Obi Wan Kenobi Disney+

[Flip Martian]

MBBlat said:

At least half of those aren’t plotholes. I know it’s fashionable to hate on Disney, but this looks like desperation.

Is it? I don’t give 2 hoots about Disney either way. I enjoyed Mandalorian and Boba Fett. While they won’t win awards for best screenplays, OWK was badly written tripe in comparison.

[rider73]

Flip Martian said:

MBBlat said:

At least half of those aren’t plotholes. I know it’s fashionable to hate on Disney, but this looks like desperation.

Is it? I don’t give 2 hoots about Disney either way. I enjoyed Mandalorian and Boba Fett. While they won’t win awards for best screenplays, OWK was badly written tripe in comparison.

yeah that bs - we enjoy lots of Disney stuff in our household, and some SW content is excellent, like the animated series...

[Flip Martian]

I just asked a SW fan - who LOVED OWK - how it was that being run through with a lightsaber was no longer fatal, but did Liam Neeson in...

"I can only assume that Qui Gon's wound involved his heart and lungs rather than just his stomach. Lightsaber wounds cauterise the flesh so depending on the site of the injury they may be survivable".

I then pointed out 2 characters literally had big holes through their bellies...

"Darth Maul survived being cut in half. There is a canon precedent in Knights Of The Old Republic for dark side Force users to use their hate to survive cataclysmic injuries. Look at what Anakin/ Vader survived."

And apparently Vader left Reva alive so she would be beholden to him.

I did laugh.

[DanL]

[Scabutz]

Flip Martian said:

I just asked a SW fan - who LOVED OWK - how it was that being run through with a lightsaber was no longer fatal, but did Liam Neeson in...

"I can only assume that Qui Gon's wound involved his heart and lungs rather than just his stomach. Lightsaber wounds cauterise the flesh so depending on the site of the injury they may be survivable".

I then pointed out 2 characters literally had big holes through their bellies...

"Darth Maul survived being cut in half. There is a canon precedent in Knights Of The Old Republic for dark side Force users to use their hate to survive cataclysmic injuries. Look at what Anakin/ Vader survived."

And apparently Vader left Reva alive so she would be beholden to him.

I did laugh.

Your mate needs a shag.

[AlexC1981]

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

[Flip Martian]

DanL said:

I have said the same many times...

[Flip Martian]

Scabutz said:

Your mate needs a shag.

Actually yeah, she probably does.

[DoctorX]

AlexC1981 said:

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

Agreed. A bit of entertaining nonsense not worth picking holes in. It’s not like the originals were perfect in every sense.

[lambosagogo]

AlexC1981 said:

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

Ummm. I like both an exhilarating story etc and an intelligent narrative.....they don't have to be mutually exclusive and particularly not when you have a bottomless pile of cash to throw at writers and directors and already have highly regarded actors signed up.

Unfortunately this series had neither. I can't get excited by the same basic structure week on week - Obiwan rescues Leia, omg they are trapped, phew someone saved them, tune in next week for the same. And nor could I get past the "wait, hang on, that makes no sense" issues.

[Flip Martian]

AlexC1981 said:

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

I'm not a big SW fan and have no knowledge of detailed canon, other than what was in the original 3 films. All I want really is a good story, well told. When stuff happens that jars with that, like "why did they do THAT?" or "that makes no sense", that takes me out of the story. Good storytelling - whether in a book, or on film - has you engrossed. That has always been the art of good story telling.

Bad storytelling does not.

Edited by Flip Martian on Thursday 30th June 09:51

[robemcdonald]

Star Wars fans are so beaten down by the unleavened diet of ste (with a few notable exceptions) that we have been served up over the course of the thirty or so years. Expectations… well there aren’t really. For me the last straw was really “the last Jedi” when the film makers stopped caring, so did I.
As a result I no longer care about canon or trying to establish some sort of framework that makes sense of what characters can and can’t do. (Things I think are extremely important in Star Trek though)
Everything that happens is just to move the plot forward to the next beat.
Kenobi wasn’t a well written show, some elements were laughably bad in fact, but overall it was enjoyable and had the best lightsaber duel since ROTJ.

