The 1975 EEC referendum
Discussion
FiF said:
jakesmith said:
I respect your knowledge on the subject being nothing more than a layperson myself. I would give far more time and credence to your opinions, given your demonstrated understanding of the topic, than that of people harping on about principles, sovereignty, foreigners, and being mislead in 1975. If the debate was being held or lead at an intellectual and well informed level I would be a lot more comfortable. My problem with a 'leave' vote is that it appears to be ill-informed, tribalistic, and as such does not seem to be worth disturbing quite a stable status quo for.
Well thanks for that. Problem is that this was an opportunity to have the discussion once and for all, make an informed decision and move on. The way the debate has been conducted has made that impossible, both sides are guilty, the Remain argument is just as tribalistic and ill informed, indeed the tone has been set by the Prime Minister's antics. Furthermore honestly I don't believe a Remain vote represents anything like a vote for status quo except in the very very short term.
jakesmith said:
Can you explain what and how you think will change if there is a remain vote? Really interested to hear this opinion in detail.
I was hinting at the welcoming on board of Turkey, via open borders, almost immediately post referendum.I'm sure you will agree this will introduce quite a spanner in the works of any status quo.
danllama said:
jakesmith said:
Can you explain what and how you think will change if there is a remain vote? Really interested to hear this opinion in detail.
I was hinting at the welcoming on board of Turkey, via open borders, almost immediately post referendum.I'm sure you will agree this will introduce quite a spanner in the works of any status quo.
fblm said:
It's interesting both my parents and the in laws voted in back before we were born and all of them say they were conned and are now going to vote out. Although FIL is wavering because he read there would be 3 million job losses! 
Oh the irony, now it's team Brexit that's pulling the con job. fblm said:
It's interesting both my parents and the in laws voted in back before we were born and all of them say they were conned and are now going to vote out. Although FIL is wavering because he read there would be 3 million job losses!
It was a con alright . Have a read of this http://www.harvard-digital.co.uk/euro/pamphlet.htm...
"This page contains the text of the Government produce pamphlet advocating a vote to stay in the "European Community (Common Market)" in the 1975 British Referendum on continuing British membership."
Sod all to do with what the electorate were told , its what they were not . Starting of course with the main aim (political union, a Federal Europe) of the treaty of Rome.
jakesmith said:
55palfers said:
Me too!
This point is of limited relevance. Whilst we hear of the stupidity of some European bureaucracy and the laws that annoy us, in the tabloid press, great majority of legislation in the UK is not of European origin. We still have our own parliaments, elections, laws. It is nowhere near the sort of forced economic union that those joining the Euro experience, that we are free from. Pan Pan Pan said:
Do you seriously believe the UK has the same influence over the way the EU is run, and in what direction it will go as Germany (or even France for heavens sake)???
Who's fault might that be?We shouldn't the UK have a bigger (if not the biggest) influence in the EU? Our economies and influence in the world is or at least should be on a par with that of France or Germany. Why should the UK feel it is being pushed around by big bad European bullies? Is it some sort of post Imperial inferiority complex at work?
I sometimes think that Britain's "why is everybody kicking us around" attitude frankly pathetic. The country should just roll its sleeves up and get into the ring with the rest of them and fight its causes properly instead of whingeing from the corner saying "poor us, nobody loves us".
227bhp said:
RYH64E said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Eric Mc said:
And not forgetting the state of the UK as an economy and what it had just come through back in 1975.
Yes. it was in a dire position then, with James Callaghan having to go cap in hand to the IMF for a bailout. Possibly one of the UK`s lowest points since WW2?Our economy isn't failing in the same way as that of Greece, we don't have high rates of unemployment as is the case in Spain and Italy, our economy isn't in recession, we're not part of Schengen and don't have open borders, we're not accepting millions of refugees as is the case in Germany, we're not tied to the euro and still have control over our currency... We're part of the EU and we're doing well, within the EU. What's the problem?
Life is not good in the UK, we are now a poor country.
The UK is the 5th largest economy in the world, according to some measurements. That is definitely not "poor".
What amazes me is that so many people are determined to do this country down in order to justify their viewpoints.
It seems that they constantly want to convince themselves that "this country is s
t" and blame the sttiness on anybody and everybody else.
What amazes me is that so many people are determined to do this country down in order to justify their viewpoints.
It seems that they constantly want to convince themselves that "this country is s
t" and blame the sttiness on anybody and everybody else. Eric Mc said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Do you seriously believe the UK has the same influence over the way the EU is run, and in what direction it will go as Germany (or even France for heavens sake)???
Who's fault might that be?We shouldn't the UK have a bigger (if not the biggest) influence in the EU? Our economies and influence in the world is or at least should be on a par with that of France or Germany. Why should the UK feel it is being pushed around by big bad European bullies? Is it some sort of post Imperial inferiority complex at work?
I sometimes think that Britain's "why is everybody kicking us around" attitude frankly pathetic. The country should just roll its sleeves up and get into the ring with the rest of them and fight its causes properly instead of whingeing from the corner saying "poor us, nobody loves us".
Anyway, thanks to our differing perspective we're unlikely to hold much sway with the rest of them.
Edited by Esseesse on Thursday 26th May 11:09
Eric Mc said:
The UK is the 5th largest economy in the world, according to some measurements. That is definitely not "poor".
What amazes me is that so many people are determined to do this country down in order to justify their viewpoints.
It seems that they constantly want to convince themselves that "this country is st" and blame the sttiness on anybody and everybody else.
You generally don't think that there there is an ever growing malaise in this country?What amazes me is that so many people are determined to do this country down in order to justify their viewpoints.
It seems that they constantly want to convince themselves that "this country is s
t" and blame the sttiness on anybody and everybody else. Certain parts now resemble a third-world slum.
The "rights" of the feckless are now enshrined in law but their responsibilities are as non-existent as their work ethic.
The "political activists" have clicked on the idea that they don't actually have to work for a living if they make whatever outrages them the most the sole reason for their existence. Meanwhile, those that actually do work & take a modicum of pride in that are left to try & to keep things running & the tax coffers full.
I'm sick of hearing about the amount of resource spunked up the wall on an hourly basis by those who contribute little or nothing to society, all in the name of the latest politically expedient b
ks. That goes from left to right on the spectrum. It is s
t. And blaming it on anyone & everyone else? Well I've been too busy working since the age of 16 to be able to attend a diversity group of protest about the poll tax or whatever else was happening that moment as an alternative to real work.
I stumbled across this whole festering attitude when I moved up to secondary school. It's has only gotten worse since then. If you genuinely think it's all roses in the garden, well good for you I suppose. I too know people manage to avoid most of the s
te floating around & in the grand scheme of things, I'm very, very lucky. But a gold at Chelsea it ain't.
)Eric Mc said:
Pan Pan Pan said:
Do you seriously believe the UK has the same influence over the way the EU is run, and in what direction it will go as Germany (or even France for heavens sake)???
Who's fault might that be?We shouldn't the UK have a bigger (if not the biggest) influence in the EU? Our economies and influence in the world is or at least should be on a par with that of France or Germany. Why should the UK feel it is being pushed around by big bad European bullies? Is it some sort of post Imperial inferiority complex at work?
I sometimes think that Britain's "why is everybody kicking us around" attitude frankly pathetic. The country should just roll its sleeves up and get into the ring with the rest of them and fight its causes properly instead of whingeing from the corner saying "poor us, nobody loves us".
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