Theresa May

[RedTrident]

Corbyn is making Corbyn look good.
Corbyn is making May look bad
May is making May look like a disaster
Osborne meanwhile appears to be having the time of his life.

[mx-6]

confused_buyer said:

Derek Smith said:

I doubt his lead will remain once May's replacement takes over.

I have a feeling Corbyn will end up having enough rope to hang himself.

Let's face it, a half decent Labour leader could probably have won against May and a half decent Tory one could have hammered Corbyn.

We have two very average candidates for the job of PM up against one another in a sort of bizarre who can be least rubbish competition.

I'm not so sure, Corbyn's already had ample rope and a lot of negative press. As opposition leader he can rant about the Tories and propose populist and unaffordable policies, it's only the hard choices of being in power than will really expose his politics.

I think a more centrist Blairite type Labour leader would have done better at winning wavering Conservative voters but might not have mobilised the youth vote in the same way...

[confused_buyer]

mx-6 said:

I'm not so sure, Corbyn's already had ample rope and a lot of negative press. As opposition leader he can rant about the Tories and propose populist and unaffordable policies, it's only the hard choices of being in power than will really expose his politics.

It doesn't take much to tear Corbyn's policies apart. However, May and the Conservatives made absolutely no effort to do so and simply let him get away with it all. He wasn't challenged in any way. Where he should have been exposed they just ran around shouting "strong and stable" and mentioning Fox Hunting. Completely useless.

[Murph7355]

jjlynn27 said:

I get this feeling that he's quite enjoying himself.

I agree with you. However he comes across as a spiteful little boy.

He was wholly wrong about his fateful predictions of what would happen on a Leave vote. And was one of the biggest mouthpieces on Project Fear. Now he gets to spout off without any challenge despite his credibility being utterly blown.

And he'll be receiving a nice stipend no doubt on our ticket, let alone his gold plated pension.

He has no grace or class. We all moan about divisiveness but he is the archetypal example of how it takes two sides on that front, and that Remain advocates like him seem hell bent on proving that they are in a majority on that front at least.

[lenny007]

mx-6 said:

I'm not so sure, Corbyn's already had ample rope and a lot of negative press. As opposition leader he can rant about the Tories and propose populist and unaffordable policies, it's only the hard choices of being in power than will really expose his politics.

I'm also not sure - but about what Corbyn's next manifesto will contain.

He threw the (free) kitchen sink at the populace in order to buy their vote and still couldn't win. Is there anything left for him to bribe the voters with?

[mx-6]

confused_buyer said:

It doesn't take much to tear Corbyn's policies apart.

Maybe so, but can you put that into a simple soundbite that's easy for the wider electorate to understand? Like "for the many not the few", and Corbyn's message which basically boils down to, let's tax the rich and spend more money on public services. People tend to switch off a bit when one starts to go on about the ins and outs of a structural budget deficit and laffer curve taxation theory...

[Derek Smith]

lenny007 said:

mx-6 said:

I'm not so sure, Corbyn's already had ample rope and a lot of negative press. As opposition leader he can rant about the Tories and propose populist and unaffordable policies, it's only the hard choices of being in power than will really expose his politics.

I'm also not sure - but about what Corbyn's next manifesto will contain.

He threw the (free) kitchen sink at the populace in order to buy their vote and still couldn't win. Is there anything left for him to bribe the voters with?

I think if we are talking about enough rope and hanging, the person for whom this is most appropriate would be the subject of this thread. She's blown it big time. She had everything she needed, wanted more and got less.

There is no need to worry about any threat from Corbyn. May's replacement will either be much more voteworthy - not that difficult one would assume - or else so poor that Corby would be preferable.

[Penelope Stopit]

I don't understand why the UK and America have such poor politicians at the head of their parties, I never thought I would see the day when........

[spaximus]

It has been a perfect storm for May and one where she should have done better, much better but the Tories have a history of getting out of touch because they are doing the right thing for the country long term.

Corbyn is not thinking that at all, he wants power pure and simple as do his Marxist friends.

He mobilised the youth vote by promising free everything. He mobilised the old who feared being cold and poorer. He mobilised many with the bad news on the NHS.

