another abuse gang

[Mr2Mike]

Alpinestars said:

Where did I say that?

Where did you say what?

Alpinestars said:

Why do you have a problem with them being described as British?

I don't have a problem with it, but it's irrelevant. It doesn't change the ethnicity or culture of the perpetrators, and I'm sure it won't make the victims feel any better. It does seem important to you though, why is that?

[Alpinestars]

Mr2Mike said:

Alpinestars said:

Where did I say that?

Where did you say what?

Alpinestars said:

Why do you have a problem with them being described as British?

I don't have a problem with it, but it's irrelevant. It doesn't change the ethnicity or culture of the perpetrators, and I'm sure it won't make the victims feel any better. It does seem important to you though, why is that?

Geez, I can see this is going to be a long conversation. So it's somehow important that their parents/parents parents in some cases, originate from Pakistan, and they are born into being Muslims, but you want to ignore the fact that they have spent their whole life in Britain?

They are, Pakistani, Muslim, Britains. If the first two nouns apply, the third one applies equally.

The premise of your agrument appears to be that "they do it over there", which is pretty easily debunked with some facts about incidences of sexual abuse. Britain still has one of the highest rates in the world. And the most common type, is type 2, the perpetrators of which are exlusively not of Pakistani origin.

The discussion has nothing to do with making victims feel better. Victims of any sexual abuse are abused by pariahs - irrespective or nationality, race, religion etc. This is about people like you feeling better by blaming "them" and not being able to accept the fact than many of them are as British as they are Pakistani and Muslim.

[andymc]

Can you explain why they are over represented AS? Before you lambast me I'm aware every demographic has an issue

[WinstonWolf]

Alpinestars said:

Mr2Mike said:

Alpinestars said:

Where did I say that?

Where did you say what?

Alpinestars said:

Why do you have a problem with them being described as British?

I don't have a problem with it, but it's irrelevant. It doesn't change the ethnicity or culture of the perpetrators, and I'm sure it won't make the victims feel any better. It does seem important to you though, why is that?

Geez, I can see this is going to be a long conversation. So it's somehow important that their parents/parents parents in some cases, originate from Pakistan, and they are born into being Muslims, but you want to ignore the fact that they have spent their whole life in Britain?

They are, Pakistani, Muslim, Britains. If the first two nouns apply, the third one applies equally.

The premise of your agrument appears to be that "they do it over there", which is pretty easily debunked with some facts about incidences of sexual abuse. Britain still has one of the highest rates in the world. And the most common type, is type 2, the perpetrators of which are exlusively not of Pakistani origin.

The discussion has nothing to do with making victims feel better. Victims of any sexual abuse are abused by pariahs - irrespective or nationality, race, religion etc. This is about people like you feeling better by blaming "them" and not being able to accept the fact than many of them are as British as they are Pakistani and Muslim.

BOOM. You're always making excuses for/trying to deflect when the subject of these particular gangs comes up.

There is a cultural problem, the sooner it's acknowledged the better. Us honkies don't put up with it, if you're a nonce you're outcast, no exceptions.

[monthefish]

MrNoisy said:

Wow, 84% of all gang grooming offences in the UK as a whole? The Asian community as only a fraction of yhe UK population carrying out 84% of them? What is that extrapolated over the UK adult population? - A helluva lot percent I’d imagine?

Absolute Kudos to the author of that report, took real bravery. Let’s hope this educational piece gets widely briefed to the target communities and this helps to prevent these atrocities any more.

Indeed, and let's hope people - like those represented here by Aplinestars - don't manage to derail such action via smokescreening.

[anonymous-user]

WinstonWolf said:

BOOM. You're always making excuses for/trying to deflect when the subject of these particular gangs comes up.

There is a cultural problem, the sooner it's acknowledged the better. Us honkies don't put up with it, if you're a nonce you're outcast, no exceptions.

With regard to the last sentence - If that is the case, then it's not been that way for long.

Just look at Barry Bennell, the catholic church, Jimmy Savile and even the latest charity thing. People covering st up. White people.

That doesn't decry from the stshow that is this particular type of abuse crime.

[Digga]

Alpinestars said:

The premise of your agrument appears to be that "they do it over there", which is pretty easily debunked with some facts about incidences of sexual abuse. Britain still has one of the highest rates in the world. And the most common type, is type 2, the perpetrators of which are exlusively not of Pakistani origin.

Sorry, but that needs addressing. Britain is one of the best nations at combating sexual abuse, as opposed to either doing it half-heartedly, or simply failing to even acknowledge it's an issue.

A lack of registered cases does not necessarily equate, by any means, to a lack of a problem. Indeed, there are some parts of the world, where the abused has more to fear from the law and society then the abusers.

[WinstonWolf]

desolate said:

WinstonWolf said:

BOOM. You're always making excuses for/trying to deflect when the subject of these particular gangs comes up.

There is a cultural problem, the sooner it's acknowledged the better. Us honkies don't put up with it, if you're a nonce you're outcast, no exceptions.

With regard to the last sentence - If that is the case, then it's not been that way for long.

Just look at Barry Bennell, the catholic church, Jimmy Savile and even the latest charity thing. People covering st up. White people.

That doesn't decry from the stshow that is this particular type of abuse crime.

The difference is you won't find a single person making excuses for them or deflecting, they were all s.

