FGM Parties

[del mar]

jjlynn27 said:

del mar said:

Are they unfit, or just culturally different from us are they bad parents ?

As for the children - is life in foster and care homes really better for them ?

Edited by del mar on Monday 27th February 17:14

Not sure if serious. Any parent that facilitates non-medical intervention on their kids is unfit to be a parent. Yes, they would most definitely be better off without them.

This needs to be viewed in context though.

The mother has been cut, her mother, her grandmother, her sisters etc, the parents do not do this do inflict pain on the child, for the sake of inflicting pain. They will view this as a right of passage into being a woman, something to be proud of, it is their tradition as Somali women.

Imagine removing two young girls from a loving family home, because their parents want them to go through a cultural tradition and dumping them in a children's home in another town to live with strangers in a serious of foster homes.

BAME children are far harder to be rehomed than white children.

I agree with you that any parent who wilfully harms their own child for the pure purpose of hurting them is unfit to be a parent, but there is no malice here. In a truly perverse way the parents probably think they are doing it out of love.

[del mar]

rscott said:

It's a mainly African issue - http://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2016/02/fema... and occurs pretty much equally amongst Christians and Muslims in those countries.

Eritrea & Ethiopia are majority Christian countries yet have the same or higher rates of FGM as neighbouring mainly Muslim states.

http://www.politifact.com/punditfact/statements/20... sets a very clear case for it being an African, rather than religious, issue.

I am not sure Mother Jones is that convinced - where did you even find that website ?

There is a very clear case for it being an African, rather than religious, issue only in Africa, they fail to account for its prevalence in Non African Countries;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prevalence_of_female...

Where it occurs in other countries it is always in the Muslim Community. I doubt many women in the;

Malay Muslim community in Singapore
Ismaili Shia Muslim community in India

Have ever been to let alone lived in Africa.

You have Muslims Religious leaders issuing Fatwas for and against FGM, yet people still see it as a purely African issue ?

[BlackLabel]

A doctor in the US city of Detroit has been charged with carrying out female genital mutilation (FGM) on young girls in what is believed to be the first case of its kind in the country. Prosecutors said Jumana Nagarwala had been performing the practice on girls aged between six and eight for 12 years. She was investigated after the authorities received a tip-off. If found guilty, she faces a maximum sentence of life inprison.

[MrBrightSi]

If she receives the full life term, it'll prove again America really doesn't suffer this kind of idiocy.
In England you get the good old country witchdoctor in the centre pages of the Metro.

[rscott]

MrBrightSi said:

If she receives the full life term, it'll prove again America really doesn't suffer this kind of idiocy.
In England you get the good old country witchdoctor in the centre pages of the Metro.

Utter nonsense. There have been attempted prosecutions here which failed through lack of evidence and more cases which the CPS didn't run with due to lack of a reasonable chance of a successful prosecution.

Basic problem is that it seems to be almost impossible to gather evidence of who carried it out.

[BlackLabel]

rscott said:

MrBrightSi said:

If she receives the full life term, it'll prove again America really doesn't suffer this kind of idiocy.
In England you get the good old country witchdoctor in the centre pages of the Metro.

Utter nonsense. There have been attempted prosecutions here which failed through lack of evidence and more cases which the CPS didn't run with due to lack of a reasonable chance of a successful prosecution.

Basic problem is that it seems to be almost impossible to gather evidence of who carried it out.

You can't really blame people for being distrustful of the official narrative - just look at the recent past when it's come to forced marriages, honour violence and grooming. We were given similar explanations back then - they said it was difficult to prosecute, hard to gather evidence etc. Yet the truth was there just wasn't the will to tackle such sensitive issues because people were scared of being called a racist.

Victims of so-called honour violence are “still not being believed” by police who fear being labelled “racist” when investigating their allegations, according to a landmark report on the issue.

