Jeremy Corbyn Vol. 2
Discussion
mx5nut said:
Other than the near constant attacks from the mainstream press and all over social media (including this very thread) every time he opens his mouth, of course.
Rovinghawk said:
mx5nut said:
Other than the near constant attacks from the mainstream press and all over social media (including this very thread) every time he opens his mouth, of course.
edh said:
Mark Benson said:
edh said:
Corbyn's laudable statement about removing Finance from their dominant position in the UK and making them the servants of productive sectors of the economy.
Is 5.4% of the country's total government tax receipt not productive enough for you?Or is it just the kneejerk populist soundbites you like?
5.4% is a "kneejerk soundbite" TBH.. tells you nothing about "productive"
A large part of the FIRE sector exists to extract rents from productive enterprise and from wages. It doesn't "produce", it can only skim fees. Finance has a place, but not the one it currently occupies. Carillion et al are the creations of the wonderful finance sector and prime examples of their malign effects.
While I don't disagree about the function of a lot of the financial industry, the UK would be screwed without it, in terms of tax take.
A strong, profitable (in terms of tax take) finance sector is hard to win and easy to lose and Corbyn would be disastrous in that respect.
Clearly he doesn't care, he's driven by ideology, not pragmatism. But the financial sector will not change, they'll just up sticks and move, meanwhile the Carillions of this world will not disappear (well, maybe int he UK as the Glorious Leader takes everything into state ownership, but you get my point). Trying to change something that's wrong by hounding it out of existence helps no one but the ideologue.
Genuine question to the trolls.
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
nikaiyo2 said:
Genuine question to the trolls.
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
Godwin!If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
They'd have to be quite old to have had meetings with the Gestapo and, no, that would obviously disqualify them.
ETA: Corbyn should, of course be disqualified, even if he was just a naïve, thick leftie. (he is thick - that is beyond dispute)
Edited by Zod on Wednesday 21st February 17:30
nikaiyo2 said:
Genuine question to the trolls.
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
More alt-Right nonsense. The Gestapo? How ridiculous!!! Jeremy Corbyn was In Derbyshire on the day Czech spy claimed they metIf the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
In House Of Commons, his diary shows. It was a Saturday and his mother
had died the day before. Right-wing media and ultra-Brexiteer Tory
MP's try to discredit him and end up with egg on their faces and folk
feeling sorry for him and disgusted at the liars and smears, it's as if the right want to discredit themselves and hand power to Corbyn.
http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/jeremy-corby...
edh said:
The Czech spy stuff is just laughable, as is today's Times headline, which is a hyperbolic scare story drawn from Corbyn's laudable statement about removing Finance from their dominant position in the UK and making them the servants of productive sectors of the economy.
Would it be replaced by owt, or should there not be any sector in such a dominant position?nikaiyo2 said:
Genuine question to the trolls.
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
Well i guees being inept and friendly with terrorists didn’t do it, so i douby being an informant/source would either if it were true.If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
Surely, letting files be released, and showing it is nothing but a witchhunt would be good for him and bad for the conservatives.
Unless of course.....
Don’t labour supporters want to know who they are voting for?
Momentum running around to sign up new labour party members to win a vote is a taste of what he and tney are about.
Do or say anything to get into power.
I think labour voters would vote stalin himself in just to have labour win.
If it happens they’ll get exactly what tney deserve.
Unfortunately we’ll all get it.
Edited by philv on Wednesday 21st February 18:07
Edited by philv on Wednesday 21st February 18:10
JagLover said:
Frybywire said:
Loving how scared the fear papers are of Corbyn if they are trying to pin this spy guff on him.
To be fair I doubt he was a paid informer......he would be willing to sell this country out for free. In the here and now, the nice man is going to fix the bad stuff and give away free stuff and someone else is paying. That's good right?
AstonZagato said:
JagLover said:
Frybywire said:
Loving how scared the fear papers are of Corbyn if they are trying to pin this spy guff on him.
To be fair I doubt he was a paid informer......he would be willing to sell this country out for free. In the here and now, the nice man is going to fix the bad stuff and give away free stuff and someone else is paying. That's good right?
Frybywire said:
Loving how scared the fear papers are of Corbyn if they are trying to pin this spy guff on him.
you're missing the point here - putting a hand on someone's knee of making an inappropriate comment to a youngster are not as (potentially) serious as this allegation. If there is nothing at all in it (and although the actual day one of the meetings was alledged to have taken place is BS it is only right and proper that this be investigated - thoroughly! LDN said:
That was proven to be true though. It was Branson that lied.
Carry on.
What was actually ‘proven’?Carry on.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41036937
The article suggest the train was crowded, not overcrowded, and there were seats available. Just not necessarily 2 together, which was certainly not the impression Corbyn tried to portray.
