Patrick Stewart to return as Picard
Discussion
(IMHO) its balls - watching TNG on PICK TV could not be more different, its just this has the same actors but not the same Star Trek (whereas Discovery had neither) , lets face it the world wasnt great when OS & TNG was on the air originally, but it subtly dealt with issues with giving us hope that we are/will be better - in essence that is why ST was so successful and has such a long legacy and why it was watched bazillion of times and people wanted to be assocaited with it and enjoy it , watch it as a kid, watch it with your kids, all good..... not this new tripe we are dealt with of "hard realities" with a shiny gloss of lens flare and music and throw in a nostalgic lazy lines and music to go with it to tie it in with the original.
Producers and writers should stop being cowards and create a new SciFi show with these themes if you want them, instead of wrecking an exising franchise just to get immediate easy money and viewing figures.
Producers and writers should stop being cowards and create a new SciFi show with these themes if you want them, instead of wrecking an exising franchise just to get immediate easy money and viewing figures.
I laughed that Patrick Stewart is now a "guest star" in his own show.
They writers cant wait to ditch him and make a poor mans Expanse trading on the Star Trek name to get traction.
You can also start to see where the huge lack of budget starts to creep in, holographic crew of the same guy, picards chateau as a holodeck in the ship, reads "we paid a lot to make this set for the first few episodes so well get our moneys worth out of it" even though its a bit daft when he was a serving officer for over 40 years in starfleet so would be used to a standard ship cabin.
Also, why is it everywhere he goes hes getting shouted and sworn at by female officers, did he piss in their tea (earl grey, cold, pissy).
Oh and my god the Nihilism and trying to shoehorn in class and poverty issues. Its the 24th century, earth has abandoned poverty, war disease etc, but we have to have a sermon about how picard lives in a chateau but his ex officer lives in a shack by a rock (yes i know its a special star trek rock\location). By this time she could live anywhere, do other work, its not like you hire people, people work to better themselves in this time, so shes just wading in self loathing for 15 years then....and its Picard.s fault???......
Oh and Seven of nine being a nod and a wink to her being gay now too....because that's another box ticked.
Its so frustrating seeing star trek turned into the antithesis of what it was to be edgy, by people who dont have the clout to get their own show started from the ground so have to hijack a better show and bastardise it.
So much of this now in film and tv.
anyway...its only telly.
They writers cant wait to ditch him and make a poor mans Expanse trading on the Star Trek name to get traction.
You can also start to see where the huge lack of budget starts to creep in, holographic crew of the same guy, picards chateau as a holodeck in the ship, reads "we paid a lot to make this set for the first few episodes so well get our moneys worth out of it" even though its a bit daft when he was a serving officer for over 40 years in starfleet so would be used to a standard ship cabin.
Also, why is it everywhere he goes hes getting shouted and sworn at by female officers, did he piss in their tea (earl grey, cold, pissy).
Oh and my god the Nihilism and trying to shoehorn in class and poverty issues. Its the 24th century, earth has abandoned poverty, war disease etc, but we have to have a sermon about how picard lives in a chateau but his ex officer lives in a shack by a rock (yes i know its a special star trek rock\location). By this time she could live anywhere, do other work, its not like you hire people, people work to better themselves in this time, so shes just wading in self loathing for 15 years then....and its Picard.s fault???......
Oh and Seven of nine being a nod and a wink to her being gay now too....because that's another box ticked.
Its so frustrating seeing star trek turned into the antithesis of what it was to be edgy, by people who dont have the clout to get their own show started from the ground so have to hijack a better show and bastardise it.
So much of this now in film and tv.
anyway...its only telly.
Rick_1138 said:
I laughed that Patrick Stewart is now a "guest star" in his own show.
They writers cant wait to ditch him and make a poor mans Expanse trading on the Star Trek name to get traction.
You can also start to see where the huge lack of budget starts to creep in, holographic crew of the same guy, picards chateau as a holodeck in the ship, reads "we paid a lot to make this set for the first few episodes so well get our moneys worth out of it" even though its a bit daft when he was a serving officer for over 40 years in starfleet so would be used to a standard ship cabin.