[Alpinestars]

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

[WinstonWolf]

Alpinestars said:

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

Which demographic carry out the majority of gang abuse? Pakistanis. Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

[Digga]

Alpinestars said:

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

I think (and hope) that what we're seeing, culturally, is a shift toward zero tolerance of abuse. No individual our group can expect to escape justice, no group can expect to operate with impunity.

The changes in the way the world communicates - stories shared on social media, as well as evidence being gathered from criminal's computers, 'phones and other mobile devices - certainly seem to have enhanced the flow of information and to have assisted authorities in gathering evidence and prosecuting offenders.

[Alpinestars]

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

Which demographic carry out the majority of gang abuse? Pakistanis. Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

Highlights my point beautifully. They are British. Unless you have facts to disprove that, in which case I'm all ears.

I love your "us English" comment. Do a bit of reading of the news, even the last week or so. Enlighten and eductate yourself.

[Alpinestars]

Digga said:

Alpinestars said:

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

I think (and hope) that what we're seeing, culturally, is a shift toward zero tolerance of abuse. No individual our group can expect to escape justice, no group can expect to operate with impunity.

The changes in the way the world communicates - stories shared on social media, as well as evidence being gathered from criminal's computers, 'phones and other mobile devices - certainly seem to have enhanced the flow of information and to have assisted authorities in gathering evidence and prosecuting offenders.

Zero tolerance is exactly how it should be. There's absolutely no place for exploitation or abuse of people, sexually or otherwise, by groups or individuals.

Edited to add, it's interesting to see how some of the "white knights" on here were much more tolerant of examples like the President's Club.

Edited by Alpinestars on Tuesday 27th February 16:54

[WinstonWolf]

Alpinestars said:

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

Which demographic carry out the majority of gang abuse? Pakistanis. Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

Highlights my point beautifully. They are British. Unless you have facts to disprove that, in which case I'm all ears.

I love your "us English" comment. Do a bit of reading of the news, even the last week or so. Enlighten and eductate yourself.

They're not English, calling them British is an attempt to deflect who the culprits in these cases are. I used the term "us English" quite deliberately to make a point.

[andymc]

Alpinestars said:

Digga said:

Alpinestars said:

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

I think (and hope) that what we're seeing, culturally, is a shift toward zero tolerance of abuse. No individual our group can expect to escape justice, no group can expect to operate with impunity.

The changes in the way the world communicates - stories shared on social media, as well as evidence being gathered from criminal's computers, 'phones and other mobile devices - certainly seem to have enhanced the flow of information and to have assisted authorities in gathering evidence and prosecuting offenders.

Zero tolerance is exactly how it should be. There's absolutely no place for exploitation or abuse of people, sexually or otherwise, by groups or individuals.

Edited to add, it's interesting to see how some of the "white knights" on here were much more tolerant of examples like the President's Club.

Edited by Alpinestars on Tuesday 27th February 16:54

did they drug them and sodomise them as well

[Europa1]

WinstonWolf said:

Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

And what do the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish want?

[WinstonWolf]

Europa1 said:

WinstonWolf said:

Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

And what do the Scots, Welsh and Northern Irish want?

Probably not lumping in with a culture that has a problem with nonces?

Whataboutism has allowed the the problem to fester, it needs to be acknowledged before anything can be done about it.

Trying to deflect away from the usual culprits of this type of crime by calling them 'British' does nothing to help.

[Alpinestars]

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

Which demographic carry out the majority of gang abuse? Pakistanis. Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

Highlights my point beautifully. They are British. Unless you have facts to disprove that, in which case I'm all ears.

I love your "us English" comment. Do a bit of reading of the news, even the last week or so. Enlighten and eductate yourself.

They're not English, calling them British is an attempt to deflect who the culprits in these cases are. I used the term "us English" quite deliberately to make a point.

But you accept they are British?

And "nonces" like Burnell, Falder and Warboys are English?

[WinstonWolf]

Alpinestars said:

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

WinstonWolf said:

Alpinestars said:

If I were deflecting, I wouldn't keep putting facts out and resurrecting this thread!

Some of you can't accept the facts. And you want to use certain words selectively. I'll repeat the facts. Gang grooming is mainly carried out by Pakistani, Muslims, British people. If you don't like that statement, refute it with facts.

The vast majority of sexual abuse cases in Britain are type 2. Non Pakistani Brits, exclusively carry out that type of abuse. If you don't like the statement, refute it with facts.

@Digga, I agree that reporting and detection are a major contributor to rates.

Which demographic carry out the majority of gang abuse? Pakistanis. Why are you calling them British? Us English don't want lumping in with nonces thanks.

Highlights my point beautifully. They are British. Unless you have facts to disprove that, in which case I'm all ears.

I love your "us English" comment. Do a bit of reading of the news, even the last week or so. Enlighten and eductate yourself.

They're not English, calling them British is an attempt to deflect who the culprits in these cases are. I used the term "us English" quite deliberately to make a point.

But you accept they are British?

And "nonces" like Burnell, Falder and Warboys are English?

There you go again...

[Alpinestars]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

No, you're right. The Newcastle review ;

Operation Sanctuary, which was launched in 2014, resulted in 112 offenders being jailed for a total of almost 500 years for abuse carried out against more than 270 victims.

But a shocking report has revealed that the actual number of those targeted was at least 700, as gangs of men from a range of backgrounds plied victims with drugs before raping and forcing them into prostitution.

According to the review, the abusers were mainly "not white but came from a diverse range of backgrounds including Pakistani, Bangladeshi, Indian, Iranian, Iraqi, Kurdish, Turkish, Albanian and Eastern European".