And then the fire gave him the biggest opportunity to pull everything together. Poor people dying, cuts to the police and fire service (hero's don't you know) Buildings clad just because they annoyed the rich, even if it wasn't true and now it turns out the richest (tory) council has wrapped a building in a petrol soaked rag all to save money due to austerity that was all the Tories doing.

Whatever my views on him, his team have made the best job of every opportunity and to night millions watching Glastonbury will get to hear him spout off just before he introduces a rapper who will no doubt rap about the fire.

Let us hope the Tories get behind her start fighting back and expose Corbyn and break this stranglehold that he has. He is a dangerous individual who will ruin this country if he gets in for years.

[Jockman]

spaximus said:

It has been a perfect storm for May and one where she should have done better, much better but the Tories have a history of getting out of touch because they are doing the right thing for the country long term.

Corbyn is not thinking that at all, he wants power pure and simple as do his Marxist friends.

He mobilised the youth vote by promising free everything. He mobilised the old who feared being cold and poorer. He mobilised many with the bad news on the NHS.

And then the fire gave him the biggest opportunity to pull everything together. Poor people dying, cuts to the police and fire service (hero's don't you know) Buildings clad just because they annoyed the rich, even if it wasn't true and now it turns out the richest (tory) council has wrapped a building in a petrol soaked rag all to save money due to austerity that was all the Tories doing.

Whatever my views on him, his team have made the best job of every opportunity and to night millions watching Glastonbury will get to hear him spout off just before he introduces a rapper who will no doubt rap about the fire.

Let us hope the Tories get behind her start fighting back and expose Corbyn and break this stranglehold that he has. He is a dangerous individual who will ruin this country if he gets in for years.

A surprising post but very eloquent nonetheless.

[Derek Smith]

spaximus said:

It has been a perfect storm for May and one where she should have done better, much better but the Tories have a history of getting out of touch because they are doing the right thing for the country long term.

Corbyn is not thinking that at all, he wants power pure and simple as do his Marxist friends.

He mobilised the youth vote by promising free everything. He mobilised the old who feared being cold and poorer. He mobilised many with the bad news on the NHS.

And then the fire gave him the biggest opportunity to pull everything together. Poor people dying, cuts to the police and fire service (hero's don't you know) Buildings clad just because they annoyed the rich, even if it wasn't true and now it turns out the richest (tory) council has wrapped a building in a petrol soaked rag all to save money due to austerity that was all the Tories doing.

Whatever my views on him, his team have made the best job of every opportunity and to night millions watching Glastonbury will get to hear him spout off just before he introduces a rapper who will no doubt rap about the fire.

Let us hope the Tories get behind her start fighting back and expose Corbyn and break this stranglehold that he has. He is a dangerous individual who will ruin this country if he gets in for years.

The perfect storm for May was one of her own creation. The one thing every PM needs is sound judgement. She, patently, doesn’t have it.

She lost the election. The electorate seem to be reacting to her dreadful decision-making.

I would agree that the tory party do get out of touch with the electorate, or at least have done under Cameron and her. They certainly got out of touch with a whole generation when they increased the uni fees. These kids aren’t stupid. They read, and probably read deeper into the situation than most people. They know that the increase in fees costs taxpayers money so it is no wonder they are resentful. I am as well come to that. It’s one thing to save money, it is the exact opposite to waste it.

The reason Corbyn finds it so easy with the terrible fire is that it appears to be exactly what the occupants were complaining of for years. Poor people have, it seems, died because of cuts. The richest council, one that gave back circa £100 to each rate payer, now stands accused of putting the poor at risk.

His team would have had to have been as inept as May’s to make a hash of this opportunity. The only thing that could make this worse for May is if there are riots in cities and the police, FB and ambulance/NHS can’t cope. The police couldn’t cope before the massive reductions in funding. Little chance now.

The tories should not get behind someone who has shown a lack of judgement. They need to remove May and get someone with a bit of sense.

The people who will give the tories a majority are not those who vote tory every time, with no qualitative judgement. There is no need to get them onside. What group they need is the floating voter, the ones who assess the strengths and weaknesses of the options.