Also, why is it everywhere he goes hes getting shouted and sworn at by female officers, did he piss in their tea (earl grey, cold, pissy).
Oh and my god the Nihilism and trying to shoehorn in class and poverty issues. Its the 24th century, earth has abandoned poverty, war disease etc, but we have to have a sermon about how picard lives in a chateau but his ex officer lives in a shack by a rock (yes i know its a special star trek rock\location). By this time she could live anywhere, do other work, its not like you hire people, people work to better themselves in this time, so shes just wading in self loathing for 15 years then....and its Picard.s fault???......
Oh and Seven of nine being a nod and a wink to her being gay now too....because that's another box ticked.
Its so frustrating seeing star trek turned into the antithesis of what it was to be edgy, by people who dont have the clout to get their own show started from the ground so have to hijack a better show and bastardise it.
So much of this now in film and tv.
anyway...its only telly.
I heard that cash has been syphoned off the Picard series to prop up chaotic production of Discovery. They have to pay off 8000 fired producers.They writers cant wait to ditch him and make a poor mans Expanse trading on the Star Trek name to get traction.
You can also start to see where the huge lack of budget starts to creep in, holographic crew of the same guy, picards chateau as a holodeck in the ship, reads "we paid a lot to make this set for the first few episodes so well get our moneys worth out of it" even though its a bit daft when he was a serving officer for over 40 years in starfleet so would be used to a standard ship cabin.
Also, why is it everywhere he goes hes getting shouted and sworn at by female officers, did he piss in their tea (earl grey, cold, pissy).
Oh and my god the Nihilism and trying to shoehorn in class and poverty issues. Its the 24th century, earth has abandoned poverty, war disease etc, but we have to have a sermon about how picard lives in a chateau but his ex officer lives in a shack by a rock (yes i know its a special star trek rock\location). By this time she could live anywhere, do other work, its not like you hire people, people work to better themselves in this time, so shes just wading in self loathing for 15 years then....and its Picard.s fault???......
Oh and Seven of nine being a nod and a wink to her being gay now too....because that's another box ticked.
Its so frustrating seeing star trek turned into the antithesis of what it was to be edgy, by people who dont have the clout to get their own show started from the ground so have to hijack a better show and bastardise it.
So much of this now in film and tv.
anyway...its only telly.
This latest episode seemed a constant stream of exposition, which would be ok if the back stories and premise rammed into your face had something interesting. So far it's incredibly generic and cliched. Imagine if you read that dialogue without the shiny lights
It's guardians of the galaxy and starwars blended together and mixed with a bit of Stewart vanity project. WTF was his french pirate mentalist character about? Is that really how to conduct undercover operations? haha
Alex said:
I'm beginning to think it's not actually very good. I'm still enjoying it, but the writing is lazy, the characters stereotyped and wafer thin, and it's full of cliches and exposition.
I'm tending to agree. I hesitate to say it doesn't feel very Star Trek because I don't want to be one of those guys, but it just doesn't. The Whiskey straight up is about the oldest cliche in the book.
rider73 said:
(IMHO) its balls - watching TNG on PICK TV could not be more different, its just this has the same actors but not the same Star Trek (whereas Discovery had neither)
Amen, I've been watching TNG recently and as cheesy as much of it now is, it feels like Star Trek. Picard is a terrible letdown - I even forgot today was new episode day, it's been that bad. I'll watch it regardless, but it's a waste of money and opportunity.
Sorry to be the voice of descent but I'm enjoying it. OK some of the tone is definitely a bit off which makes it not feel like Trek sometimes but it's not enough that it makes me fly into a Trekkie nerd rage.
I'm enjoying it for what it is, the story has me hooked with enough nods to previous stuff to please my nostalgia and Patrick Stewart is always good to watch.
I'm enjoying it for what it is, the story has me hooked with enough nods to previous stuff to please my nostalgia and Patrick Stewart is always good to watch.
missus (massive Patrick Stewart and ST and STNG fan) and I have been trying to watch this, can't say either of us impressed - writing seems lazy and ponderous. The main bug bear we have with it - the constant musac behind the dialogue is just so off putting. Seems to be incredibly loud in the mix, and there for no discernible reason …...anyone else think the same?
