Meanwhile in Poland
Discussion
Breadvan72 said:
Only to a conspiracy theorist. The threat to the rule of law in Poland is readily apparent.
The EU is playing a very dangerous game though. At this point in time, pushing Poland out and, potentially others such as Hungary (WRT refugee quotas) is not too bright, in the very big picture of things.There could well be unintended consequences. It is not difficult to anticipate some; for example scenarios involving Russia or departure of a Eurozone economy paving the way, setting a framework, by which a more key Euro nation might then chose to depart, with dire financial implications.
Digga said:
Breadvan72 said:
Only to a conspiracy theorist. The threat to the rule of law in Poland is readily apparent.
The EU is playing a very dangerous game though. At this point in time, pushing Poland out and, potentially others such as Hungary (WRT refugee quotas) is not too bright, in the very big picture of things.There could well be unintended consequences. It is not difficult to anticipate some; for example scenarios involving Russia or departure of a Eurozone economy paving the way, setting a framework, by which a more key Euro nation might then chose to depart, with dire financial implications.
Breadvan72 said:
The EU has started steps that could lead to part or full suspension of Poland from EU member rights. Reasons: threat to the rule of law.
http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-17-5367_en...
They only have themselves to blame !!! short memories it's not that long they were http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-17-5367_en...
under USSR rule , so the jump into EUSSR membership and wonder why it goes tits up..
gulible fools .....
powerstroke said:
They only have themselves to blame !!! short memories it's not that long they were
under USSR rule , so the jump into EUSSR membership and wonder why it goes tits up..
gulible fools .....
But I keep getting told we should remain in this harmonious union,so that's Italy,Spain,Greece monetarily knackered and Poland, Hungary and Austria in the bad boys corner.under USSR rule , so the jump into EUSSR membership and wonder why it goes tits up..
gulible fools .....
Sign us back up,sounds such a positive club...
grumbledoak said:
As I understand it, the outgoing party tried to ram the Constitutional Court with pro-EU judges, and the new one is trying to remove them. No surprise the EU doesn't like this. But, calling this a "threat to the rule of law"?
The Government is seeking to place the judiciary under executive control, which is precisely a threat to the rule of law. Breadvan72 said:
The Government is seeking to place the judiciary under executive control, which is precisely a threat to the rule of law.
Sure, but it could be argued the last lot were, de facto, executive puppets. I'm not saying the present situation is good, but surely you can see there's been a blind eye turned when it suited (i.e was pro-EU) Brussels?Digga said:
Breadvan72 said:
The Government is seeking to place the judiciary under executive control, which is precisely a threat to the rule of law.
Sure, but it could be argued the last lot were, de facto, executive puppets. I'm not saying the present situation is good, but surely you can see there's been a blind eye turned when it suited (i.e was pro-EU) Brussels?Breadvan72 said:
Digga said:
Breadvan72 said:
The Government is seeking to place the judiciary under executive control, which is precisely a threat to the rule of law.
Sure, but it could be argued the last lot were, de facto, executive puppets. I'm not saying the present situation is good, but surely you can see there's been a blind eye turned when it suited (i.e was pro-EU) Brussels?
Poland makes it a crime to use the phrase 'Polish death camps' and to suggest that the country assisted Nazi crimes.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/pol...
Have never understood states that try and 'protect' history in such a way - for example the anti holocaust laws we see in Europe - those who lie about historical events and propagate bats
t crazy conspiracy theories should be challenged, mocked, ridiculed etc but not criminalised.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/pol...
Have never understood states that try and 'protect' history in such a way - for example the anti holocaust laws we see in Europe - those who lie about historical events and propagate bats
t crazy conspiracy theories should be challenged, mocked, ridiculed etc but not criminalised.Polish Death Camps is a very touchy subject and rightfully so because there weren't any Polish death camps. There were German death camps in German occupied Poland but definitely no Polish run ones.
You probably think I'm being facetious now because of course everyone knows it was the Germans running them and mostly it is just lazy journalism that uses the term Polish death camp but it's subtle changes like this which help shift perceptions and distort the historical record.
Does that seem unlikely? My parents are involved in recording the history of the Poles who settled in the UK after the war and very occasionally they get the opportunity for little media appearances. Whilst preparing for one such appearance it turned out the young BBC researcher they were dealing with genuinely believed that Poland was part of the Axis powers in the war.
With that sort of ignorance evident inside our national broadcastor I would suggest it's not worth taking the risk and any examples of this kind of lazy journalism need to be called out immediately. Whether a law is required is possibly a step too far but it is certainly a reaction to how prevalent this problem is and how seriously it's taken in Poland.
You probably think I'm being facetious now because of course everyone knows it was the Germans running them and mostly it is just lazy journalism that uses the term Polish death camp but it's subtle changes like this which help shift perceptions and distort the historical record.
Does that seem unlikely? My parents are involved in recording the history of the Poles who settled in the UK after the war and very occasionally they get the opportunity for little media appearances. Whilst preparing for one such appearance it turned out the young BBC researcher they were dealing with genuinely believed that Poland was part of the Axis powers in the war.
With that sort of ignorance evident inside our national broadcastor I would suggest it's not worth taking the risk and any examples of this kind of lazy journalism need to be called out immediately. Whether a law is required is possibly a step too far but it is certainly a reaction to how prevalent this problem is and how seriously it's taken in Poland.
jurbie said:
Polish Death Camps is a very touchy subject and rightfully so because there weren't any Polish death camps. There were German death camps in German occupied Poland but definitely no Polish run ones.
You probably think I'm being facetious now because of course everyone knows it was the Germans running them and mostly it is just lazy journalism that uses the term Polish death camp but it's subtle changes like this which help shift perceptions and distort the historical record.
Does that seem unlikely? My parents are involved in recording the history of the Poles who settled in the UK after the war and very occasionally they get the opportunity for little media appearances. Whilst preparing for one such appearance it turned out the young BBC researcher they were dealing with genuinely believed that Poland was part of the Axis powers in the war.
With that sort of ignorance evident inside our national broadcastor I would suggest it's not worth taking the risk and any examples of this kind of lazy journalism need to be called out immediately. Whether a law is required is possibly a step too far but it is certainly a reaction to how prevalent this problem is and how seriously it's taken in Poland.
Agree 100%. Well said.You probably think I'm being facetious now because of course everyone knows it was the Germans running them and mostly it is just lazy journalism that uses the term Polish death camp but it's subtle changes like this which help shift perceptions and distort the historical record.
Does that seem unlikely? My parents are involved in recording the history of the Poles who settled in the UK after the war and very occasionally they get the opportunity for little media appearances. Whilst preparing for one such appearance it turned out the young BBC researcher they were dealing with genuinely believed that Poland was part of the Axis powers in the war.
With that sort of ignorance evident inside our national broadcastor I would suggest it's not worth taking the risk and any examples of this kind of lazy journalism need to be called out immediately. Whether a law is required is possibly a step too far but it is certainly a reaction to how prevalent this problem is and how seriously it's taken in Poland.
IIRC there are more Poles listed amongst the Righteous Gentiles in Israel than people of any other nationality. Since the time of the Polish King Casimir the Great, Jews had enjoyed greater rights and protection in Poland than elsewhere in Europe, where Jews were often subjected to discrimination; but there were of course undercurrents of anti semitism in parts of the Polish population. Thus some Poles collaborated with the Nazis, and some took active steps to assist with the Holocaust, but many other Poles joined the Partisans and some sheltered Jews and helped them escape. The Nazis murdered a lot of Polish POWs and captured Partisans.
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