Edited by sidicks on Wednesday 21st February 19:07
nikaiyo2 said:
Genuine question to the trolls.
If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
So a Labour politician should be able to identify who is a spy before the security services?If the meetings with Czech intelligence are proven to be true would you happy for JC to remain leader of the Labour party and potentially become PM?
Would it be ok from the other side if Tory MPs had had clandestine meetings with the Gestapo (I cant think of an organization as evil as the StB from a right wing government since, certainly not from a European or western nation) ?
turbobloke said:
sgtBerbatov said:
turbobloke said:
mx5nut said:
techiedave said:
I'm surprised but not amazed at how little scrutiny Corbyn comes up against.
Other than the near constant attacks from the mainstream press and all over social media (including this very thread) every time he opens his mouth, of course.
Tell me how that election to deliver a proper Brexit without any questioning or bulls
t went again?Apart from that, a disaster for May personally. She really cannot expect to fight the next election as leader. May is, however, far above Corbyn as PM material - this only serves to emphasise how utterly dire Corbyn is.
In passing, Merkel has escaped too much for too long; how many ministerial posts has she given away after how long to scrape together a government of sorts? Good job she took no joy from May's result...
Fittster said:
If only Merkel could have found a party with links to terrorists and then given them a billion pounds to buy their votes.
Is that what happened? Amazing how Sinn Fein haven't kicked off that their main enemy has been given such a large amount of dosh...Any chance you could respond to the posts I put up as per your request showing McDonnell admitting he's a revolutionary Marxist? After all, you were very keen to point out how the claims weren't true, and he was merely like Thatcher in wanting to shake things up...
Mark Benson said:
edh said:
Mark Benson said:
edh said:
Corbyn's laudable statement about removing Finance from their dominant position in the UK and making them the servants of productive sectors of the economy.
Is 5.4% of the country's total government tax receipt not productive enough for you?Or is it just the kneejerk populist soundbites you like?
5.4% is a "kneejerk soundbite" TBH.. tells you nothing about "productive"
A large part of the FIRE sector exists to extract rents from productive enterprise and from wages. It doesn't "produce", it can only skim fees. Finance has a place, but not the one it currently occupies. Carillion et al are the creations of the wonderful finance sector and prime examples of their malign effects.
While I don't disagree about the function of a lot of the financial industry, the UK would be screwed without it, in terms of tax take.
A strong, profitable (in terms of tax take) finance sector is hard to win and easy to lose and Corbyn would be disastrous in that respect.
Clearly he doesn't care, he's driven by ideology, not pragmatism. But the financial sector will not change, they'll just up sticks and move, meanwhile the Carillions of this world will not disappear (well, maybe int he UK as the Glorious Leader takes everything into state ownership, but you get my point). Trying to change something that's wrong by hounding it out of existence helps no one but the ideologue.
Maybe we'll find out...
I saw an interview with Michael Hudson where he argued that Adam Smith's definition of a "free market" was one free from rent seeking and financial usury (I'm paraphrasing). I don't know how accurate he was, but it made sense to me. Look no further than RBS GRG (and the shameful way that the bank and the FCA have tried to cover this up). Pick any number of banking scandals where firms have acted, often criminally, against the interests of businesses and individuals.
I've had this discussion before on NP&E about financialisation and its undesirable consequences. This doesn't mean an end to UK finance, but meaningful curbs to its activity. If the undesireable stuff slopes off to Dubai or Singapore, then that's great. Without the overbearing pressure of "finance", maybe UK business will be able to concentrate on innovation and productivity, not financial engineering? That's what replaces the tax take & that's what will improve people's wages.
Corbyn is the ultimate accidental leader, our very own Chauncy Gardiner - albeit an ideological one, as you say. Although he has proved to be pretty pragmatic over Brexit so far though, and has steered the party through an outright rebellion by the majority of his PLP, a GE where the party machine was acting against him, and a Brexit split among MP's party members and Labour voters. He's done much better than I expected TBH - I thought he was an interim leader at best, and would likely be replaced in 2018 after the left had consolidated its hold on the party.
I voted for him, as the other candidates were hugely uninspiring. I had hopes for Burnham but he was disappointing. I thought the 2017 manifesto was an admirable step forwards. The dangerous pinko policies appear to be getting wider acceptance. Rail nationalisation is very popular. I read an FT piece on water privatisation the other day setting out quite clearly how affordable it was, with annual profits covering 10 year gilts more than 2x. The Tories are increasingly trying to fight on Labour's turf - do they think they will gain much ground with another review of student fees and HE?
If you haven't seen it yet, check out AFNeil's interview with Steve Baker on the Czech spy stuff...he is by far the best interviewer on TV and savages all the parties (and therefore gets accused of bias by everyone). Mind you, I haven't seen Corbyn produce definitive proof that he's stopped beating his wife, so I think there are still "serious questions to answer"..
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