Guvernator said:
Sorry to be the voice of descent but I'm enjoying it. OK some of the tone is definitely a bit off which makes it not feel like Trek sometimes but it's not enough that it makes me fly into a Trekkie nerd rage.
I'm enjoying it for what it is, the story has me hooked with enough nods to previous stuff to please my nostalgia and Patrick Stewart is always good to watch.
Your not aloneI'm enjoying it for what it is, the story has me hooked with enough nods to previous stuff to please my nostalgia and Patrick Stewart is always good to watch.
I watched some 'classic' TNG a few days back and now it is just cheesy and often cringe inducing. In fact there are only a few episodes I can happily re-watch these days ('The Inner Light' is still one of the best TV episodes of any show I have ever watched)
Picard has just enough call backs while giving a new mystery to delve into. It's not ground breaking, but it's enjoyable
I’ve been cleansing my palate with S4 of DS9. I never took to it back in the 90s. Enjoying it hugely now. I suspect writing a story to wrap up in 45 minutes is vastly different to trying to stretch 1 story 1 story over 10x45 minutes...
I think what was said above is the case...both the bolting on ST to a sci fi idea, AND creating something where Picard himself can conceivably go and the audience has already invested into the characters for it to carry on without him.
I think what was said above is the case...both the bolting on ST to a sci fi idea, AND creating something where Picard himself can conceivably go and the audience has already invested into the characters for it to carry on without him.
I'm still enjoying it. I've watched every ST series there's been except Enterprise (watched some episodes when it was current, but never went back to invest the time to watch it all). Also watched all the movies.
Go back and watch any of them now and there's no end to the cheese, plot holes, and convenient storytelling.
I'm not taking Picard seriously, but am definitely enjoying it. I'd never take anything from earlier series seriously either. It's Star Trek, pure simple cheesy story telling replete with convenient plot solutions.
I think it's just perceived as cool to gas about negatives these days when discussing anything, or criticise stuff because it's not what you wanted or expected. Some critique is always healthy, but if you find something isn't doing it for you then just move on. There's never been so much content to choose from.
Stewart himself said on many occasions he didn't want to return to the Picard character or ST fold unless it was to do something different. This is different, but still with hundreds of nods back to previous ST stories and characters. I've rewatched two of the TNG movies, a few TNG episodes, and maybe 6-8 Voyager episodes to refresh my memory on certain aspects in ST lore and history. Reality is none of them would work as a TV piece or series nowadays. Any critique levelled at Picard can just as easily be levelled at ST stuff done at any point in the last 60 years.
Go back and watch any of them now and there's no end to the cheese, plot holes, and convenient storytelling.
I'm not taking Picard seriously, but am definitely enjoying it. I'd never take anything from earlier series seriously either. It's Star Trek, pure simple cheesy story telling replete with convenient plot solutions.
I think it's just perceived as cool to gas about negatives these days when discussing anything, or criticise stuff because it's not what you wanted or expected. Some critique is always healthy, but if you find something isn't doing it for you then just move on. There's never been so much content to choose from.
Stewart himself said on many occasions he didn't want to return to the Picard character or ST fold unless it was to do something different. This is different, but still with hundreds of nods back to previous ST stories and characters. I've rewatched two of the TNG movies, a few TNG episodes, and maybe 6-8 Voyager episodes to refresh my memory on certain aspects in ST lore and history. Reality is none of them would work as a TV piece or series nowadays. Any critique levelled at Picard can just as easily be levelled at ST stuff done at any point in the last 60 years.
I don't think anyone is suggesting ST as was would work if it was made today like that - times change blablabla. There's not many modern tv series I can watch...and I realise I'm watching Picard because its ST and has PS in it, not because its a new scifi series that I'm really enjoying. Maybe I just prefer less angsty, serious and graphically violent "while ticking all demographics" tv.
The only nods to ST of old I can see are in the terminology used. Apart from that, it could be anything. And frankly, the story is really getting quite slow. And the 5th episode felt pointless.