There’s no need to fear Corbyn, unless May remains for a while, makes a hash of brexit, hides, as is her wont when things get tough, if there are disturbances in cities, and is generally May. Corbyn lost against May. That’s nothing to add to anyone’s CV. David Milliband would have gained a majority, and his brother would have done better than Corbyn.

[Deptford Draylons]

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

Glad it was entertainment to you, but does seem to suggest you're easily amused.

I'm, indeed, easily amused by simple creatures. Kippers and 'i'm not a kipper but I worship Farage' alike. I'm also easily amused by dimwits who blame EU for all the ills of this world and want to give more power to the same govt that actually failed to enforce available legislation.

Would the chip on your shoulder and general Farage/Ukip tourettes be because you are an immigrant to the UK ?

I understand, based on your posts, that you need to read things few times before they register. Farage and especially the faithful, like yourself, provide cheap entertainment. I'm not sure that I can make this any simpler.

You lacked the intelligence to even take issue with the point I made about the month rule being utterly pointless. Rather than debate or or offer any counter point ,you did you normal thing that blights PH and every contribution to every thread you are on ,of just having a hissy fit and indulging in your almost therapy need to say 'Farage' in every post. Had you read anything I've said about Ukip and not being a voter, you'd probably conclude I'm not a fan, but then you don't really care about honesty, the Ukipper cry from you is just used to taint anyone's view you disagree with, but unable/unwilling to articulate why.

You sound obsessed by anything immigration and EU related and seem to irrationally react to it. I was wondering if that simply comes from you being an immigrant. You didn't answer.

Sometimes, repeating few times doesn't seem to be enough, so you take your time.
Once again, Farage and disciples are cheap entertainment, hence my wish for him, and in turn kippers, to return. I have more respect for openly kipper kippers than for 'I'm not a kipper but' lightweights.
As far as FMOL, it was explained to you countless of times, why economy by itself, is a pretty good regulator of people from EU staying here. As a holder of a British passport, my interest in immigration is exclusively from an economic standpoint. I want goods produces and services provided at the best, most competitive prices.
You, on the other hand, keep ranting how 'everyone' knows what's enforceable and what's not. The official data on immigration shows that you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. None whatsoever. Discussing subtleties of Art45 of TFEU, with someone like you, wouldn't be productive or entertaining.

Some people look at ons data and form their opinion. Some read express and breitbart headlines.

It was a very simple point of the effectiveness and implementation , or rather lack of, of the 3 month rule. Now you could have done as others did and try and debate a point. But no, we got your PH trade mark argumentative idiocy of trying to start an argument on a subject you now tell me you have no interest in discussing.

Before you inevitably reply upping your anger levels, maybe stop and wonder why on every thread you are on your contribution level totals just slinging abuse and posting stupid smilie things as answers. Have a think about it because it tends to come across as you acting at a low level of intelligence and mental health when you seem to have been prescribed PH as some kinda therapy as an argument clinic for your needs.

Your boring Farage tourettes is neither interesting, funny or accurate. As is telling me ( wrongly ) which paper I read and ( wrongly again )how I vote.
You come across as a very angry immigrant who rages at anyone who doesn't agree with you. Intolerant of people's views and lacking the intelligence to offer any counter.

[Derek Smith]

Deptford Draylons said:

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

jjlynn27 said:

Deptford Draylons said:

I suppose it is too much to expect this rant to stop sometime soon. Have you considered starting your own thread where you can have a go at each other as much as you'd like? It might be nice for those who want to discuss May to not have to sift through irrelevant tirades.

[Jockman]

Derek Smith said:

. David Milliband would have gained a majority, and his brother would have done better than Corbyn.

Agreed. The Unions thought otherwise.

[Tuna]

Derek Smith said:

The reason Corbyn finds it so easy with the terrible fire is that it appears to be exactly what the occupants were complaining of for years. Poor people have, it seems, died because of cuts. The richest council, one that gave back circa £100 to each rate payer, now stands accused of putting the poor at risk.

His team would have had to have been as inept as May’s to make a hash of this opportunity. The only thing that could make this worse for May is if there are riots in cities and the police, FB and ambulance/NHS can’t cope. The police couldn’t cope before the massive reductions in funding. Little chance now.

