Man killed because his cruise control wouldn't switch off!
Discussion
The Mad Monk said:
I think the sad truth is that the driver decided to commit suicide. He drove as fast as he could along the motorway, until he could find a stationery HGV. Being an exhibitionist he decided to call the authorities and pretend he couldn't stop. When he found a big lorry parked up he drove into the back of it.
Im half with you but I think the call was to try and make people think it was a fault with the car. Possibly a cultural thing and didn't want anyone to think he took his own life. Edited by Cotty on Tuesday 29th November 12:30
otolith said:
I also suspect that. He's in cruise, feet off the pedals. Decides to brake. Hits the wrong pedal. Panics. Just keeps it pinned to the floor and can't work out why the car isn't stopping, but won't take his foot off it because he thinks it's the only thing stopping the car accelerating any faster. That's why I think the first thing the police should tell someone in that situation is to take their feet off the pedals.
This, probably.It's a well known problem. In numerous cases where this has happened (see the Toyota case) the inputs reported by the car were that they had the foot hard on the throttle not the brake.
How tragic and very odd.
8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
don4l said:
otolith said:
The Mad Monk said:
deeen said:
sounds to me he just panicked and pressed harder and harder on the throttle, thinking it was the brake.
Are you serious?I don't believe it.
Bullett said:
otolith said:
I also suspect that. He's in cruise, feet off the pedals. Decides to brake. Hits the wrong pedal. Panics. Just keeps it pinned to the floor and can't work out why the car isn't stopping, but won't take his foot off it because he thinks it's the only thing stopping the car accelerating any faster. That's why I think the first thing the police should tell someone in that situation is to take their feet off the pedals.
This, probably.It's a well known problem. In numerous cases where this has happened (see the Toyota case) the inputs reported by the car were that they had the foot hard on the throttle not the brake.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC31538...
otolith said:
Bullett said:
otolith said:
I also suspect that. He's in cruise, feet off the pedals. Decides to brake. Hits the wrong pedal. Panics. Just keeps it pinned to the floor and can't work out why the car isn't stopping, but won't take his foot off it because he thinks it's the only thing stopping the car accelerating any faster. That's why I think the first thing the police should tell someone in that situation is to take their feet off the pedals.
This, probably.It's a well known problem. In numerous cases where this has happened (see the Toyota case) the inputs reported by the car were that they had the foot hard on the throttle not the brake.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC31538...
otolith said:
don4l said:
otolith said:
The Mad Monk said:
deeen said:
sounds to me he just panicked and pressed harder and harder on the throttle, thinking it was the brake.
Are you serious?I don't believe it.
croyde said:
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
I'd be very surprised if it could do it in any gear other than maybe 1st.Sheepshanks said:
They're pretty well all short duration incidents though - typically in a car park etc.
It's the same response, though - they mistake the accelerator for the brake, and their response to the resulting acceleration is to push it harder. It would be very unusual for somebody to go for 8 minutes doing that without realising what they'd done, but then how often does this happen? It's an unusual case.croyde said:
How tragic and very odd.
8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
Given the shorter travel of the brake pedal, I doubt pressing both pedals would unleash anything like the full power of the engine. I wouldn't like to pit brakes against engine in my car, outside an extreme emergency, as the brakes are astoundingly good and I think something would break, badly.8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
otolith said:
It's the same response, though - they mistake the accelerator for the brake, and their response to the resulting acceleration is to push it harder. It would be very unusual for somebody to go for 8 minutes doing that without realising what they'd done, but then how often does this happen? It's an unusual case.
Why dont cars have a combined single pedal where full down is fast as you like and full off is brakes lockedsaaby93 said:
Why dont cars have a combined single pedal where full down is fast as you like and full off is brakes locked
History, I suppose. Some EVs can work that way.
https://electrek.co/2016/09/06/gm-bolt-ev-one-peda...
Too many posts here for me to read through them all so if I'm repeating things already said I apologise.
To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
ffhard said:
Too many posts here for me to read through them all so if I'm repeating things already said I apologise.
To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
Bearing in mind what you say at the end, do you think it was a broken ring and was running on its own oil? To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
Because I think he just had his foot to the floor and was pegging it.
croyde said:
How tragic and very odd.
8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
It is more fun in A Fiat Panda when you go to accelerate and brake instead with a van up your bum 8 minutes to do something about it too.
I once drove a Ferrari on a track. The owner asked me to remove my right shoe as he said that as the pedals were close together it was possible to press both at the same time and the 500 odd bhp of the engine would easily overcome the brakes.
But that would have been a short sharp accident and it wasn't a Skoda.
ffhard said:
Too many posts here for me to read through them all so if I'm repeating things already said I apologise.
To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
So you recon a diesel engine can keep running on its own oil for 10 miles really it explode pretty quickly once its gone through its 5 liters of oil.To me it sounds like a typical diesel runaway scenario but nowhere seems to say if the car was diesel. But, if it was, then say a piston ring breaks, engine starts running on it's own oil, just accelerates and accelerates because the faster it goes the more oil it can draw up. OK, switch it off. No chance! All you're doing is cutting off the diesel supply but it's not running on that, it's running on it's own self-generated pressure fed supply. Pretty much the only thing you could do in that situation is brake like f### and put it into to neutral and let the engine explode, which it will!
OK, all the above is assuming the car WAS a diesel, which I don't know. But yet another reason to hate diesels!
Other than that regarding the pedal position sensor I can 100% guarantee you that regardless of what the cruise control may be doing the pedal position sensor is an independent reading on any car built since around 2005.In fact there are always two sensors as a double check on such a safety critical feature. Trust me, this is how I make my living so if the data says the trhottle pedal was held down then it was. But it could have been held down by a loose floor mat or such, no way of knowing that.
As various other have said the article make no sense whatsoever and I cant believe someone who is supposed to be a car enthusiast could possible mistake a acceleration pedal over a brake pedal for 10 or so minutes. Also why would he suddenly go from the middle lane into a parked truck in a layby within a split second where he had been going fine for the last few miles.
I recon elaborate suicide.
poo at Paul's said:
Bearing in mind what you say at the end, do you think it was a broken ring and was running on its own oil?
Because I think he just had his foot to the floor and was pegging it.
You can stop a runaway diesel, I have done it. The brakes will overcome the engine.Because I think he just had his foot to the floor and was pegging it.
It is also unlikely a turbo diesel engine would survive 8 minutes like that.
It is fairly obvious what happened was intentional, unless someone had tampered with the brakes.
otolith said:
It's the same response, though - they mistake the accelerator for the brake, and their response to the resulting acceleration is to push it harder. It would be very unusual for somebody to go for 8 minutes doing that without realising what they'd done, but then how often does this happen? It's an unusual case.
I can't say you're wrong, obviously, but this is a relatively young guy, apparently with a keen interest in cars - it strikes me as beyond unlikely that he could be such a degree of panic for 8 minutes. I'd be dubious at 10-15 seconds.Think about the Air France flight 447 - it crashed because one of the pilots stalled the plane; if he'd gone for a piss at the critical moment the plane would have flown on. For the whole incident he was pulling back on the stick as much as was possible, and nobody noticed until it was too late. This stuff happens when people get under stress.
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