Spending the first half of the season in search of Maddox only to kill him off 10 minutes after they get him aboard...
The only nods to ST of old I can see are in the terminology used. Apart from that, it could be anything. And frankly, the story is really getting quite slow. And the 5th episode felt pointless.
Spending the first half of the season in search of Maddox only to kill him off 10 minutes after they get him aboard...
k?????????????????Flip Martian said:
The only nods to ST of old I can see are in the terminology used. Apart from that, it could be anything. And frankly, the story is really getting quite slow. And the 5th episode felt pointless.
I'll freely admit to being cursed to seeing instant detail in everything I throw my eyes onto, but go back to ep.5 and watch some of the clips in Stardust City. Names of previous characters and entertainment from DS9 and TNG prominently on display absolutely everywhere, and previous characters and species being name dropped. That drink used to knock Maddox out was offered to Kirk in the TOS and was a regular thing in DS9 (can't remember it's name). And when Seven is back on the ship the theme tune from Voyager features briefly. Every episode has been the same - rammed full of nods and references for the nerds to obsess over.Corso Marche said:
I'll freely admit to being cursed to seeing instant detail in everything I throw my eyes onto, but go back to ep.5 and watch some of the clips in Stardust City. Names of previous characters and entertainment from DS9 and TNG prominently on display absolutely everywhere, and previous characters and species being name dropped. That drink used to knock Maddox out was offered to Kirk in the TOS and was a regular thing in DS9 (can't remember it's name). And when Seven is back on the ship the theme tune from Voyager features briefly. Every episode has been the same - rammed full of nods and references for the nerds to obsess over.
Tranya. From the Corbomite Manoeuver. I’ve watched a lot of Netflix and Amazon series over the last couple of years and a lot of them are the elongation of a very simple story into ten episodes, with poor writing and second rate actors. Like having a biscuit for your Sunday lunch.
The series story arcs we take for granted now started with Buffy. Before that, a two parter was a big deal. It’s easy to underestimate the difficulty in writing a story with a strong moral message, a beginning middle and end, some action, and good dialogue that fits into 43 minutes.
But I’ve been watching a bit of TNG recently and I’ve been really impressed with it compared to modern writing. I strongly suspect that without PS it might have missed more than it hit (I need to watch some DS9 pre the arc-series to compare). But IMO TNG stands up well (and, different subject, but TOS S1 and S2 is amazing for TV that is 50+ years old).
So, this series: I am enjoying a bit of ST freed from the constraints of the Federation and Star Fleet. It’s interesting to see what happens in civilian life and the half world between that and Star Fleet. DS9 touched on this, but never hit it hard.
But ... PS is though a bit past his best; unfortunately. The character has been diluted heavily by the Romulan evac (he is not the Captain/Admiral who commands instant authority; if anything Picard has become a somewhat pitiable figure at ST HQ), and PS looks, well, frail. In TNG even as a small physical presence he dominates a scene. But not so much now. It’s partly I think an age thing and partly a writing thing: his scenes aren’t written with him as a captain or leader (the tv interview was both gripping and uncomfortable to watch, because it just wasn’t Captain Picard - it was what Picard had become, which is both inevitable and unwelcome). I have a feeling that he is fulfilling a linking task, joining an old world and it’s fans to a new one.
I’ll continue though, because with the exception of Enterprise, I’ve warmed to every ST series despite initially being a bit meh about it.
frisbee said:
It's great.
And the nerd rage is the cherry on top!
This.And the nerd rage is the cherry on top!
It's enjoyable. A little slow perhaps but it's holding my interest. There are a few niggles like the Chateau now appearing as a "holodeck" within the ship is a lazy set design cop out, which is a shame as I quite like the look of the rest of the ship including the rather utilitarian bridge area. I guess we now have 7 along as the murderous killing machine. "Bourbon straight up" Ooh she's hard! A bit stale perhaps but we get the picture.
A special thanks to everyone who contributes to this thread to tell us they stopped watching after three nano seconds of episode one. Well done. And thanks for letting us know. Really...
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