[ch37]

I went to see Jurassic World: Dominion the other night and the feel of that in terms of plot, managing of peril and pure laziness is remarkably similar to Obi Wan.

It's always been a thing in mainstream blockbuster movies to an extent, and for movies like Fast and Furious it pretty much works, in fact I'd argue that the audience are there specifically to enjoy entirely bonkers and unlikely escapes/moments/set pieces.

Having watched all the JP movies recently the escalating trend of that over the years is clear to see, but JW3 really is on another level entirely. We're in fully dumbed-down territory now.

I get the 'it's just escapism' argument, I really do, but it's perfectly possible to be both fun popcorn escapism and not mug us off with completely implausible rubbish.

Edited by ch37 on Thursday 30th June 11:43

[take-good-care-of-the-forest-dewey]

Topgun 2 being the perfect example... About a daft and ridiculous plot as possible... But still utterly brilliant. Because at least once the daft premise is established, it's a least internally consis3.

[ch37]

take-good-care-of-the-forest-dewey said:

Topgun 2 being the perfect example... About a daft and ridiculous plot as possible... But still utterly brilliant. Because at least once the daft premise is established, it's a least internally consis3.

Yep, daft but absolutely not lazy in so much as it does respect the intelligence of the audience.

[Lucas Ayde]

AlexC1981 said:

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

Obi Wan didn't exactly score high on either criteria.

It was passable, no more, which for a story/character with such massive potential is a real let down.

[Jader1973]

ch37 said:

take-good-care-of-the-forest-dewey said:

Topgun 2 being the perfect example... About a daft and ridiculous plot as possible... But still utterly brilliant. Because at least once the daft premise is established, it's a least internally consis3.

Yep, daft but absolutely not lazy in so much as it does respect the intelligence of the audience.

If the audience are Epsilon-Minus Semi-morons.

TG Maverick is utter dross.

[ch37]

Jader1973 said:

If the audience are Epsilon-Minus Semi-morons.

TG Maverick is utter dross.

In your opinion of course, a view not shared by the vast, vast majority of those who have watched it based on any available metric you care to look at.

[lambosagogo]

Lucas Ayde said:

It was passable, no more, which for a story/character with such massive potential is a real let down.

Agreed. Obiwan had such potential - an interesting character who had been through so much, a very good actor who could be very compelling in the role and an opportunity to fill in some blanks between the prequels and the originals.

It was just disappointing from the first episode - the basic premise of the plot / story was so shonky.

[AlexC1981]

lambosagogo said:

AlexC1981 said:

It seems like there are two kinds of watchers. People who enjoy an exhilarating story, the emotions, acting, and the interactions between characters.

The second type are more interested in the details of the plot, canon and everything proceeding in a logical manner to make an intelligent narrative..

I wonder if it's a left brain/right brain thing.

Ummm. I like both an exhilarating story etc and an intelligent narrative.....they don't have to be mutually exclusive and particularly not when you have a bottomless pile of cash to throw at writers and directors and already have highly regarded actors signed up.

Unfortunately this series had neither. I can't get excited by the same basic structure week on week - Obiwan rescues Leia, omg they are trapped, phew someone saved them, tune in next week for the same. And nor could I get past the "wait, hang on, that makes no sense" issues.

Yes both is of course better, but I think it is fair to say that some people lean more in one direction than the other. Look at the diversity of opinion we have here.

I think the series scores well for the first type, particularly the final episode. Looking at the story in its most basic form, we have the most iconic sci-fi bad guy ever, a captured princess, a grizzled old veteran out to redeem himself, and a traumatized child turned evil. Sounds like some good basic ingredients for an entertaining story.

My comment was supposed to read as neutral either way, I didn't mean to put the second full stop after my second paragraph, which gives a different implication!