Forced marriage still happens in the UK because police are scared of being called racist for fighting honour abuse

Prof Alexis Jay's harrowing report revealed the abuse of more than 1,400 children - mainly by men of Pakistani heritage - and it criticised councillors for "downplaying" the issue of race, and "avoiding public discussion" on the topic. The report also made it clear that this nervousness around ethnicity was a top-down sentiment.

Edited by BlackLabel on Friday 14th April 14:50

[Rich_W]

BlackLabel said:

rscott said:

MrBrightSi said:

If she receives the full life term, it'll prove again America really doesn't suffer this kind of idiocy.
In England you get the good old country witchdoctor in the centre pages of the Metro.

Utter nonsense. There have been attempted prosecutions here which failed through lack of evidence and more cases which the CPS didn't run with due to lack of a reasonable chance of a successful prosecution.

Basic problem is that it seems to be almost impossible to gather evidence of who carried it out.

You can't really blame people for being distrustful of the official narrative - just look at the recent past when it's come to forced marriages, honour violence and grooming. We were given similar explanations back then - they said it was difficult to prosecute, hard to gather evidence etc. Yet the truth was there just wasn't the will to tackle such sensitive issues because people were scared of being called a racist.

Victims of so-called honour violence are “still not being believed” by police who fear being labelled “racist” when investigating their allegations, according to a landmark report on the issue.

Forced marriage still happens in the UK because police are scared of being called racist for fighting honour abuse

Prof Alexis Jay's harrowing report revealed the abuse of more than 1,400 children - mainly by men of Pakistani heritage - and it criticised councillors for "downplaying" the issue of race, and "avoiding public discussion" on the topic. The report also made it clear that this nervousness around ethnicity was a top-down sentiment.

Edited by BlackLabel on Friday 14th April 14:50

Tommy Robinson went to see those accused of being in ANOTHER rape gang as they were going into court.

NSFW Swearing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ogQ8OEJIZU


He may not always be right, but I suspect he is on this!

Their barrister at the end is a fking disgrace!

[rscott]

Rich_W said:

Tommy Robinson went to see those accused of being in ANOTHER rape gang as they were going into court.

NSFW Swearing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ogQ8OEJIZU


He may not always be right, but I suspect he is on this!

Their barrister at the end is a fking disgrace!

I see one convicted criminal desperately trying to make a bunch of disgusting individuals react and fight back at him.

Not sure what relevance that video has to this thread though?

[Rich_W]

rscott said:

I see one convicted criminal desperately trying to make a bunch of disgusting individuals react and fight back at him.

Not sure what relevance that video has to this thread though?

Previous poster mentioned the rape gangs that weren't investigated because authorities didn't want to be seen to be "racist." That's the link


RE Mr Robinson (yes I know not his real name) Whilst I agree it's correct he was jailed for Mortgage fraud. (Wiki says 18 months) I don't really have a problem with him antagonising ANYONE involved in sex crimes. Particularly those against children.

Bottom line is that under Islam, women are seen as second class citizens. Unacceptable in our modern 2017 free society!

Hence FGM, hence the rape gangs that seem to be a common problem (no idea on true numbers, but its enough of a thing to be well known) amongst a percentage of the Muslim community. Until Islam addresses and invokes equality for women. These things WILL continue

[rscott]

Rich_W said:

rscott said:

I see one convicted criminal desperately trying to make a bunch of disgusting individuals react and fight back at him.

Not sure what relevance that video has to this thread though?

Previous poster mentioned the rape gangs that weren't investigated because authorities didn't want to be seen to be "racist." That's the link


RE Mr Robinson (yes I know not his real name) Whilst I agree it's correct he was jailed for Mortgage fraud. (Wiki says 18 months) I don't really have a problem with him antagonising ANYONE involved in sex crimes. Particularly those against children.

Bottom line is that under Islam, women are seen as second class citizens. Unacceptable in our modern 2017 free society!