A couple of points. Corbyn has shown either terrible judgement or malicious intent in the past with his association with terrorist organisations. He has been a consistently poor performer in Prime Minister's Questions. His introduction of 'garden tax' was a painful land grab (literally) in the Labour Manifesto, and the repeat of it ("repossess the rich people's homes!") has been shocking.

Yet all of this has been given remarkably little attention by the media.

Compare that with Theresa May - she met with the exhausted and traumatised emergency teams at Grenfell and was pilloried for not meeting the residents. She met with the Finsbury community and was pilloried for not looking human enough. She scaled back the Queens Speech - completely to be expected with a minority government - and it was apparently the worst action ever.

There really seems to be a witch hunt mentality out there - both from the left wing and from those on the right wing who want to remain despite Article 50 and so on. I really don't think Corbyn has performed better, other than being an unthreatening old uncle who you don't mind turning up to family occasions (so long as no-one mentions the Jews).

The 'died because of cuts' is completely disingenuous - not least because no inquiry has yet identified who made what decision. More importantly though, the 'nasty council' had just spent something like £70,000 *per flat* to improve the accommodation, including reducing fuel bills. Within that huge budget, suggesting that making a choice between cladding was a savage cut rather than a perfectly normal choice that is made in any building project is questionable at best. It's clear that the wrong decision was made, but whether anyone was in a position to realise as much is completely open to question - note that there are councils around the country who also made the wrong decision and are having to re-evaluate their renovation schemes.

Again, certain parties are making Grenfell a political cause, when some basic respect would recognise that the 'nasty Tory' narrative is not helping victims and not helping the truth of the tragedy to be uncovered. If people are liable, then yes, they should be identified and punished appropriately. The remarkable thing though is that the media is being remarkably tolerant of people making some slanderous claims - when if it were the right wing doing so they'd be up in arms.

[///ajd]

pgh said:

Because they are unenforceable

Zero hours contract from dodgy employer? You can stay
Set up as a sole trader (with no intention of working)? That's fine

Even if we were to get people to leave after three months (at a significant cost in public sector time and energy) they can be straight back on the next £20 budget flight.

This was all discussed at length during the referendum campaign.

Surely if it was that simple, the remain campaign would have made hay with the three month rule? That they didn't, tells you all you need to know about it.

Amazing.

And what do you think will be different post brexit and new "controls"?

You are going to be one disappointed bunny I fear.

Do you think we won't have fruit pickers coming and staying?

What about tourists - shall we not let them in, in case "wrong uns" stay?

May could have rigourously enforced these rules at the home office, or set in place plans to do so. She didn't. Its almost as if its good for the economy this immigration.

And yet she is the queen of hard brexit. Pffft!

PS glad the "existing" deportation rules are still breaking news to well informed brexiteers who "knew exactly what they were voting for".

[Tuna]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

It's completely the wrong policy though (*cough* poll tax *cough*) as the value of your land does not reflect your personal wealth and ability to pay. So yes, it redistributes wealth by pricing people out of their own homes. Here in Cambridgeshire, according to Labour's policy document, the *average* home would ultimately see additional bills of around five grand a year. That's not fixing the BTL problem, it's making housing unaffordable to normal people.

Like the Tories' social care proposals, it was an astronomically poorly thought out policy in response to a genuine problem.

[hyphen]

Saw TM speak on the News early, she is still visibly shaken, confidence appears shattered, stumbling over her words.

Suspect she needs to step down sooner rather than later.

Gone from the Iron Lady to that old neighbour you check on to make sure she is ok when wandering the street randomly.

[PurpleMoonlight]

Latest May soundbite "fair and serious offer".

This woman it getting really annoying.

[greygoose]

Tuna said:

A couple of points. Corbyn has shown either terrible judgement or malicious intent in the past with his association with terrorist organisations. He has been a consistently poor performer in Prime Minister's Questions. His introduction of 'garden tax' was a painful land grab (literally) in the Labour Manifesto, and the repeat of it ("repossess the rich people's homes!") has been shocking.

Yet all of this has been given remarkably little attention by the media.

Really? The media have been on Corbyn's case since he was elected leader, it perhaps shows the declining influence of the press that despite the coverage of him he obtained so many votes.