on in 19th century London, both in his books and his journalism, are grim reading, even though he was limited in how explicit he could be. Thank heavens the majority of us have managed to achieve a liberated and mature attitude towards sexuality, and this is a reminder of how important it is to resist those from all cultures who would have it otherwise.
Somebody above says that it may stem from attitudes towards women in general in Pakistan and elsewhere. I would also suggest that the tradition of keeping young males and females so strictly separated, arranged marriages, and lack of sex/relationship education (at home and during education) plays a role too. Pakistani lads are naturally equipped with an equal amount of hormones as young whites, and when things get bottled up something's got to give.
They live in a western world where permissive attitudes to sex have resulted in an environment that must be near on impossible to cope with as a young Pakistani when you are expected yourself to live like a monk. This doesn't excuse the older ones, though. The catholic parallel is obvious. And if you happen to be gay ...
Victorian prudery was associated with staggering accounts of child prostitution. I am a great fan of Dickens, and some of his accounts of what was going on in 19th century London, both in his books and his journalism, are grim reading, even though he was limited in how explicit he could be. Thank heavens the majority of us have managed to achieve a liberated and mature attitude towards sexuality, and this is a reminder of how important it is to resist those from all cultures who would have it otherwise.
Roofless Toothless said:
arranged marriages,
This is a massive one.Unlike other Muslims such as Indians, where arranged marriages are nothing more than the kid at 25 being badgered into meeting multiple potential partners by the parents, in the hope they like one another, In old skool Pakistani cultures which many still practice in the UK, the parents decide at birth that the son/daughter will marry Uncle A's son/daughter and the kid has no choice whatsoever.
So kid grows up under the western lifestyle, then one day is on a plane to Pakistan and comes back with a stranger he or she may not even fancy and that is their life set for them.
Roofless Toothless said:
I am really sorry for the many, certainly the majority, of people from the Pakistani community who are as horrified by all this as the rest of us. They probably have reason to be more upset, getting tarnished by mere association. But there really does seem to be a problem specific to this community.
Somebody above says that it may stem from attitudes towards women in general in Pakistan and elsewhere. I would also suggest that the tradition of keeping young males and females so strictly separated, arranged marriages, and lack of sex/relationship education (at home and during education) plays a role too. Pakistani lads are naturally equipped with an equal amount of hormones as young whites, and when things get bottled up something's got to give.
They live in a western world where permissive attitudes to sex have resulted in an environment that must be near on impossible to cope with as a young Pakistani when you are expected yourself to live like a monk. This doesn't excuse the older ones, though. The catholic parallel is obvious. And if you happen to be gay ...
Victorian prudery was associated with staggering accounts of child prostitution. I am a great fan of Dickens, and some of his accounts of what was going on in 19th century London, both in his books and his journalism, are grim reading, even though he was limited in how explicit he could be. Thank heavens the majority of us have managed to achieve a liberated and mature attitude towards sexuality, and this is a reminder of how important it is to resist those from all cultures who would have it otherwise.
im sorry but you can excuse them as much as you want but they are anally raping 12 year old girls its fSomebody above says that it may stem from attitudes towards women in general in Pakistan and elsewhere. I would also suggest that the tradition of keeping young males and females so strictly separated, arranged marriages, and lack of sex/relationship education (at home and during education) plays a role too. Pakistani lads are naturally equipped with an equal amount of hormones as young whites, and when things get bottled up something's got to give.
They live in a western world where permissive attitudes to sex have resulted in an environment that must be near on impossible to cope with as a young Pakistani when you are expected yourself to live like a monk. This doesn't excuse the older ones, though. The catholic parallel is obvious. And if you happen to be gay ...
Victorian prudery was associated with staggering accounts of child prostitution. I am a great fan of Dickens, and some of his accounts of what was going on in 19th century London, both in his books and his journalism, are grim reading, even though he was limited in how explicit he could be. Thank heavens the majority of us have managed to achieve a liberated and mature attitude towards sexuality, and this is a reminder of how important it is to resist those from all cultures who would have it otherwise.
k all to do with permissive Western attitudes to sex or raging hormones, I had raging hormones but I wasn't grooming children, filthy bds, no more no less and they fact they are not being hounded out of their own "communities" tells me its ok as the girls were "up for it", I bet most of the offenders will still be married thanks to that 3rd world religionwell im struggling to think of any reason that would make anyone want to rape children, although I believe it is stlll very prevalent in India/Pakistan, some even claim the girls ask for it by being out unaccompanied
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/delhi...
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/delhi...
andymc said:
well im struggling to think of any reason that would make anyone want to rape children, although I believe it is stlll very prevalent in India/Pakistan, some even claim the girls ask for it by being out unaccompanied
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/delhi...
Unthinkable things happen all over the world, these guys here have every advantage this country offers, why is it nearly ALWAYS Pakistani males who are doing this? Yes, you may be able to find some names from other communities and Pakistanis often try to muddy the waters by bringing other Indian communities into it, the fact is Hindu and Sikhs "generally" don't groom 12 year olds, bomb people or marry their cousins!! http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/delhi...
Watched all 3 episodes last night and found it very emotional and certainly a tough watch. The acting was superb but the fact that this was all based in fact is what was most difficult to stomach. I don't think I've seen much to bring me to tears as this did. The fact that one of the girls was portrayed as perpetrator was despicable and it was truly shocking that the Police allowed these offences to continue for so long.
Casa1862 said:
why is it nearly ALWAYS Pakistani males who are doing this?
It is important to remember that Pakistani males are mainly doing 'this type' of crime, but abuse happens everywhere. The current ongoing unravelling of child abuse in the football world (Operation Hydrant) is yet the latest scandal. why Muslim men, because Muslim communities usually live in the lowest income places. i also think the mosques and community give a lot of money into the area, which is clear the government seems to have wiped there hands of, both labour and the Tories. The abuse happens because in the eyes of the state these children are worthless and no value.
t is deep rooted issues that basically these muslim men have taken advantage of , and seems very clear the state has/is/was doing not a lot to solve it long term. i guarantee this will keep happening.
t is deep rooted issues that basically these muslim men have taken advantage of , and seems very clear the state has/is/was doing not a lot to solve it long term. i guarantee this will keep happening.
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