How do we think EU negotiations will go?
Discussion
digimeistter said:
I keep hearing this from remoaners, I fail to see the logic. Please explain.
Because the tories are in power because they’re good for the economy. If the economy takes a dip because of brexit they don’t have the main reason for voting for them any more.Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
cookie118 said:
Because the tories are in power because they’re good for the economy. If the economy takes a dip because of brexit they don’t have the main reason for voting for them any more.
Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
+1Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
You can already hear it in the disgruntled brexiteers who phone in to tell Nigel on LBC that May is making a real hash of it and we haven't told the EU to shove it enough. Sure enough they will resent the Tories hugely in due course.
I do wonder if the tories have actually looked at what is most toxic - actually brexiting, or reversexiting. There can't be much in it! I think we are safe from zimmer-riots in the streets, so what have they really got to lose?
///ajd said:
+1
You can already hear it in the disgruntled brexiteers who phone in to tell Nigel on LBC that May is making a real hash of it and we haven't told the EU to shove it enough. Sure enough they will resent the Tories hugely in due course.
I do wonder if the tories have actually looked at what is most toxic - actually brexiting, or reversexiting. There can't be much in it! I think we are safe from zimmer-riots in the streets, so what have they really got to lose?
Keep clutching at those straws if it helps you to get through the day!You can already hear it in the disgruntled brexiteers who phone in to tell Nigel on LBC that May is making a real hash of it and we haven't told the EU to shove it enough. Sure enough they will resent the Tories hugely in due course.
I do wonder if the tories have actually looked at what is most toxic - actually brexiting, or reversexiting. There can't be much in it! I think we are safe from zimmer-riots in the streets, so what have they really got to lose?
My favourite thing today has been:
UK: "Confident that no border resolution will not stop talks."
Ireland and EU: "No border resolution will halt talks."
How did such a complete shower of incompetents get into power. I'm struggling to see progress anywhere.
I fear we are going to be severely diminished as a nation once all this has been done, and the laughable fact is that it was entirely avoidable.
UK: "Confident that no border resolution will not stop talks."
Ireland and EU: "No border resolution will halt talks."
How did such a complete shower of incompetents get into power. I'm struggling to see progress anywhere.
I fear we are going to be severely diminished as a nation once all this has been done, and the laughable fact is that it was entirely avoidable.
cookie118 said:
Because the tories are in power because they’re good for the economy. If the economy takes a dip because of brexit they don’t have the main reason for voting for them any more.
Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
Thank you, however Corbyn has never clearly stated his opinion on leaving. Historically, he hated the EU. He and His party of trough seeking idiots have swerved direct questions on the subject at every opportunity whilst serving up sound bites for the masses on austerity and how badly negotiations are going ( which they are, but are we surprised?)Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
I have many friends who are ardent Labour supporters but are also firmly behind Brexit, so I'm not so sure
cookie118 said:
Because the tories are in power because they’re good for the economy. If the economy takes a dip because of brexit they don’t have the main reason for voting for them any more.
Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
The Tories put forward a Manifesto that punished the elderly. It means tested WFA, it abolished the triple lock and it did something esoteric to with IHT and care home fees. Can't remember precise details.Broadly speaking though, I think the reason people will vote for labour is the same as why they voted for brexit and why trump got in.
‘People’ don’t see the current system working for them. It doesn’t matter if it’s the best things will be, they don’t think it’s working for them so when something represents the current situation they vote against it, regardless of evidence that it will be worse economically. At the moment the tories represent the ‘current situation’, and people simply don’t think they are working for them. If the economy takes a dip due to brexit it might tip the balance enough for Corbyn et al to get in.
Corbyn promised the opposite.
What was the breakdown of elderly voting on June 8th?
Eddie Strohacker said:
jsf said:
Mark is well worth listening to. He doesn't always gets things right, you cant expect him to get all the politics on the ground spot on being based in the USA, but his thought process on what could happen is usually sound.
I miss the good old days, seems like much more than a month ago I was getting pelters for citing a German on Brexit. He can''t possibly understand anything, he's not British! Just as long as I know we're all into foreign commentators now...