Hence FGM, hence the rape gangs that seem to be a common problem (no idea on true numbers, but its enough of a thing to be well known) amongst a percentage of the Muslim community. Until Islam addresses and invokes equality for women. These things WILL continue

I was referring to his convictions for assaulting an off duty police officer and for domestic violence toward his girlfriend.

West Midlands police have pretty clear policies on how they deal with FGM, in both the Muslim and African communities it occurs in. They've been very public on the number of historical cases discovered and the fact that they are unable to prove when the mutilation occurred, let alone where or by whom. They can't get strong enough evidence to satisfy the CPS, let a lone a judge & jury.

It's not just an issue with some Muslims though - it is also carried out by Christians from some parts of Africa. Blaming it all on one faith (as you've done in your post) doesn't help resolve anything.

It needs a combination of educating all that it's an evil, needless act and persuading those who may have sufficient evidence to support a prosecution to cooperate with the authorities.

[del mar]

I call it fake news.

FGM is purely an African thing remember ......

She doesn't live in Africa
She doesn't look African
She doesn't cut Africans

cant be a real story

[del mar]

Pinched from the Diane Abott thread

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/diane-abott-...

Even the great woman herself is calling for checks...

I cant wait to see who she puts on the list for being checked.

[rscott]

del mar said:

Pinched from the Diane Abott thread

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/diane-abott-...

Even the great woman herself is calling for checks...

I cant wait to see who she puts on the list for being checked.

That was 3 years ago - the committee mentioned in the article concluded last year that mandatory checks on all girls wasn't appropriate, rather that individually targeted checks were.

[del mar]

Apologies- I should have realised that the Diane thread was not necessarily full of upto date stories, just photos of her !!

[del mar]

Apologies- I should have realised that the Diane thread was not necessarily full of upto date stories, just photos of her !!

[BlackLabel]

"New York Times refuses to use term 'female genital mutilation' for being 'culturally loaded'"

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/n...

[BlackLabel]

And yet not a single prosecution.


"NHS attended to 9,000 FGM cases in England last year, report reveals"

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jul/05/nh...

"The NHS in England recorded 5,391 new cases of female genital mutilation (FGM) in the past year, data reveals.
Almost half involved women and girls living in London, NHS Digital found."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40491311

[rscott]

BlackLabel said:

And yet not a single prosecution.


"NHS attended to 9,000 FGM cases in England last year, report reveals"

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jul/05/nh...

"The NHS in England recorded 5,391 new cases of female genital mutilation (FGM) in the past year, data reveals.
Almost half involved women and girls living in London, NHS Digital found."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40491311

Most of which, according to that article,didn't happen in the UK, so couldn't be prosecuted anyway.

[Gecko1978]

rscott said:

BlackLabel said:

And yet not a single prosecution.


"NHS attended to 9,000 FGM cases in England last year, report reveals"

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jul/05/nh...

"The NHS in England recorded 5,391 new cases of female genital mutilation (FGM) in the past year, data reveals.
Almost half involved women and girls living in London, NHS Digital found."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40491311

Most of which, according to that article,didn't happen in the UK, so couldn't be prosecuted anyway.

If the girl is under 18 can we not prosecute the parents

[rscott]

Gecko1978 said:

rscott said:

BlackLabel said:

And yet not a single prosecution.


"NHS attended to 9,000 FGM cases in England last year, report reveals"

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2017/jul/05/nh...

"The NHS in England recorded 5,391 new cases of female genital mutilation (FGM) in the past year, data reveals.
Almost half involved women and girls living in London, NHS Digital found."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-40491311

Most of which, according to that article,didn't happen in the UK, so couldn't be prosecuted anyway.

If the girl is under 18 can we not prosecute the parents

Presumably they'd need evidence of the parent's involvement too. Given in most likely happened overseas, that's going to be virtually impossible to get.

According to that report, most cases were discovered in maternity/obstetrics departments, so the victims are almost certainly over 18 now.