The Damned United
Discussion
Spotted a thread on this on a Leeds board I visit. Quite a lot of errors in the film, shown below. I actually really enjoyed it despite all the errors, but somehow get the feeling that this will leave a lot of people thinking it was other than a dramatisation.
The errors as stated elsewhere...
Factual errors: It is implied in the film that Brian Clough never managed Brighton & Hove Albion, but he did manage the club alongside Peter Taylor for most of the 1973-4 season. The team finished 19th this season.
Factual errors: In the montage of footage of actual matches showing Derby's rise to the Second Division championship in 1968-69, one of the games is against Everton. Everton haven't played in the Second Divison since 1953-54. The footage is from 1969-70 when both were in Division One. Everton won the league that season.
Factual errors: Derby County's rise up the Second Division table in 1968-69 is cleverly shown by superimposing a league table that clocks up points over a montage of footage of their games. However, the table almost always clocks up two points at a time. Derby drew a number of games over the season so the table should have risen by only a single point on occasion.
Factual errors: An action scene depicts the Leeds side conceding a goal to Luton Town and post match scenes that depict Luton players celebrating a victory with a caption saying Leeds 0 Luton 1. While the match is correctly portrayed as the game that precipitated the sacking of Brian Clough the actual result was a 1-1 draw.
Factual errors: The 3rd round F.A Cup tie between Leeds and Derby on the 27th of January 1968 depicted in the movie was played in Leeds, not in Derby, making the entire 'Brian cleans up the Baseball Ground' sequence fictional.
Factual errors: The 'snub' of Clough by Don Revie probably never happened as it has never been mentioned by Clough in any of his memoirs and Revie's son Duncan feels it would have been completely out of character for his father to do such a thing.
Factual errors: The commentator introduces Leeds as the League champions before the 27.01.68 game, but Manchester United were the reigning champions at the time.
Factual errors: The 27.01.68 game was won fairly by Leeds with goals by Jack Charlton and Peter Lorimer, not Clarke & a Lorimer penalty as the film claims.
Factual errors: The impression is given that Roy McFarland was injured and substituted in the 27.01.68 game when he wasn't and played the whole match.
Factual errors: The dive by Billy Bremner to gain the penalty in the 27.01.68 game never happened.
Anachronisms: Allan Clarke is named as a scorer in the 27.01.68 game but he didn't become a Leeds player until 1969.
Factual errors: The player described as Clarke in the 27.01.68 game wears 3 on his back while Clarke usually wore the number 8 when he eventually joined Leeds United
Anachronisms: Sam Longson says that Dave MacKay has "broken more bones than Evel the Knievel." It's unlikely in 1968 Longson would have known about him as Evel Knievel only became popular in Britain in the mid 1970s.
Revealing mistakes: When Derby are celebrating winning the Second Division title, the crowd are chanting "Glory, Glory Leeds United".
Factual errors: A game against Leeds is described as being four days before the 1973 European Cup semi final in Turin versus Juventus. Derby actually played Arsenal on that particular Saturday. The events shown in that game are completely false and notice that no score for that game is shown.
Factual errors: The commentator says that Derby deposed Leeds as League Champions in 1972, but Arsenal were the title holders before Derby.
Factual errors: The tie against Leeds shows Derby being so badly fouled by the Leeds players they have to field reserves against Juventus. While Derby did suffer some injuries in the tie against Leeds that year, it actually came before their quarter-final match against Spartak Trnava, which Derby still won despite missing some key players. Moreover, the injuries were not as serious as implied in the film, and all the injured players had recovered by the time of the eventual 3-1 defeat by Juventus, which was with a full-strength Derby squad.
Factual errors: After being beaten by the Italians, Clough blames the defeat on Leeds. In reality Clough felt that Juventus somehow influenced the referee to favour their side and afterwards berated not Leeds, but Juventus.
Factual errors: Dave Mackay is named on the team sheet for the fictional game against Leeds prior to the Juventus game in 1973 and is the only Derby player not to support Clough's reinstatement as manager. In reality Mackay had left Derby County in 1971. Alan Hinton is also named as in the team for the Leeds game, but he was injured at the time.