Glaswegian brought up by his grandma on an estate, now one of the most respected political economists in the world with a teaching post at Brown University (Ivy League) in the USA. My comment was he sometimes gets the minute detail wrong that comes from not being in the country 24/7. He is a USA citizen now, but you still think him Scottish from his accent.
I am amazed you haven't bothered to watch the videos i have linked to that feature him. He is well worth listening to. I suspect you would enjoy the full video i linked to above, its very entertaining.
digimeistter said:
Thank you, however Corbyn has never clearly stated his opinion on leaving. Historically, he hated the EU. He and His party of trough seeking idiots have swerved direct questions on the subject at every opportunity whilst serving up sound bites for the masses on austerity and how badly negotiations are going ( which they are, but are we surprised?)
I have many friends who are ardent Labour supporters but are also firmly behind Brexit, so I'm not so sure
I don’t think it matters tbh.I have many friends who are ardent Labour supporters but are also firmly behind Brexit, so I'm not so sure
The tories have been in power for quite a while now. Blaming the country’s finances on labour won’t wash with the electorate any more.
Their ‘thing’ is being good at the economy, however the brexit direction (that they have set) seems to be pushing us towards (at the least) a short term dip. The combination of ‘austerity’ and an economy that isn’t performing well (and due to factors that can be pinned to them) won’t do well at election time.
I’m not sure that it will ‘guarantee’ a Corbyn government. But I think the tories are in trouble.
The last snap election probably woke the Tories up to the fact they cant take the electorate for granted.
The manifesto was written when May was riding high and had just spanked Labour in the local elections, Corbyn was a joke, so they piled on a very toxic policy play thinking they had it in the bag. Huge miscalculation.
Then add in a pathetic leader performance who couldn't engage with the public and couldn't handle the pressure.
It was the worst campaign in my election memory.
They wont make that mistake again. Not a chance May will be in post after Brexit.
The manifesto was written when May was riding high and had just spanked Labour in the local elections, Corbyn was a joke, so they piled on a very toxic policy play thinking they had it in the bag. Huge miscalculation.
Then add in a pathetic leader performance who couldn't engage with the public and couldn't handle the pressure.
It was the worst campaign in my election memory.
They wont make that mistake again. Not a chance May will be in post after Brexit.
Eddie Strohacker said:
What is your obsession with straw about? Straw this, straw that. Are you some kind of horse?
http://bfy.tw/4Xmhhttp://bfy.tw/1aA3
HTH
sidicks said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
What is your obsession with straw about? Straw this, straw that. Are you some kind of horse?
http://bfy.tw/4Xmhhttp://bfy.tw/1aA3
HTH
jsf said:
The last snap election probably woke the Tories up to the fact they cant take the electorate for granted.
The manifesto was written when May was riding high and had just spanked Labour in the local elections, Corbyn was a joke, so they piled on a very toxic policy play thinking they had it in the bag. Huge miscalculation.
Then add in a pathetic leader performance who couldn't engage with the public and couldn't handle the pressure.
It was the worst campaign in my election memory.
They wont make that mistake again. Not a chance May will be in post after Brexit.
I agree with that-the tories will be on it for the next election with a new leader who won’t have to carry the can as much for brexit and any negative effects.The manifesto was written when May was riding high and had just spanked Labour in the local elections, Corbyn was a joke, so they piled on a very toxic policy play thinking they had it in the bag. Huge miscalculation.
Then add in a pathetic leader performance who couldn't engage with the public and couldn't handle the pressure.
It was the worst campaign in my election memory.
They wont make that mistake again. Not a chance May will be in post after Brexit.
I’m still not sure it will be enough though. I think the combination of austerity and an economy dipping would be too much for voters to vote for.
The curveball in this is if labour decide to switch leaders to someone less controversial.
sidicks said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
What is your obsession with straw about? Straw this, straw that. Are you some kind of horse?
http://bfy.tw/4Xmhhttp://bfy.tw/1aA3
HTH
sidicks said:
Eddie Strohacker said:
I only ask because you spray it round like confetti to the extent you can't possibly know what it actually means. And JSF, I'm well aware of who Mark Blyth is and note you chose to purposely overlook the point. Business as usual.
You're wrong again.HTH.
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