Factual errors: When Clough is insulting the Leeds players about their style of play they don't respond, but in truth they did defend themselves against his accusations.
Factual errors: Clough is shown signing Duncan Mackenzie after the Charity shield game, but Duncan was signed before the season started and played in the game as a substitute.
Factual errors: When Billy Bremner was punished after his sending off in the Charity Shield he was represented by Maurice Lindley, not Brian Clough. Kevin Keegan who was also at the hearing said that Bremner, who is shown as belligerently unrepentant in the film apologized to him and was close to tears after the sending off
Factual errors: After his sacking, Clough and Revie appeared on a Yorkshire TV Calendar special 'Goodbye Mr Clough'. Revie's participation was not a surprise to Clough as the movie claims. The depiction of it in 'The Damned United' bears only a passing resemblance to reality with the writers inventing most of what was shown on screen. Most notably, the 27.01.68 'snub' was not mentioned by Clough.
Factual errors: Brian Clough is shown smoking in the film. His family maintain that he never took up the habit.
Errors made by characters (possibly deliberate errors by the filmmakers): Duncan McKenzie is depicted as an idiot in "The Damned United' when in reality he was - and still is - an articulate and witty man.
Anachronisms: Brian Clough had a talk with the team in the tunnel facing the pitch. This was filmed on location at the real Elland Road stadium in Leeds. Visible was the East Stand with its two tiers and the North Stand- behind the goal - both sections were all seated. When Clough was at Leeds United the North Stand would have been completely terracing (ie standing space) and the East Stand would have had standing space at the bottom and seating at the top. It was obvious that the stadium was not a 1970s stadium
Incorrectly regarded as goofs: Brian Clough seems to resign on behalf of Peter Taylor in the film, but English law makes it impossible to resign on behalf of another person. However, the Derby board may have been unaware that Taylor's resignation letter was a forgery created by Clough, or may have simply not cared about its origin.
Factual errors: Brian Clough is shown to sign Colin Todd as a direct response to the 5-0 defeat at the hands of Leeds United in 1969. In reality, Todd didn't sign for Derby until 1971, at the start of the campaign that saw Derby win the league title.
Factual errors: As Derby are seen to rise up the table when they overtake Hull City, Hull's points total decreases. Hull have never had points deducted so this would be impossible.
The errors as stated elsewhere...
Factual errors: It is implied in the film that Brian Clough never managed Brighton & Hove Albion, but he did manage the club alongside Peter Taylor for most of the 1973-4 season. The team finished 19th this season.
Factual errors: In the montage of footage of actual matches showing Derby's rise to the Second Division championship in 1968-69, one of the games is against Everton. Everton haven't played in the Second Divison since 1953-54. The footage is from 1969-70 when both were in Division One. Everton won the league that season.
Factual errors: Derby County's rise up the Second Division table in 1968-69 is cleverly shown by superimposing a league table that clocks up points over a montage of footage of their games. However, the table almost always clocks up two points at a time. Derby drew a number of games over the season so the table should have risen by only a single point on occasion.
Factual errors: An action scene depicts the Leeds side conceding a goal to Luton Town and post match scenes that depict Luton players celebrating a victory with a caption saying Leeds 0 Luton 1. While the match is correctly portrayed as the game that precipitated the sacking of Brian Clough the actual result was a 1-1 draw.
Factual errors: The 3rd round F.A Cup tie between Leeds and Derby on the 27th of January 1968 depicted in the movie was played in Leeds, not in Derby, making the entire 'Brian cleans up the Baseball Ground' sequence fictional.
Factual errors: The 'snub' of Clough by Don Revie probably never happened as it has never been mentioned by Clough in any of his memoirs and Revie's son Duncan feels it would have been completely out of character for his father to do such a thing.
Factual errors: The commentator introduces Leeds as the League champions before the 27.01.68 game, but Manchester United were the reigning champions at the time.
Factual errors: The 27.01.68 game was won fairly by Leeds with goals by Jack Charlton and Peter Lorimer, not Clarke & a Lorimer penalty as the film claims.
Factual errors: The impression is given that Roy McFarland was injured and substituted in the 27.01.68 game when he wasn't and played the whole match.
Factual errors: The dive by Billy Bremner to gain the penalty in the 27.01.68 game never happened.
Anachronisms: Allan Clarke is named as a scorer in the 27.01.68 game but he didn't become a Leeds player until 1969.
Factual errors: The player described as Clarke in the 27.01.68 game wears 3 on his back while Clarke usually wore the number 8 when he eventually joined Leeds United
Anachronisms: Sam Longson says that Dave MacKay has "broken more bones than Evel the Knievel." It's unlikely in 1968 Longson would have known about him as Evel Knievel only became popular in Britain in the mid 1970s.
Revealing mistakes: When Derby are celebrating winning the Second Division title, the crowd are chanting "Glory, Glory Leeds United".
Factual errors: A game against Leeds is described as being four days before the 1973 European Cup semi final in Turin versus Juventus. Derby actually played Arsenal on that particular Saturday. The events shown in that game are completely false and notice that no score for that game is shown.
Factual errors: The commentator says that Derby deposed Leeds as League Champions in 1972, but Arsenal were the title holders before Derby.
Factual errors: The tie against Leeds shows Derby being so badly fouled by the Leeds players they have to field reserves against Juventus. While Derby did suffer some injuries in the tie against Leeds that year, it actually came before their quarter-final match against Spartak Trnava, which Derby still won despite missing some key players. Moreover, the injuries were not as serious as implied in the film, and all the injured players had recovered by the time of the eventual 3-1 defeat by Juventus, which was with a full-strength Derby squad.
Factual errors: After being beaten by the Italians, Clough blames the defeat on Leeds. In reality Clough felt that Juventus somehow influenced the referee to favour their side and afterwards berated not Leeds, but Juventus.
Factual errors: Dave Mackay is named on the team sheet for the fictional game against Leeds prior to the Juventus game in 1973 and is the only Derby player not to support Clough's reinstatement as manager. In reality Mackay had left Derby County in 1971. Alan Hinton is also named as in the team for the Leeds game, but he was injured at the time.
Factual errors: When Clough is insulting the Leeds players about their style of play they don't respond, but in truth they did defend themselves against his accusations.
Factual errors: Clough is shown signing Duncan Mackenzie after the Charity shield game, but Duncan was signed before the season started and played in the game as a substitute.
Factual errors: When Billy Bremner was punished after his sending off in the Charity Shield he was represented by Maurice Lindley, not Brian Clough. Kevin Keegan who was also at the hearing said that Bremner, who is shown as belligerently unrepentant in the film apologized to him and was close to tears after the sending off
Factual errors: After his sacking, Clough and Revie appeared on a Yorkshire TV Calendar special 'Goodbye Mr Clough'. Revie's participation was not a surprise to Clough as the movie claims. The depiction of it in 'The Damned United' bears only a passing resemblance to reality with the writers inventing most of what was shown on screen. Most notably, the 27.01.68 'snub' was not mentioned by Clough.
Factual errors: Brian Clough is shown smoking in the film. His family maintain that he never took up the habit.
Errors made by characters (possibly deliberate errors by the filmmakers): Duncan McKenzie is depicted as an idiot in "The Damned United' when in reality he was - and still is - an articulate and witty man.
Anachronisms: Brian Clough had a talk with the team in the tunnel facing the pitch. This was filmed on location at the real Elland Road stadium in Leeds. Visible was the East Stand with its two tiers and the North Stand- behind the goal - both sections were all seated. When Clough was at Leeds United the North Stand would have been completely terracing (ie standing space) and the East Stand would have had standing space at the bottom and seating at the top. It was obvious that the stadium was not a 1970s stadium
Incorrectly regarded as goofs: Brian Clough seems to resign on behalf of Peter Taylor in the film, but English law makes it impossible to resign on behalf of another person. However, the Derby board may have been unaware that Taylor's resignation letter was a forgery created by Clough, or may have simply not cared about its origin.
Factual errors: Brian Clough is shown to sign Colin Todd as a direct response to the 5-0 defeat at the hands of Leeds United in 1969. In reality, Todd didn't sign for Derby until 1971, at the start of the campaign that saw Derby win the league title.
Factual errors: As Derby are seen to rise up the table when they overtake Hull City, Hull's points total decreases. Hull have never had points deducted so this would be impossible.
zeb said:
loltolhurst said:
zeb said:
...but....he was very arrogant, would have a made a lousy employee, was bigotted, a bully and ultimately a broken alcoholic by the time of his last match.
agreed but I'd rather have people with extreme personality than a pc droid. hence why i like jose too. yes he could be bigotted but at the same time forest had the first black player to play for england so he was not pc yes, bigotted no.Peter Tayor was definitly a great man. Shame clough got injured. I can see why the fa dared not employ him though!
I think jose good too, the sooner he's back in english football the better
MG511 said:
Eric Mc said:
The media have long since given up telling the truth.
All they are interested in now as a "story".
FFS, it was a film based on a fictional book, not a documentary. The Damned United is not a factual book, it's a work of fiction, it even says so on the cover!All they are interested in now as a "story".
Radio Times said:
The Damned United
Highlight 4 stars!
Sunday 05 June
10:00pm - 11:35pm
BBC2
Director Tom Hooper gleefully re-creates the hairy, fag-smoking, pre-Premiership days of English club football in telling the story of manager Brian Clough's unhappy 44-day tenure at Leeds United in 1974.
Michael Sheen follows up Frost/Nixon with another pitch-perfect performance, showing how the arrogant, outspoken, grudge-fuelled Clough tried to take on the club, its players, fans and revered former manager Don Revie (a well-cast Colm Meaney).
In adapting David Peace's dense novel, Peter Morgan (The Queen) lightens the tone and (mercifully) keeps the footballing action to a minimum, focusing on what happens in the dugout, the boardroom and behind the weatherbeaten façade of Elland Road.
This slice of recent British history might not rival the death of Princess Diana, but Morgan is a master at creating drama out of mundane detail and, with Timothy Spall providing welcome respite from the bombast as Clough's right-hand man, Peter Taylor, this is a stirring, tragicomic portrait of one of football's greatest characters.
Followed by........Highlight 4 stars!
Sunday 05 June
10:00pm - 11:35pm
BBC2
Director Tom Hooper gleefully re-creates the hairy, fag-smoking, pre-Premiership days of English club football in telling the story of manager Brian Clough's unhappy 44-day tenure at Leeds United in 1974.
Michael Sheen follows up Frost/Nixon with another pitch-perfect performance, showing how the arrogant, outspoken, grudge-fuelled Clough tried to take on the club, its players, fans and revered former manager Don Revie (a well-cast Colm Meaney).
In adapting David Peace's dense novel, Peter Morgan (The Queen) lightens the tone and (mercifully) keeps the footballing action to a minimum, focusing on what happens in the dugout, the boardroom and behind the weatherbeaten façade of Elland Road.
This slice of recent British history might not rival the death of Princess Diana, but Morgan is a master at creating drama out of mundane detail and, with Timothy Spall providing welcome respite from the bombast as Clough's right-hand man, Peter Taylor, this is a stirring, tragicomic portrait of one of football's greatest characters.
Radio Times said:
Brian Clough: The Greatest Manager England Never Had?
Sunday 05 June
11:35pm - 12:35am
BBC2
It's a name that still sparks debate, but Brian Clough is widely considered to be the best football manager the English national side never had and one of the best English managers the game has ever seen.
He was a charismatic, outspoken and often controversial man, and this frank documentary tells the story of a career that included heady days with Derby County, unprecedented European success with Nottingham Forest and a notorious 44-day tenure as Leeds United boss, fictionalised in the novel and film The Damned United. Sir Michael Parkinson and Martin O'Neill are among those who remember "Cloughie".
Sunday 05 June
11:35pm - 12:35am
BBC2
It's a name that still sparks debate, but Brian Clough is widely considered to be the best football manager the English national side never had and one of the best English managers the game has ever seen.
He was a charismatic, outspoken and often controversial man, and this frank documentary tells the story of a career that included heady days with Derby County, unprecedented European success with Nottingham Forest and a notorious 44-day tenure as Leeds United boss, fictionalised in the novel and film The Damned United. Sir Michael Parkinson and Martin O'Neill are among those who remember "Cloughie".
Gassing Station | TV, Film, Video Streaming & Radio | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff